Insurance Consideration

[Robert Street]

I have my cars insured with one of the large "agreed" coverage companies.  They are not driven nor are they tagged.  I do have the 61 Convertible tagged as the politicians love the older convertibles during parade season.

I recently learned several of the larger conventional insurance companies have started "agreed" value insurance for non driven show type cars at I must admit competitive rates.

Any comments?

Robert

[oldcarfudd]

Just what is a "non-driven show car"?  Do you drive it from your garage to the trailer, and from the (possibly remotely parked) trailer to the show field and back?  Do you drive it to get gas?  While you're at it, since it's a nice day, do you go on into town and get a haircut?  If your Aunt Minnie comes to visit, do you take her for a ride? If an insurance company gives you a price break because of minimal use, and you have an accident, you'd better be mighty sure that the use you were making of the car was well within the minimal use the company thought it had agreed to.  Otherwise, I'd suggest you stick with companies that insure driven antiques, even if it costs you a few more pesos a year.

[Robert Street]

11 minutes ago, oldcarfudd said:

Just what is a "non-driven show car"?  Do you drive it from your garage to the trailer, and from the (possibly remotely parked) trailer to the show field and back?  Do you drive it to get gas?  While you're at it, since it's a nice day, do you go on into town and get a haircut?  If your Aunt Minnie comes to visit, do you take her for a ride? If an insurance company gives you a price break because of minimal use, and you have an accident, you'd better be mighty sure that the use you were making of the car was well within the minimal use the company thought it had agreed to.  Otherwise, I'd suggest you stick with companies that insure driven antiques, even if it costs you a few more pesos a year.

The non-driven show cars I own are driven from the shop area 50 feet to a trailer then from the trailer to the AACA national showfield.  Since some National events now have long drives(several miles) to showfield on state highways I no longer am entering these. No other drives or even starting of the cars.

Robert

I am still leaning to stay with the antique insurance companies but welcome all opinions.

Edited April 5, 2019 by Robert Street
spell check got me! (see edit history)

[first64riv]

I have State Farm and they cover an agreed value.

 

Chris

[kevin1221]

2 hours ago, first64riv said:

I have State Farm and they cover an agreed value.

 

Chris

Chris

 

Is this State Farm agreed value policy obtained through your local agent, or do you have to go to a Special State Farm site? Reason I asked, when I tried to get an agreed value policy on my 2008 Shelby, my local agent told me they don’t offer agreed value policies. It’s possibe my local agent just wasn’t aware of this type of policy. I live in a rural area of Nevada.

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin

[Robert Street]

7 hours ago, kevin1221 said:

Chris

 

Is this State Farm agreed value policy obtained through your local agent, or do you have to go to a Special State Farm site? Reason I asked, when I tried to get an agreed value policy on my 2008 Shelby, my local agent told me they don’t offer agreed value policies. It’s possibe my local agent just wasn’t aware of this type of policy. I live in a rural area of Nevada.

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin

 

State Farm is one of the “regular” insurance companies I’ve contacted and the agent was knowledgeable about the agreed value policy although they call it something else. I will admit he had to call headquarters a couple of times though for clarification. Interesting though I don’t seem to be able to get a blank copy of that type of policy to review prior to. Interesting......  Another interesting item they do require the photos like antique cars policies but they didn’t ask for details on one of mine that has an elevated value due to the way the car was optioned. It took an extra week for approval originally on that car

Robert

[R Walling]

I am pretty sure that you can get "non driven" insurance from some top companies.

 I was offered a stated value policy on my old time dragster a while ago.

[edinmass]

Insuring non tagged cars is not expensive if you have a good garage. You can bundle them all together on one policy. Now.......I respect all in the hobby, and how they pursue their fun.......why would one own a car that you don't drive?

[trimacar]

37 minutes ago, edinmass said:

why would one own a car that you don't drive?

 

Pride of ownership, I guess.  I have a couple of cars I don't drive, but at this point it was the car's decision, not mine, things just seem to keep breaking.....

[60FlatTop]

Kind of reminds me of the time my Wife thought she needed a pair of shoes.

[Curti]

Too many cars too little storage. Some do not come out unless others are moved.  My hobby is building them as accurately as possible, restoring every part to the best of my  (and others) ability. Putting on a couple of hundred miles to sort it out , then on to the next one. Everybody's hobby is different.

