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Mount tires on Split Lock Ring Wheels - near Mooresville, NC


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Im in Mooresville, NC. I so far cannot find anyone around here to remove and remount tires on my 1931 Auburn, split lock ring rims. Im almost willing to buy some tire irons and try myself, but it rather someone experienced with tires do it and check it for balance. Does anyone know anyone near Mootesville, NC that can do this? Also is,there anyone around here that can true these wheels also? 

Thanks

James C

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Usually tire shops that work on truck tires will take these on. They use a cage to contain any mishaps. This is one project best left to professionals. I once worked with a man who had a split ring fly off and hit him in the head. He had lots of issues but was lucky to live through the experience. Good luck. Zeke

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You need a large flat blade screwdriver and a package of shim shingles a few cups of coffee and an hour of free time. NO TIRE IRONS! The death rate of tire changing deaths is grossly over exaggerated. Find a proper chrome shop for your lock rings. 

 

Bob

Edited by 1937hd45 (see edit history)
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I agree, you are not looking for a tire shop you are looking for a truck tire shop.  

 

There will probably be chipped paint too (you have to tell them it is ok if paint goes to hell).  

 

Make sure all the casing, tube, and flap are talec-ed to allow the tube to slip in the casing (I generally drop the tube and the flap into a plastic bag and then "shake" - Johnson's Baby Powder works well.   You can get the rings off easily enough.   Make sure nothing sticky, no stickers, and nothing sharp, 

 

Make a wooden platform for the underside of the wheel hub to raise the hub up further and allow the uninflated tire to be just off the ground (you need clearance so there is no the pressure on the lock ring).  Then break bead of tire off the lock ring (usually you can do via some walking and jumping on the tire.  And then use a big srewdriver (or 2 or 3 over diameter of tire once you get started) on the tang - tire spoons are the wrong tool for a lockring type wheel.  

 

To get a tire then sit the wheel on your platform and install your tire.  When you get to the lockring, I just stick one end in and wearing my gym shoes walk the ring into the grove.

 

Here is where you need to truck tire store - inflate the tire in a cage (if the tire blows off the lock ring during inflation you can get hurt) - my grandfather always talked of a fellow dying at their rent-a-car dealership via putting a lockring through his scull. 

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Remember to clock the valve stem, lock ring split, and tire makers logo before inflating. Nothing looks dumber that mismatched wheel & tire components. It may take a few tries to get the knockoffs to match all around. Bob 

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A local car restoration shop can do them, they will probably will not be nicked up or scratched as bad, and they should be comfortable doing them. They can be very dangerous if you don't have any brains..........with experience, and I probably have done more than 100........they are not difficult, just work. 

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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6 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said:

Remember to clock the valve stem, lock ring split, and tire makers logo before inflating. Nothing looks dumber that mismatched wheel & tire components. It may take a few tries to get the knockoffs to match all around. Bob 

My understanding is that the "f" logo should be opposite the valve stem.

 

I saw a nice RR PI with blackwalls on it and quickly caught my eye that two tires were installed "backside out" (extra info was on sidewall) - and this was done by a super competent shop via a car that was done for and made it onto the field at Pebble Beach. 

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I finally got to Pebble Beach in 2016 after 30 years of AACA Judging and the thing that struck me after three hours was the fact that I didn't see any flaws, it was all artwork, everything was too nice to flaw. I have no idea how the teams of judges do it out there. Looking forward to my third year there. Bob 

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BEFORE INFLATION:: If you have no cage,  that means a STEEL  CAGE that is STRONG then consider :

1. use strong chain inside heavy hose like 1 1/2 inch fire hose and put three or more of these around tires and wheel rim, loosely.  These are to try to control snap ring  pop outs.

 

2. Hopefully this will restrain snap ring if it does get pushed out of the grove on inflation.  This is the most dangerous part of the operation, except for the removal which you MUST make sure there is no air pressure in tubs.

Note, some old tires may still have some stress and might POP snap ring out during release.

 

3. when inflating have snap ring facinging DOWN, or away from anyone or valuables.  The straps hopefully will provide safety when you may have to use a soft hammer to make sure snap ring says seated during or after inflation.

 

4. I personally know of one person who was killed by a snap ring,   an experienced service shop owner, mechanic, truck driver. That was in the early 70's but the rims are still here on many vehicles.

