tblack Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 I think I have seen that Autolite 3077 plugs are a good option for this Buick....they are discontinued....but a cross reference indicates a champion w18D 589 is a substitute....I'm presently running Autolite 3076 and the jury is out on these....Anyone want to weigh in on their experiences. The Champion W18D is a long reach. Fouling potential a plus or minus with these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Engle Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 My 17 D45 has Champion W18 plugs. When I first got the car, the plugs were always black. After going through the distributor and choke ( adjustment had slipped and would not go full open), the engine runs well with a lice tan color on the plugs. It does like a good bit of advance. Bob Engle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tblack Posted April 26, 2019 Author Share Posted April 26, 2019 Thanks for the reply ...I too will go champion but I'm trying the W89D long reach...this is a hotter plug than the Autolight 3076...and compares well to the Autolight 3077 discontinued. From what I can see W18 matches up closely with the Autolite 3076, which runs pretty sooty on my car. Trial and error on these cars and error seems to win the day!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tblack Posted May 2, 2019 Author Share Posted May 2, 2019 Update I installed the champion plugs w89d today...took a 10 mile drive and rechecked the plugs. the long reach hotter plug did not foul up....the Autolite 3076 showed considerable fouling in only 10 miles and misfiring in 50. Seem to be on the right track. I'll report back at 50 miles. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 3, 2019 Share Posted May 3, 2019 I’ve been running the 3076’s for years in my 1923 as the hottest plug I could find. With a bit of online research I find Champion has changed the W89D to 589. Same plug. Champion has changed to all number designations. No alphas in the codes now. Advance Auto parts has the 589 for $8.49 each. Free online delivery and a promo code of E91 saves you another $10.19. All 6 delivered free for $43.20 or $7.20 a plug. Will report back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 3, 2019 Share Posted May 3, 2019 Been at this 25 years and never heard this W89D / 589 Champion ever mentioned before. God Bless the early tractor and hit-n-miss engine boys for keeping us in business 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 3, 2019 Share Posted May 3, 2019 And if I may add, W18s were the worst of all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tblack Posted May 3, 2019 Author Share Posted May 3, 2019 Brian....yes I saw the new Champion 589, but bought 7 nos w89d plugs on ebay.....I too ran the autolites 3076 in my 23 and my 21 for years with no complaints. They sure sooted up quickly in the 17. The original autolite 3077, I guess had a longer reach and ran hotter. I think the w18 plug is used by Model A people. Did you finish the rework of your valve cages??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibarlaw Posted May 3, 2019 Share Posted May 3, 2019 Brian and Tom: I bought a set of the W89D/589s to try. They were at a model expo and do have the longer reach as spec. for the Buick engine. Of course they cannot be used with my 1925 (if one wants to keep the spark plug cover in place) as they also project out a good bit. I am still using the 3076s. But I have a NOS set of Champion #6s which I may try. I actually have 3 variations of the #6. Short, long and 2 piece. I also think have a set of Champion commercial plugs that are specified as a hotter plug. The 1 1/8" hex 78LT or 78LCP (Carbon Proof) is what was specified for the earlier cage valve Buick 6s. When they changed to the detachable head in 1924 the AC specs. changed to a 7/8" hex but had the same reach. I could not figure out why I could never find a proper vintage spark plug wrench for my Buick tool kit in 15/16". (Autolite 3076) Aahh... the original socket for my vintage spark plug was 7/8". I believe this plug eventually became the 77L. 1927 Ad. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 3, 2019 Share Posted May 3, 2019 Agree on all points Tom. Yes, finished up the cage project in 2017 and drove to the BCA National Meet outside Milwaukee and the PWD After Tour and then around Lake Michigan/U.P./Bridge and home. Happy to report 1485 trouble free mile trip. Never had to lift the hood except to check the oil. Just sent Mark Kikta some spare stock valves and felt stem lube washers for his current build yesterday. I ended up going with oversized stem Diesel engine valves cut down and keeper slots added and reamed out the worn cages to match. Good exhaust cages were just too hard to find with unworn stem bores. Cheaper to oversize the cages than to sleeve them even with the modified diesel valve cost rolled in. Very happy. Then added felt washers from McMaster Carr to the stems for lube purposes. I keep them saturated. Found new springs too. Got lucky there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 3, 2019 Share Posted