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GregLaR

1931 Chrysler Phaeton Worth Another Look...

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11 hours ago, FLYER15015 said:

So the battle of Britton isn't over, and the Marshal plan worked a bit too well !

    No, but it's now the 21st Century, no longer the world of Studebaker wagons.  Change or get left behind still applies, as evidenced by Rolls Royce.

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Posted (edited)
On 3/13/2019 at 6:53 PM, trimacar said:

 

Yes, but I would argue that references the town, not the marque.....

cord3.jpeg.c39184446fbc1a582844351bfdc884b1.jpeg

 

line.jpg.110e8ef4ad7bef7e1db2eb492bb983d8.jpg

An 810 Cord data plate pretty much says it is an Auburn product (and an Auburn was built in the same assembly plant within eyeshot of a Cord too)

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)

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8 minutes ago, John_Mereness said:

An 810 Cord data plate pretty much says it is an Auburn product (and an Auburn was built in the same assembly plant within eyeshot of a Cord too) 

 

Isn't the same as Cadillac and Chevy both being GM products?

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Posted (edited)
On 3/10/2019 at 12:38 PM, Xander Wildeisen said:

This car was at a show out here a few years ago, is this not a full classic? 

20130720_112737.jpg

20130720_112749.jpg

Not to disrupt the revolution of the earth, but perhaps it is time for an owner to do the research and then make the application  to CCCA again (there has to be some history as to the declassification that would be useful too).  I asked a friend when a kid why I never say many Chrysler Imperials (aka what is their fatal flaw) and he said they had none - Chrysler built a fine car and as a result people drove them into the ground to the point that there was nothing left of them (aka why so few survivors). 

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)

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1 hour ago, John_Mereness said:

An 810 Cord data plate pretty much says it is an Auburn product (and an Auburn was built in the same assembly plant within eyeshot of a Cord too)

I understand what it says, but the company was originally named Auburn Automobile Company because it was located in Auburn, Indiana.

 

The Auburn automobile production predates the Duesy and Cord connection, so I stand by my statement that the "Auburn" on the Cord data plate still references the town, it's not that the Cord is a "version"  or a "product" of an Auburn automobile.

 

I guess it might be one of those things that makes sense in my mind, but may not be seen by others in that light.

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22 minutes ago, trimacar said:

I understand what it says, but the company was originally named Auburn Automobile Company because it was located in Auburn, Indiana.

 

The Auburn automobile production predates the Duesy and Cord connection, so I stand by my statement that the "Auburn" on the Cord data plate still references the town, it's not that the Cord is a "version"  or a "product" of an Auburn automobile.

 

I guess it might be one of those things that makes sense in my mind, but may not be seen by others in that light.

Technically at some point it probably became a product of AVCO

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Posted (edited)
On 3/14/2019 at 12:55 PM, 1937hd45 said:

I'll have to look closer now, guess there is more to them than the Goofy headlights/ Bob 

 

Seems to me EVERYONE went to fender lights as soon as Pierce was gone.......funny, no. Trademark?,yes. Always well done or attractive, no. Depending on year and model they look great......or no quite so..........but compare the build quality, engineering, and construction. There is no doubt a Pierce factory body was much better built than all of the other factory stuff..........and most of their factory bodies were better than 75 percent of the coach built stuff. There are very few cars that will run with a big Pierce eight or twelve, very few. And the ones that can will cost you tens times more out of pocket. I have driven just about all the great Marques and chassis, and almost every great platform. Most are run of the mill and flawed, a very select few make you smile and want to never leave the drivers seat.

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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8 minutes ago, edinmass said:

 

and most of their factory bodies were better than 75 percent of the coach built stuff.

My impression too.

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Just as a follow-up, I note that the Chrysler phaeton that started this thread was a no-sale at auction in February @ $85,000.

 

He should have taken it and done a happy dance on his way out the door.

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Any car at a well advertised public auction is only worth the high bid offered at that time........simple and true fact. Oftentimes auctions are the absolute worst way to sell a car. But try and explain that to some people.......it’s like trying to hold back the ocean with a broom

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51 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

Just as a follow-up, I note that the Chrysler phaeton that started this thread was a no-sale at auction in February @ $85,000.

 

He should have taken it and done a happy dance on his way out the door.

 

I agree. 

 

I found this link on line a while ago:

https://www.conceptcarz.com/profile/29214,24585/1931-chrysler-series-cd.aspx

So current owner probably over paid and didn't want to take a $25K blower?

Too bad....bird in the hand.

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Also very probable that there were not two serious buyers for it at that auction.  (My 2 cents)

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Looking through the database, I note that the same car was purchased at auction in April of 2018 for $110,000 then showed up at an auction in November 2018 where it was a no-sale at $95,000, suggesting someone thought it was a smart buy for a quick flip. It was again a no-sale in February 2019 at $85,000. Most likely the asking price today at McCormick is still the guy who bought it last April trying to get his money back and the auction company still has a tail on it. He is probably realizing that he should have ejected sooner and should stop flogging it auction because everyone is going to assume it's borked. I suspect he's going to be stuck with the car unless he's willing to take a rather significant bath. Too bad, it's probably a nice car and if it's as pleasing to drive as my roadster someone would really enjoy it.

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39 minutes ago, edinmass said:

Any car at a well advertised public auction is only worth the high bid offered at that time........simple and true fact. Oftentimes auctions are the absolute worst way to sell a car. But try and explain that to some people.......it’s like trying to hold back the ocean with a broom

 

Now that I've finished punching all the morons who say, "You should call Jay Leno, he buys old cars," I've started punching the dopes who say, "You should send it to Barrett-Jackson and get really big money for it."