 

5. If you do not have the experience, follow the advice of several members here and have it done by a professional.

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Last year, a good friend was fixing a flat on a 650-19 snap ring rim from 1929. He was not paying attention and the wheel let go with the ring flying up and hitting the ceiling. I asked him about the nice new garage door he installed in the shop four or five days earlier. He said “what about it”. I then showed him the big hole punched through the new door............problem with the snap rings is you can’t let your guard down, take any chances, and must respect them and the danger they pose. There like a loaded gun........handled properly, they are fine, handled with carelessness........they are an IED ready to go off. I could post a bunch of pointers on how to change them, but with the danger involved I just won’t do it. Recently someone about two hours away from me here in Florida posted looking for a shop to do just one.......I offered to do it for free if he drove the wheel to me. He ended up finding someone local to do it. Take your time, find a guy who has done them before. 

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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That 1/2 inch nylon rope you keep in the trunk as an emergency tow rope works very well to safely contain a snap ring and it won't chip paint or leave marks on tire or rim. Don't have one,.... good idea to get one. Especially when someone shows up to help tow you to safety and all they have is a chain. This is another reason to have one.   

 

Once the tire is on and  the snap ring is in place,  lace the rope through the spokes and around the tire about 10-12 times - evenly spaced around tire and rim. Tie the ends together and your ready to start inflating the tire. If the snap ring should pop the 1/2 inch nylon rope is plenty strong enough to contain it. Don't use Dacron or hemp ropes, they are not able to absorb the energy as well as nylon can.  

 

Paul 

Edited by PFitz (see edit history)
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25 minutes ago, 70sWagoneers said:

Yes, I re-ask if anyone knows any shop around the Mooresville or Charlotte NC area. I see it is fairly simple, i just want an experienced hand to do it. But it may turn out to be a learning experience.

Thanks

James C

Check you pms.

 

Paul

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4 hours ago, 1937hd45 said:

By the was these wheels are not split rims, they are lock ring style. 

 

 Bob

Yes, if you ask for split rim work you will get rejected even more quickly when inquiring - a split rim is a whole additional level of "fun" (and I say that in as sarcastic a manner as you want to take it). 

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1 hour ago, PFitz said:

Did I miss something ????  When did he ask about "split rims" ?

 

Paul  

It's in the title, thought I'd let the general public know split rims were used in the early 1920's, Model T Fords and others, Lock Rings are a totally different design. Split rim is that black circle, the Split Rim tool is painted red. 

 

 

Bob 

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Edited by 1937hd45 (see edit history)
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I was wondering how it got off track about split rims when the title says, "split lock ring wheels"...... and he posted a picture of a lock ring wheel.  Thought I missed something with these $3.00 Walmart reading glasses.  😁

 

Paul

Edited by PFitz (see edit history)
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The first thing you do when you get the split ring  apart is to clean the grove and ring  so it is clean and smooth!!

The ring should  go back easy and then  stand the when up and put  your chain s or straps around the wheel and ring

then reach through the centre hole and inflate the tire.

If it should happen to blow off it will go away from you

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 I watched a video of a man putting air into a split ring wheel.

 He used a lock on air nozzle and a long hose.

 He connected the hose to a tire infiltrator with a gauge on it.

 He was 30' away from the tire as he inflated it.

 He also had chains around the tire.

 

 INSPECT THE RINGS VERY CAREFULLY!

I have seen tire split rings so badly rusted, that I would not even be sure they would be considered scrap iron!

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I did the three on the back of my Pierce right after getting back with new tires from Charlotte. I took my time, and didn’t have to worry about the paint on my car. One thing I loved is the rim locking tab my car has, I could use three more of these clamp strips, but I was able to play musical chairs with them and once inflated that rim becomes a non-issue. I did still wrap a pair of tie-down straps around the rim just in case and I would not want to work on anything that has good paint, I’m sure it would have been chipped badly along the way.

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Remember the largest danger is cracked rings from the chroming process. They get hydrogen embrittlement and crack and fail under the chrome........as an example....here is a NEW rim, ring, spokes, and hub........and a failure. The tow truck driver kept sticking his face near the tire to tie the car down......I had to cuss him out three times to get it through his head that the wheel was a lit bomb ready to explode. You can't fix stupid. 

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Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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On 5/22/2019 at 3:23 PM, edinmass said:

Remember the largest danger is cracked rings from the chroming process. They get hydrogen embrittlement and crack and fail under the chrome........as an example....here is a NEW rim, ring, spokes, and hub........and a failure. The tow truck driver kept sticking his face near the tire to tie the car down......I had to cuss him out three times to get it through his head that the wheel was a lit bomb ready to explode. You can't fix stupid. 