May 3, 2019 (edited) Larry I saw a nice set of those at Hershey when we were out there last Fall. When I asked the price, I very gently set the one I was handling back down. Yikes. And you make a good reminder for the new guys. The newer modern plugs are long on the porcelain ends and often short out to the spark plug cover. This was a major factor in my car when I bought it from the previous owner who could not get it to run well. That, and timing about 40 degrees retarded off. 6 right angle spark plug boots fixed a major issue. Edited May 3, 2019 by Brian_Heil (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibarlaw Posted May 3, 2019 Share Posted May 3, 2019 Brian: Yes I know what you mean. I lucked out and found all the #6s at an antique shop all in original boxes I think I paid $40.00 for 10 of them. I see similar off brand plugs on Ebay @ a buy it now price of $99.00 for 2 or 4! These were 2 piece # 6s. Comparison of the #6 and the 78LT Titan that the cage valve engines used and the 3076 which is still the tallest of the group but shortest in reach. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 (edited) Spark plugs arrived Monday. So far, so good. Edited May 8, 2019 by Brian_Heil (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tblack Posted May 8, 2019 Author Share Posted May 8, 2019 I'm up to 75 miles on the W89d's and it is running just fine....they (yours) look the same as mine. I'll take a picture of the W89D in 20 miles or so and compare it to the Autolite 3076 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tblack Posted May 8, 2019 Author Share Posted May 8, 2019 I pulled a plug on Cylinder#3. Cylinder # 3 had fouled the original new autolite 3076 to the point of not firing in 40 miles. I put in a new Autolite 3076 in and what is pictured is it with 10 miles on it...still firing but fouling up fast. I removed the champion W89D plug from the same cylinder with 35 miles on it. While not perfect but it's hot tip is staying a nice tan color. My guess is that I am burning some oil but not enough to see it in the exhaust. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) Installed my W89Ds today. Gapped to 0.035 per the Dave Chambers article quoted here often. Still shaking my head as to where these plugs have been for the last 23 years. Ha. I had two sets of 3076s I would swap out every 500 miles or so. Clean the set and be ready again in 500. Just like an Indy pit crew. My car has been ~150 miles to the quart since I got it. Stock pistons. I’m not a fan of Champions, running AC or Autolites in my other cars from the 50s and 60s. But I like the length of these electrodes for temp and staying un-fouled. 10 mile loop to get gas. Idles like a rock and runs well. Like new plugs should. The test will will be this weekend and the 210 mile round trip to the Gilmore Museum in Hickory Corners, Michigan for the Pre War Gathering. Great event. There is a 100 mile tour on Friday but I’ll get my fix Saturday running over there and back. Larry Schramm is trailering over for Friday’s event with his newly rebuilt truck engine. Had to re-lash a couple 3 valves. A leftover from last season and my valve job of 2017. No more clatter. All 12 set to a snug 0.008 hot. Sounds like a Buick should. Terry Wiegand Will now relax. Ha. Cleaned the cap cap and rotor. A dab of dielectric grease. Good to go. Fan, throw out bearing and distributor greased. Trans and rear end checked and topped off. Steering box too. Changed the oil before I put it away. 20w50 WolfsHead. Been running it for 20+ years. Cheapest API rated oil my neighbors auto store carries. I buy it by the case. He delivers it to my back stoop. Chassis lube will be next or maybe when I get back. Buick is so dirty it looks like a barn find. Needs a good wash and wax Friday. Fingers crossed for Saturday’s weather. Last year I was all set to go but took a pass and did not drive all day in the rain. I will I’ll post the Gilmore link in a sec. Edited May 16, 2019 by Brian_Heil (see edit history) 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 https://www.gilmorecarmuseum.org/cole-gathering-to-be-largest-in-history/ This year’s Marquis will be Cole. Will be nice to see Leroy Cole who I’m certain will be there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 https://www.gilmorecarmuseum.org/visit-explore-2/must-sees/ another link too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 Well, at least it’s clean now. Too nice an evening not to take advantage of it. Tom, I’m too embarrassed to post the condition of the 3076s I removed. All oil soaked and caked with carbon. The only time I could get them slightly gray and dry is on a long tour. Around town running errands they just load up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 (edited) Made it. Round trip of 217 miles. I can tell the W89D plugs ran better. Consistent idle and pulled the grades stronger. All around better combustion. Pulled in the driveway this evening with it idling just as smooth as when I left. We had steady rain from 5:30 to 7:30 this morning at home then it let up to drizzle then just spitting. Hit the road at 8:45 