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1927 Buick Carb Removal?


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The reason that I did not buy a kit was that I did not find one available, and I did not think I really needed one.  I have not started my car yet, but after cleaning it all out, all of the jets squirted clear and the gaskets were easy to make.  I would have considered a new needle and seat, but there are no elastomeric tips, so I was going to fiddle with the old one and see if it would seat.     Hugh 

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The metering pin just pulls out the top.  I would spray carburetor or brake cleaner around the sides of the metering pin in the hope that it will loosen the tar and let it slide out.  I have noticed that the 1 gallon cans of carburetor cleaner do not always soften all of the fuel residue.  

 

The screw only holds the keeper that keeps the felt seal from coming out.

IMG_7345.thumb.JPG.891b7d1b5951cecfb56283ff027f03d1.JPG

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Interesting looking sleeve with white lining for the needle as the original had no locating sleeve for the seat. What does the needle look like? I did a Viton tip adaptation and had to make a cage to help the needle find center since the locating stem of the needle was machined off.

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22 hours ago, 27donb said:

 

What comes in a kit that has that long of a lead time? 

Typically, a kit for the early Marvel carb will contain:

 

Fuel valve (a.k.a. needle and seat)

Float (new pontoon only, reuse the float arm)

Air valve spring

Fillister head assembly screws

Complete set of gaskets, including the mounting gasket.

Seals, when used.

 

Other items not in the kits are often available.

 

I apologize for the time frame. As I passed retirement age more than a decade ago, I am no longer willing to work 90~100 hours a week; although I still average about 40. There are some things in life (example: family) that are more important than the manufacture of rebuilding kits. As we offer more than 10,000 different rebuilding kits to motor enthusiasts (we do car, truck, tractor, marine, and industrial); we are generally behind, sometimes very behind.

 

And with Marvel, about the only components for which there is a large interchange from carburetor to carburetor are the round fiber washers, and the Fillister-headed screws. Mass reproduction of parts of which you sell three a year (or fewer) is not economically smart! Thus, the kits are custom-made.

 

I keep hoping I will find some youngster in his/her 40's/50's that would enjoy the business, and would like to acquire it. There are hungry fish in the Lake of the Ozarks that keep calling my name! ;) It might be nice to answer them!

 

Jon.

Edited by carbking (see edit history)
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32 minutes ago, carbking said:

Typically, a kit for the early Marvel carb will contain:

 

Fuel valve (a.k.a. needle and seat)

Float (new pontoon only, reuse the float arm)

Air valve spring

Fillister head assembly screws

Complete set of gaskets, including the mounting gasket.

Seals, when used.

 

Other items not in the kits are often available.

 

I apologize for the time frame. As I passed retirement age more than a decade ago, I am no longer willing to work 90~100 hours a week; although I still average about 40. There are some things in life (example: family) that are more important than the manufacture of rebuilding kits. As we offer more than 10,000 different rebuilding kits to motor enthusiasts (we do car, truck, tractor, marine, and industrial); we are generally behind, sometimes very behind.

 

And with Marvel, about the only components for which there is a large interchange from carburetor to carburetor are the round fiber washers, and the Fillister-headed screws. Mass reproduction of parts of which you sell three a year (or fewer) is not economically smart! Thus, the kits are custom-made.

 

I keep hoping I will find some youngster in his/her 40's/50's that would enjoy the business, and would like to acquire it. There are hungry fish in the Lake of the Ozarks that keep calling my name! ;) It might be nice to answer them!

 

Jon.

 

Thanks for the reply and information, Jon! 

 

Go get those fish, before THEY retire! (but make up some Marvel kits before you do)☺️

Edited by 27donb (see edit history)
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51 minutes ago, carbking said:

Typically, a kit for the early Marvel carb will contain:

 

Fuel valve (a.k.a. needle and seat)

Float (new pontoon only, reuse the float arm)

Air valve spring

Fillister head assembly screws

Complete set of gaskets, including the mounting gasket.

Seals, when used.

 

Other items not in the kits are often available.

 

I apologize for the time frame. As I passed retirement age more than a decade ago, I am no longer willing to work 90~100 hours a week; although I still average about 40. There are some things in life (example: family) that are more important than the manufacture of rebuilding kits. As we offer more than 10,000 different rebuilding kits to motor enthusiasts (we do car, truck, tractor, marine, and industrial); we are generally behind, sometimes very behind.

 

And with Marvel, about the only components for which there is a large interchange from carburetor to carburetor are the round fiber washers, and the Fillister-headed screws. Mass reproduction of parts of which you sell three a year (or fewer) is not economically smart! Thus, the kits are custom-made.

 

I keep hoping I will find some youngster in his/her 40's/50's that would enjoy the business, and would like to acquire it. There are hungry fish in the Lake of the Ozarks that keep calling my name! ;) It might be nice to answer them!

 

Jon.