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This is pretty horrific by the way (aka how people get hurt and killed) !

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On ‎5‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 3:23 PM, edinmass said:

Remember the largest danger is cracked rings from the chroming process. They get hydrogen embrittlement and crack and fail under the chrome........as an example....here is a NEW rim, ring, spokes, and hub........and a failure. The tow truck driver kept sticking his face near the tire to tie the car down......I had to cuss him out three times to get it through his head that the wheel was a lit bomb ready to explode. You can't fix stupid. 

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Ed, Did this ring just decide to fail in the middle of the day, or did someone hit it or catch a pot hole or curb? Bob 

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To all "newbies" reading this PLEASE CONSIDER THIS WARNING! do not take it lightly . Listen to what John and Ed say! there are some of us that have been in the "hobby" for decades that have dealt with this for many years and still are here because were didn't lose a limb or get killed trying to deal with a lock ring that flew off while working on it. A close friend was a service writer at a Cadillac agency 35+ years ago and was a good mechanic as well, but when he went to dismantle, then mount new tires on his 31 Franklin I was the one that did it for the most part for him. Just working with tire irons if you aren't used to doing so , can see one flip up and catch you in the face , break a tooth, take out an eye etc. Have someone teach you the proper way how to do it , there is no "fast" way . Respect what you are working on , proceed with caution , and save yourself a trip to the hospital.

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On 5/22/2019 at 3:23 PM, edinmass said:

Remember the largest danger is cracked rings from the chroming process. They get hydrogen embrittlement and crack and fail under the chrome........as an example....here is a NEW rim, ring, spokes, and hub........and a failure. The tow truck driver kept sticking his face near the tire to tie the car down......I had to cuss him out three times to get it through his head that the wheel was a lit bomb ready to explode. You can't fix stupid. 

 

I may be missing something but is seems like it have been safer to deflate the tire before securing the car to the tow truck.

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44 minutes ago, Roger Frazee said:

I may be missing something but is seems like it have been safer to deflate the tire before securing the car to the tow truck.

 

We were in the hills of the White Mountains in Nh. No adiquate tools, and also....it was a one off Model J, so taking any unnecessary risk wasn't going to be an option. 

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If the tire wasn't deflated all the way it could make the situation more dangers, because it's the bulge of the tire sidewall that is a big part of forcing the snap ring down into it's retaining groove in the wheel rim. Especially one that is broken and no longer has the spring tension of a complete 360 degree ring shape to hold it in place. Many an unbroken snap ring that didn't have enough of that spring tension, has come off while driving as a tire went flat and the sidewalls deflected inward.

 

And, completely deflating the tire could damage an expensive tire and tube, and/or, the rim, as the car is moved unto a transporter, or a to a safe place to work on it. Best to leave the tire pressurized until it's ready to be deflated and removed for repair.

 

If your worried about the snap ring popping off  while having to move the car, remember that tow rope I mentioned earlier ? Use it to lace the tire and snap ring pieces to the rim until you can get it to where you can safely let all the air pressure out of the tire.  

 

Paul.  

Edited by PFitz (see edit history)
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The ring failed while on tour.......no pot hole or impact. All six wheels, hubs, spokes, snap rings, tires and tubes were new with less than 200 miles on them. No one has mentioned how to safely deal with this situation. Very simple. Place a floor jack under the rear end, and from a safe angle, use an ice pick to deflate the tire. Fact is the cost of the tire, tube snap ring, and wheel are meaningless. It’s possible the ring or the rim could have had manufacturing issues. Thus, the only safe option is to remove the pressure and the hell with what it costs, even if it ruins a tire and tube. The rings are safe IF you know what you are doing, and have the correct equipment. 99 percent of the people don’t have enough experience with these things.........and that is a deadly mistake. I have a routine to work on snap ring wheels.......and NEVER vary it. I usually do them late at night....no phone calls, no visitors, no distraction......no radio......nothing. Now in my 50’s three of these an evening is my limit. Your always banged up, bruised, bleeding and a sweaty mess when finished. It’s a dirty and physical job.......not so much the ring as the tire and tube........after changing I leave the tire in the sun for a day to be sure it relaxes and is in its final position, and it also allows for small slow leaks. I NEVER reuse any tube ever, never. No patching either. My car, my time, and my life aren’t worth the aggravation. Chrome snap rings on chrome wheels are easy, the painted rims are always a royalpain in the axx.

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