[lulajean]

I'm happy with my Hagerty insurance. My tagless (and motionless) Buick got bundled in with my vintage bikes and its a very fair price. 

[Robert Street]

1 hour ago, edinmass said:

Insuring non tagged cars is not expensive if you have a good garage. You can bundle them all together on one policy. Now.......I respect all in the hobby, and how they pursue their fun.......why would one own a car that you don't drive?

Ed I was waiting for a driving comment on this one and here you are! I have no desire to drive my two best show cars for several reasons. I have been fortunate both have been in museums and both I show at national shows not at local area parking lot shows. I kind of enjoy pounding the roads with a trailer and my big diesel Denali.  I don't think that a national show car should be driven as it then doesn't become as delivered by the manufacturer.  When I get a chance I walk around at a show and enjoy looking at the many classes of cars but must admit I shake my head when I see one that has the paint burned off the engines or one that has grease oozing from steering boxes.  Many of them should be on the other field where driving cars are.

I have actually started cutting back on shows as several I have observed have several miles that the show cars must be driven from the trailers lot to the showfield over state highways with no tags!

I have all of them in a climate garage/shop and yes they are bundled in an antique car insurer.  Recently I have been asking regular insurers about their agreed upon policy and one flat told me they will do it but the cars must be tagged.  I am not interested in giving Maryland hundreds of dollars for cars not driven. The one that thought they wouldn't require tags is unable to give me a blank policy to review before acceptance.

As of now I am going to stay with the antique policy even though it is a "tick" more and will allow the convertible to be tagged as I don't regularly show it and only use it during parade seasons as the political folks love to be riding in a older convertible.

Robert

 

[Robert Street]

I just thought of another good reason NOT to drive a classic show car.  In the area I live there is a tremendous influx of people and their driving skills aren't the best so the accident rate has gone up considerably in the area.  Having said that I would rather be in a repairable GMC 3500 diesel Denali vs a 61 or 62 Impala SS 409.

Robert 

[39BuickEight]

Based on my 10 years of experience as an automobile adjuster with a major brand carrier, and dealing with other major carriers in liability claims, their agents are quick to sell the product (because they are salespeople), but when it come to claims, they are extremely lacking in the knowledge/ability in how to properly deal with a damaged antique/classic/collectible vehicle.  It doesn’t matter if the premium is lower, if, when you need them, they don’t know how to handle your claim.  That’s where the specialty insurers excel.

 

I still work for a major carrier, and use them for my house and daily drivers, but I have Hagerty on my collectibles.

Edited April 5, 2019 by 39BuickEight (see edit history)

[Robert Street]

10 minutes ago, 39BuickEight said:

Based on my 10 years of experience as an automobile adjuster with a major brand carrier, and dealing with other major carriers in liability claims, their agents are quick to sell the product (because they are salespeople), but when it come to claims, they are extremely lacking in the knowledge/ability in how to properly deal with a damaged antique/classic/collectible vehicle.  It doesn’t matter if the premium is lower, if, when you need them, they don’t know how to handle your claim.  That’s where the specialty insurers excel.

 

I still work for a major carrier, and use them for my house and daily drivers, but I have Hagerty on my collectibles.

 

That is what I wanted to hear Thanks!!!!!

Robert

[ejboyd5]

14 hours ago, Robert Street said:

I I do have the '61 Convertible tagged as the politicians love the older convertibles during parade season. Any comments?

Aiding and abetting politicians seems like a silly reason to keep a car.

[Matt Harwood]

Collector car insurance is so inexpensive, why pinch pennies and try to force a main line insurance carrier to cover something they're not familiar with? The big collector car insurance companies are already familiar with collector cars, they don't hassle you when you file a claim, and their prices are reasonable. If you own show cars that don't get driven, I can't imagine that paying your bill is a financial hardship.

 

I don't know how significant a discount I'd need to deal with a big insurance company when, say, I stupidly drove my 1929 Cadillac off the lift and smashed the oil pan. Hagerty paid, no questions asked. Would the cube farm fresh-out-of-college insurance adjuster at State Farm or Progressive even understand what I was talking about when I told them the sidemount wells were flattened? Would they push back when I took my car to Steve Litton's Rolls-Royce shop to be fixed to the tune of $7000? Hagerty didn't even blink and I have a $0 deductible policy. I can only imagine the hassles of dealing with one of the big companies who are not geared to deal with that kind of claim. "Yeah, you need to talk to Bert, he's our old car guy. But he's only here on Tuesdays and he's 76 years old so sometimes he's hard to reach. But he knows all about those old junkers. Can I interest you in renter's insurance?" Like I said, how much of a discount are you getting on something that's already pretty inexpensive that would make you consider dealing with someone who isn't a specialist?