 

Hello Jon,

 

would you a Kit ready for a 1927 Buick Standard Model 27 Marvel Carb?

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067C2421-CECA-40BB-A882-6B44C2FE1063.jpeg

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Ok so carb is nearly totally disassembled, got metering pin out and the felt collar, where can I find just the metering pin fleet collar if I am willing to make the gaskets myself?

 

and also this hole in the metering pin, it had gunk in it, got the funk out but does the hole go all the way thru to the top of the metering pin itself?

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FB3BD380-3436-4B11-95DA-14C8900BC6FB.jpeg

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1 hour ago, Hubert_25-25 said:

I do not think that hole in the side of the metering pin goes anywhere.  www.restorationstuff.com sells felt in various thicknesses.  

 

Happen to know the correct felt I’d need??

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I bought a piece of felt in 1/8 and 1/4" thickness.  I ordered them 3" x 3".   I have used it in various places on the car.  Look at the condition of the felt that is around your floor pedals.  This is probably worn out.  If you buy the correct size pieces for them, there is probably enough extra left over that you can make the metering pin felt from the scraps.  The size to cut it is on the photo in an earlier post.

 

I also have a set of hole punches - you can get these on Ebay.  

 

felt.thumb.JPG.a8272bc302313fd1af5028c8aec4fdd5.JPG

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/9pcs-Heavy-Duty-Hollow-Leather-Hole-Gasket-Punch-Set-Cutter-Belt-Wad-Puncher-Kit/322740111889?hash=item4b24cf4a11:g:~ToAAOSwy1VZuKrA   

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2 hours ago, Hubert_25-25 said:

I bought a piece of felt in 1/8 and 1/4" thickness.  I ordered them 3" x 3".   I have used it in various places on the car.  Look at the condition of the felt that is around your floor pedals.  This is probably worn out.  If you buy the correct size pieces for them, there is probably enough extra left over that you can make the metering pin felt from the scraps.  The size to cut it is on the photo in an earlier post.

 

I also have a set of hole punches - you can get these on Ebay.  

 

felt.thumb.JPG.a8272bc302313fd1af5028c8aec4fdd5.JPG

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/9pcs-Heavy-Duty-Hollow-Leather-Hole-Gasket-Punch-Set-Cutter-Belt-Wad-Puncher-Kit/322740111889?hash=item4b24cf4a11:g:~ToAAOSwy1VZuKrA   

 

Awesome AGAIN THANK YOU as you guys are a HUGE help for a newcomer like myself!!!!

 

i am going to attempt another angle on the value in the heat riser (I am proud to say I am learning the correct terms for these parts..... for the most part!!), I am going to take a bit of metal rescue in a big cup and put the cup up around the bottom of the heat riser and throttle valve and let it soak overnight and see if it will dissolved whatever is causing the linkage to be frozen in place!!!

 

if that doesn’t work, I have a crow foot boxed in wrench to help be able to remove the two bolts on the backside of the heat riser and have some leverage to remove the two bolts!!!

 

 

Edited by Crazyfamily (see edit history)
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One thing to watch if you are using rust killers is that the part usually needs to be completely submerged or you will see heavy corrosion at the interface of the top of the liquid and the atmosphere.  

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Unfortunately I didn’t get to work on the car today as I had planned to!

 

My oldest Son was about 2 hours away visiting a friend of his and badly hyper extended his knee so he was unable to drive himself home so the Mrs and I drove down and picked him and his truck up and drove them back, so hopefully we will be able to get him into an Orthopedic Dr tomorrow!!

 

 

 

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Ok great news Heat Riser is out!!!!!!

 

i did get the throttle valve /butterfly to move, it’s not actually rust, rather it’s just all gummed up big time!!!!

 

also great news, the inner pipe has been replaced and looks to be solid as well, when the prev owner did the restoration (seems to be everything aside from interior), seems he or whomever did the restoration for him, seemed to do the most problematic areas I guess.

 

is there a way to totally remove the entire throttle/heat control cam mechanism?  It would be nice to totally break the entire assembly down and thoroughly clean each component!

 

unfortunarely it looks like the shaft that goes through the throttle linkage all the way thru the butterfly then thru the heat control cam mechanism that I am referring to seems that it is blunt on bot ends of that shaft so unless I am not seeing it I don’t see how I could totally remove the shaft and break it down???

 

Am I thinking correctly?

 

While I did get the throttle valve/butterfly to move, it is extremely stiff and only moves when the gummmednup area is hot hot hot and then it’s still tough to operate!

 

I have the assembly soaking in metal rescue as we speak.....

 

Bad news of the day, well besides finding out that my Oldest Son might have a torn ACL in his Knee!  He has to get an MRI of it Thursday and then back to Orthopedic Surgeon!

 

So besides that, other bad news After lining the new fuel tank I decided to run the fuel pick up line into the tank and screw it in one time, well new tank is ever so slightly different than original tank or thickness of the tank liner I put in caused the fuel pick up to bottom out and then I turned it the bottom of the filter grabbed onto the liner and when I turned the bolt on top of pick up the brass tube twisted!