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2 hours ago, Matt Harwood said:

 

Now that I've finished punching all the morons who say, "You should call Jay Leno, he buys old cars," I've started punching the dopes who say, "You should send it to Barrett-Jackson and get really big money for it."

 

Funny, all the guys I know who have sold cars through their company (four of them) were upset about every detail the way it was run. Car on the block for a few seconds, auctioneer not working the crowd, ect.

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The harsh reality is: It is a lot easier to buy something than sell it.

 

And, if there is a middle man involved there will be a price to such (all be it the middle man does serve it''s purpose when properly applied). 

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This happens frequently when someone who is actually "flipping" cars with some success decides to branch out into an area in which he has little experience. Flipping an El Camino is just like flipping a '31 Chrysler, right? So they buy a car that looks lovely and think, "Those old guys who like old cars will pay big for this!" and ooops! You've misjudged the market just like that. I've done several trades with other dealers who have something like this in their inventory and don't know what to do with it. After unsuccessfully flogging it, they call me, I trade them a muscle car for their pre-war car and everyone is happy.


Expertise matters. Without the knowledge merely pricing a car can be difficult, but talking to a buyer without the knowledge can make selling it impossible. It's exactly why I don't deal in exotics.

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Just as a follow-up, I note that the Chrysler phaeton that started this thread was a no-sale at auction in February @ $85,000.

Old cars says a 31 Chrysler four door phaeton is worth $61,500 in #1 condition, $85k was a great offer !

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Matt, 

             You're a reasonable authority on pricing cars from this era. What do you think would be a realistic figure for this car?

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2 hours ago, Matt Harwood said:

"Those old guys who like old cars will pay big for this!"

 

That's funny. I am going to smile every time I remember it.

 

I am not in the league of selling expensive cars, but when I sell I work with a pretty good margin. Knowledge is important, but facts can muddy things up. I like a buyer with enough knowledge to dream. Over estimating their own abilities helps too.

 

Of course, I sell to others the way I would buy myself. That's usually how I got stuck with what I'm selling.

 

When you come right down to it, thinking about these $90,000 reminds me that I never wanted to work hard enough to have that much discretionary money. Maybe nine $10,000 cars, but $90,000 would be way too much.

Bernie

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2 hours ago, 1950panhead said:

 

 

Old cars says a 31 Chrysler four door phaeton is worth $61,500 in #1 condition, $85k was a great offer !

 

Don't trust price guides.  They are worthless.

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On 4/19/2019 at 4:33 PM, edinmass said:

 

Funny, all the guys I know who have sold cars through their company (four of them) were upset about every detail the way it was run. Car on the block for a few seconds, auctioneer not working the crowd, ect.


Eddie, you know better than anyone that a regular guy bringing a single car to BJ (or any auction for that matter) will get different treatment than somebody who does a lot of business with that company.   Just like real life is most respects.

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20 hours ago, 1950panhead said:

 

 

Old cars says a 31 Chrysler four door phaeton is worth $61,500 in #1 condition, $85k was a great offer !

Yikes, this is one price guide page that may not be worth the paper it is printed on.  Nice cars and they are worth decent money, but I would be real cautious at those prices - Matt Harwood shared his experiences with same/similar car(s) and I would say he is 100% on the money.   By the way, this story is probably someplace else on this page too, but a good friends has a 1931 Imperial Cabriolet and a 1931 Imperial 7 passenger Sedan (and worked on everyone Chrysler's locally) and I asked him one day what the fatal flaw was to Chrysler that I saw so few and his reply was there was no fatal flaw other than they made a really good car and people tended to drive them into the ground until nothing left of them (turns out over time plenty of people share similar). 

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On 3/16/2019 at 1:24 PM, edinmass said:

 

Seems to me EVERYONE went to fender lights as soon as Pierce was gone.......funny, no. Trademark?,yes. Always well done or attractive, no. Depending on year and model they look great......or no quite so..........but compare the build quality, engineering, and construction. There is no doubt a Pierce factory body was much better built than all of the other factory stuff..........and most of their factory bodies were better than 75 percent of the coach built stuff. There are very few cars that will run with a big Pierce eight or twelve, very few. And the ones that can will cost you tens times more out of pocket. I have driven just about all the great Marques and chassis, and almost every great platform. Most are run of the mill and flawed, a very select few make you smile and want to never leave the drivers seat.

Patents expire after 17 years and the Pierce Arrow headlight patent was issued in 1914. So, anyone was free to copy it after 1931 and they did.

The headlight mounting had a serious purpose. The higher and wider apart you mount the headlights the better they illuminate the road. You have experienced this yourself with a flashlight, you don't hold it close to the ground you hold it up if you want to see better.

The other purpose was to give Pierce cars a distinctive appearance, so they could be told at a glance from lesser cars.

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Posted (edited)

For some reason I had 27 years in my head......not 17. Anyways, I wonder why it took so long for the others to adapt........or was it that the image of a different car with fender lights seemed like a “rip off” or poor taste on a off brand car? I agree it’s a much better set up, and that’s why all cars went that way. Maybe the depression slowed down the faster changeover? So which car was first after 1931 to put the lights in the fenders? Ford/Lincoln come to my mind as the first large production cars........there were so many cars that were gone by 1933 the list of manufacturers was getting very short.

 

Had to do a google search........Ford and Lincoln went to them in 1937, Chevy(GM) 40/41. Quite a delay for such an obvious better way to do things. 

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)

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