 

Your podiatrist went to medical school just like your cardiologist, they're both doctors, so why not give the podiatrist a crack at installing your new heart valve? He's a little cheaper, after all!

 

Yeah, no thanks.

[A. Ballard 35R]

Cant help but be reminded of that old saying, "If you don't drive them why don't you collect clocks?"

 

Sorry, couldn't resist and I'm sure the arrows will be headed towards me.

[60FlatTop]

In New York State the license registration on early cars is the proof of ownership. Titles are not available for them. I have purchased three cars recently that were years away from moving under their own power, if ever. I got the insurance and plates to complete the formality of my purchase. Sometimes you have to do that. They have all been sold with the best transaction security I could provide.

 

I used to work on a friend's car that was insured by J C Taylor and LLoyd's of London. That is not an obvious option, but one to consider when the car warrants it. I wouldn't need it, but it is worth a thought. They were game.

 

The post about politicians in the car is a hoot. Just thinking about which ones would be least likely to appreciate a ride from a person who collects cars as a hobby. Might get a ride but not a vote. And they know it.

[Paul Dobbin]

With collector car insurance, most of the premium is for the"Agreed Value" coverage, meaning Collision , Comprehensive, Fire & Theft.  The rest of the premium is for Liability.,

that covers you for running over kids and show spectators as well as damaging other show cars with your seldom driven trailer queen.  Also as a collector it's common to find

there is no additional premium for liability coverage charged for additional vehicles, more than (3) three.

I agree with Matt. Deal with professional insurance  specialists and trust them to guide you.  They carry professional liability insurance in case they make a mistake.  Do you?  

One additional beef.  Pay more attention to your Liability Limits than your Agree Value.  A $25,000 Property Damage Liability Limit won't last long if your car rolls down the hill

and takes out a row of Pebble Beach cars.  (Or even a few Model A's)  Or your gas leak sets off a grass fire that destroys 100 show cars.   Chit Happens!

My 30 years in that business reads like the Farmers Insurance commercials on TV, "Insurance companies know a thing or two, because they've seen a thing or two"

[charlier]

2 hours ago, Paul Dobbin said:

One additional beef.  Pay more attention to your Liability Limits than your Agree Value.  A $25,000 Property Damage Liability Limit won't last long if your car rolls down the hill and takes out a row of Pebble Beach cars.  (Or even a few Model A's)  Or your gas leak sets off a grass fire that destroys 100 show cars.   Chit Happens! My 30 years in that business reads like the Farmers Insurance commercials on TV, "Insurance companies know a thing or two, because they've seen a thing or two"

 

Shouldn't antique car owners also pay more attention to "uninsured and under-insured" parts of their antique car policy?

Depending on the accident/situation doesn't this coverage play a more important role that most people think in covering an antique car and it's owner?

In your example wouldn't the "under-insured" coverage come into play for the Pebble Beach cars or the cars destroyed by the grass fire?

 

I often see and hear antique car owners talk about what they pay for insurance. I know the coverage I have and what I pay for that coverage.

Sometimes I just scratch my head and wonder....

 

 

 

 

[Bhigdog]

Hence a personal liability  umbrella coverage policy. I carry $3,000,0000. The cost is not that great..................Bob

[Hans1]

Thank you all for the insight and the personal experiences, which make the information you provide  readily understood.

 

I do so appreciate the AACA site for all the dialogue, information and freely given instruction available to all who read it.

[Bhigdog]

And a lot of it is worth exactly what you paid for it.😊.......bob

[Paul Dobbin]

In most states Uninsured and Under Insured coverage apply only to Bodily Injury Liability, not Property Damage Liability.   It has nothing to do with either owners property.