spitting and all. Why did I wash it and wax it last night? Arrived @ Gilmore filthy thanks to wet roads and road construction. But the sun was out by then and Larry Schramm saved me a spot. Nice to see lots of old friends. If you have a chance, put this annual event on your to-do list and get yourself a set of W89Ds. Edited May 19, 2019 by Brian_Heil (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 (edited) One spectator joked and asked me if I passed anyone on the where there? I said sure, why I passed a $500,000 job like he was standing still. Edited May 19, 2019 by Brian_Heil (see edit history) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 On 5/16/2019 at 5:03 PM, Brian_Heil said: https://www.gilmorecarmuseum.org/cole-gathering-to-be-largest-in-history/ This year’s Marquis will be Cole. Will be nice to see Leroy Cole who I’m certain will be there. Leroy was there and I talked to him. Doing good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Yep. I had a nice visit with him as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Good to see a lot of Buick friends. They included Don Obermeyer and his 1908 F and Gary Van Dyken & wife Beverly from Ontario among others. Joyce and I along with Gary & Beverly went on the about 85 mile tour in the Battle Creek/ Kalamazoo area. Nice time with good roads most of the day. It did start to drizzle some for about the last hour of the tour. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Brian, Glad to hear the plugs worked well. That is the only plugs/style that I have been using since I got the truck running years ago. A recommendation of Mark Shaw. Only difference I was able to get some Autolite 3077 plugs before they discontinued them a few years back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 OK, I couldn’t stand it any more. Here is #3. 217 touring miles on the W89D and ~500 miles of who knows what on the 3076. Tom Black, thank you! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tblack Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 Glad those plugs worked for you they worked for me as well .......I sold the car!!! so until its picked up I can only go out in the garage and look at it. I have a couple of leads on possible next projects, just to keep buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRM Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 I'm a little late to this party, but hopefully, someone will see this plea and respond. I've recently purchased a beautiful '17 D45 and am now preparing the 'ole gal for some shows and driving. The plugs are fouled and are Autolite 3076s. I do not know what threading and would like to know that. Also, they have a threaded top so the plug wire can be secured with a small, brass screw-on connector. Are replacement plugs just impossible to find, and so, I should clean these and re-use? If I do replace them, can the replacement plug tops be replaced with the threaded tops from the existing plugs as I don't see any plug, on the internet, with threaded tops? I have no experience in this matter and am clueless. Thank you, much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibarlaw Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 JRM: Posted May 3, 2019 Brian and Tom: I bought a set of the W89D/589s to try. They were at a model expo and do have the longer reach as spec. for the Buick engine. The plug is 7/8" dia thread with a 15/16" hex. The origina equipment AC Titan would have (I believe) a 1 1/8' hex (center plug) in the photo below. In our collective experiences from the posts above I highly recomend the W89D/589s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRM Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Thank you, Larry. I suppose finding W89D/589s will be quite the challenge, but I'll try. Regards, Jay Miller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted May 11, 2021 Share Posted May 11, 2021 I used Autolite 3076 back in 2019 when I first got my E-49 running. They fouled every 15 minutes. When I switched to W89D that year, they stopped fouling and I don't even bother to check them anymore because they never foul. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 (edited) On 5/10/2021 at 11:29 AM, JRM said: Thank you, Larry. I suppose finding W89D/589s will be quite the challenge, but I'll try. Regards, Jay Miller Jay, O'Reilly auto parts and other stores carry them. Just ask for Champion 589 spark plugs. They are still about 8.49 each. Might have to order them, but they are available. Edited May 12, 2021 by Larry Schramm (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRM Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 The reprinted owner's manual, for a '17 Buick D45 calls for plugs to be gapped to .028 of an inch. Does this hold true for any of the plugs used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted May 15, 2021 Share Posted May 15, 2021 No 0.035 Thrte is a rather famous study and article by the late Buick expert Dave Chambers proving 0.035 is better in these cars. I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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