 

Tried the local hardware store but they only have copper, I did heat the line up and removed both the bottom filter piece and the top of the pick up from the tube itself, so should be easy to resolder the new line/tube onto the filter and top piece and I’ll cut tube back 1/4 inch so it doesn’t happen again!  Not that I ever plan on removing the newly built and lined fuel tank ever again!!

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Congrats on getting the heat riser out.  Be sure to use neverseize on the threads when reinstalling.  I did not feel that removing the butterfly was going to give me any advantage.  IMO just keep soaking and have patience that the butterfly will free up over time.  If the stiffness is gummy fuel, it will require a strong solvent (carb cleaner).  If it is rust, it will require rust neutralizer and penetrating fluid.  Sounds like it may need a little of both. 

 

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On 3/11/2019 at 11:17 PM, Hubert_25-25 said:

Congrats on getting the heat riser out.  Be sure to use neverseize on the threads when reinstalling.  I did not feel that removing the butterfly was going to give me any advantage.  IMO just keep soaking and have patience that the butterfly will free up over time.  If the stiffness is gummy fuel, it will require a strong solvent (carb cleaner).  If it is rust, it will require rust neutralizer and penetrating fluid.  Sounds like it may need a little of both. 

 

 

I worked on it for a bit last night and I got the butterfly free, it took a few soaks in carb dip and now I am able to move it easily, once I clean it up and get all the carb dip, grease, gum, varnish, and general crud off the riser then I’ll paint it and the rest of the exhaust manifold with some high temp coating from KBS Coatings, their stuff seems high quality!  I used their tank liner kit on the new fuel tank we built as well as the S&W Vacuum Fuel Pump and also used their product to coat the outside of the fuel pump as well, I’ll be using the same KBS Coating system for the outside of the new fuel tank as well.  It’s a moisture cured system so while it stays flexible for expansion and contraction of the metal tank it actually gets harder and stronger with exposure to moisture!  While moisture is normally the enemy, this stuff gets stronger with exposure!

 

 

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For anyone who might be looking for a coating system:

 

https://www.kbs-coatings.com/

 

I am extremely happy so far with their products, only thing is if you get this stuff on your skin and don’t clean it off with thinner IMMEDIATELY then there is no removing it, it has to wear off!  I got a bit on my finger two weeks ago and it’s just now wearing off my skin!

 

for the $$ it seems like a great quality product at a fair price!  Take my comments as a definite referral to KBS!

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so the next step is underway!  I have removed the AC Oil Filter Housing and I will ordering a few of the filters, Fram C31P unless someone has a better recommendation for the filter it’s self, not sure the cross reference on this filter but I’ll check online before ordering the filters.

 

i was pleasantly surprised that for sitting since December 2004 that the oil looked as good as it does, both when I drained the oil and when I took the AC Oil Filter housing apart this evening!

 

just a few shots.....

 

can an you tell I’m excited yet???

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  • 1 month later...

Ok so I’m thinking the float needs adjusted in the carb but I’ll ask anyway!

 

so as soon as I shut the car off gas IMMEDIATELY starts dripping out the weep hole from the cab!

 

thoughts?

 

its a pita to jump out and put the hood up every single time I stop !

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Park the car outside.  Take the top off the carburetor bowl.  You should be able to observe the fuel level while the car is running.   I think the level should be 9/16" from the top of the bowl while running.  If it is running pretty steady, then the float level is OK.  If when you shut the car off, it overflows or rises in level, then the needle and seat need work.

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Ok so does anyone else have a different style “needle and seat” like I do?  

 

Seems  a I don’t have the same style need and seat as others have posted so I’m curious if anyone else has this style and any reported issues w it?

 

i believe this is a newer style carb than the 1927 model year car is.... maybe a 28-29?  But I’m more curious about the style of needle and seat than what year carb.00382E51-0A8E-456F-B670-0C168D248529.thumb.jpeg.da75ac0e55530e9b95797bc68046301d.jpeg

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William, 

    Your carb body is 10-103 which is 1926-1929 Buick Standard.  The brass bowl says 65-26 and that I cannot find, so I do not know if the bowl section is correct or someone changed it.  You should have bowl number 65-517 according to the book.  That would make your car stock.  Maybe Carb King (Jon) can help you get a replacement bowl.    Hugh   

Edited by Hubert_25-25 (see edit history)
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  • 2 months later...

I just want to take a minute to to thank all contributors to this discussion. I removed the Marvel carb from my 26 Buick Master six. I followed some of the suggested procedures ....cleaning & inspecting the unit...after sealing the old cork float with crazy glue & grinding down the venture using my 4.5 " grinder & an 80 grit flap sand disk, I was able to get the correct air gap. I set the carb to factory settings. It starts & runs. Thanks

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