For your property carry Collision & Comprehensive, for others property you carry Property  Damage Liability. in higher amounts.. Some insurance companies offer a single

limit like $300,000 for a combined liability.  You need to know which you have.   Liability Umbrella policies can add to the underlying limits mentioned above, but they will

require higher underlying limits on you car, home, boat, motorcycle policies, usually #250,000/$500,000 on Bodily Injury Liability and $100,000 property Damage Liability, sometimes higher.  The $250,000/$500,000  means $250,000 per Person Liability and $500,000 per accident Liability.  Know your numbers, but don't tell anybody you injure.

The most common problem is people who shop by price, not coverage limits.  Why risk everything you have to save peanuts.  You are self insured for the difference.

[Robert Street]

Thanks for the comments everyone. I am going to stay with the antique car insurance company that I have been with for years.  As another issue that came up in comments I do also have an umbrella liability policy even though one of my cars has been accepted at the Hemmings Lake George Concours event not Pebble Beach as the commenter used an example.

Now to find none exploding trailer tires!

Robert

[first64riv]

On 4/4/2019 at 8:48 PM, kevin1221 said:

Chris

 

Is this State Farm agreed value policy obtained through your local agent, or do you have to go to a Special State Farm site? Reason I asked, when I tried to get an agreed value policy on my 2008 Shelby, my local agent told me they don’t offer agreed value policies. It’s possibe my local agent just wasn’t aware of this type of policy. I live in a rural area of Nevada.

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin

Kevin, sorry for the delayed reply.

 

Yes, the agreed value is through my local agent.  No special channels.  I will find out what the policy is called.

 

Chris

[kevin1221]

32 minutes ago, first64riv said:

Kevin, sorry for the delayed reply.

 

Yes, the agreed value is through my local agent.  No special channels.  I will find out what the policy is called.

 

Chris

Thanks Chris. I appreciate it.

 

Kevin

[charlier]

I thought of this thread a few times yesterday while traveling to/from my niece's volleyball tournament.

 

First time, was when I saw an empty open car trailer on the highway with a few pieces of UNSECURED pieces of 6"x 6" wood blocks (ie wheel chocks) cruising down the road. I guess the driver of the truck thought gravity was good enough to keep these blocks on the trailer when he hit a pothole. (Potholes here in Pennsylvania are often deep and big)  Needless to say I steered clear of this fella.

 

Later in the day I saw a car on an open trailer that was secured by only two wheel baskets on it's front wheels and nothing else. Definitely explained why the rear of the car was sitting cock-eyed on the back of the trailer. No doubt at all that the unsecured rear of the car was moving especially as seeing the tow vehicle taking turns way faster than most here would consider safe.

 

Sadly these and other sights I saw yesterday are becoming more and more commonplace. All the more reason for the rest of us to think long and hard about the insurance we have on our antique and modern vehicles.

[Bhigdog]

2 hours ago, charlier said:

All the more reason for the rest of us to think long and hard about the insurance we have on our antique and modern vehicles.

 

Not to mention our lives............................Bob

 

 2 years ago I sold a 15' canoe to a Pa state trooper. He showed up with a 6' bed pick up with a cap. He tried every combination of lashing the canoe to the truck. I kept shaking my head. He finally decided he could make it home with about 8 feet sticking out, lashed over the cab and tied to the door handles. I finally asked him, very seriously, what he would do if he saw that on patrol and how would that affect his career if it broke loose and hurt someone. He came back the next day with a trailer...........Bob

Edited April 7, 2019 by Bhigdog (see edit history)

[first64riv]

On 4/6/2019 at 7:29 PM, kevin1221 said:

Thanks Chris. I appreciate it.

 

Kevin

Kevin, it's a classic car policy and it's insured for a stated value.  Those are the exact terms my agent just relayed to me.

 

Chris

[1935Packard]

On 4/5/2019 at 8:04 AM, 39BuickEight said:

Based on my 10 years of experience as an automobile adjuster with a major brand carrier, and dealing with other major carriers in liability claims, their agents are quick to sell the product (because they are salespeople), but when it come to claims, they are extremely lacking in the knowledge/ability in how to properly deal with a damaged antique/classic/collectible vehicle.  It doesn’t matter if the premium is lower, if, when you need them, they don’t know how to handle your claim.  That’s where the specialty insurers excel.

 

I still work for a major carrier, and use them for my house and daily drivers, but I have Hagerty on my collectibles.

 

I have Hagerty on my antique cars, and I'm a fan.  I had an issue around a decade ago when a car of mine caught fire on the road, and they were great: They paid the shop in full with no questions.