Gearbox problem

[Jamie L Butler]

Hi, the last few times I've gone to take my 26 dodge brothers buckboard for a run the gearbox has made a horrible noise as I reverse out of my driveway, which is inclined upwards to get out. Today it was worse than ever and the car was jumping as if the gears were slipping, to the point I couldn't get the car out of the driveway. Then It started doing it in first gear too and I had to start in second to pull back in and park it up. It seems fine in second but first and reverse are now not working, I can let out the clutch and it just sits there making a horrible noise. When I look in the top of the gearbox, everything looks fine, but it's obviously not. 

Firstly, does anybody know what could be the problem? Secondly, I have a spare gearbox which is in pretty good condition, but I can't see any bolts so I can remove the box from the bell housing. Does anybody have a manual or are able to describe the process involved in removing the gearbox so I can swap them over? I understand I'll need to drop the rear axle and pull it back to disengage the tail shaft from the universal joint, beyond that I'm scratching my head? Will I need to somehow support the rear of the engine and remove the whole gearbox and cross member in one unit? I'm wondering how it unbolts from the engine as it appears the gearbox and bell housing are one piece?

[wayne sheldon]

Several possibilities. Could be the clutch disc breaking apart, or even the pressure plate breaking so that the pressure is lop-sided. It could even be simple adjustment or failed pilot bushing (had that one a few times myself!). Could be a broken U-joint, and I have seen rear end gears or bearings fail/break and transmit enough noise and shaking up the drive shaft to make it sound like it is in the transmission. So look things over, grab and shake anything and everything to look for something moving and/or clunking that should not be (at least not that much).

All that said, it probably is not any of those. From your description, I would guess a bearing inside the transmission has fallen apart allowing some of the gears to run crooked and/or out of line. Do not drive it anymore until you know what it is. They can look okay, but shift position under load causing the noise and jumping around inside.  You should check all the drive-line components, and make sure you find and fix this.

 

I can't help you with specifics on how it comes apart. I have worked on many '10s,' '20s. and '30s cars, Buick, Chevrolet, Studebaker, Ford, Pierce Arrow, Cadillac, and about a dozen others. I have known several people with four cylinder Dodge automobiles, however, I have seldom ever worked on one, and am not familiar with their assemblies. Hopefully, someone that is familiar with them, can chime in soon and offer good advice there.

Is this the truck in your avatar? Would you call that a "ute"?

Good luck!

[Jamie L Butler]

3 hours ago, wayne sheldon said:

Several possibilities. Could be the clutch disc breaking apart, or even the pressure plate breaking so that the pressure is lop-sided. It could even be simple adjustment or failed pilot bushing (had that one a few times myself!). Could be a broken U-joint, and I have seen rear end gears or bearings fail/break and transmit enough noise and shaking up the drive shaft to make it sound like it is in the transmission. So look things over, grab and shake anything and everything to look for something moving and/or clunking that should not be (at least not that much).

All that said, it probably is not any of those. From your description, I would guess a bearing inside the transmission has fallen apart allowing some of the gears to run crooked and/or out of line. Do not drive it anymore until you know what it is. They can look okay, but shift position under load causing the noise and jumping around inside.  You should check all the drive-line components, and make sure you find and fix this.

 

I can't help you with specifics on how it comes apart. I have worked on many '10s,' '20s. and '30s cars, Buick, Chevrolet, Studebaker, Ford, Pierce Arrow, Cadillac, and about a dozen others. I have known several people with four cylinder Dodge automobiles, however, I have seldom ever worked on one, and am not familiar with their assemblies. Hopefully, someone that is familiar with them, can chime in soon and offer good advice there.

Is this the truck in your avatar? Would you call that a "ute"?

Good luck!

Yes Wayne, that's the one. Yes I think what you have described is the problem as it seems to drive ok in second, just not in reverse and first is now bad since reverse went, which is how I discovered second was fine, I used second to park it back in the driveway. Yes it is a ute of sorts, but often the older ones with flat trays like mine are called buckboards. The gearbox started making a noisy whirring sound in neutral last year after ascending a very steep hill in second and then firs and I later discovered the gearbox was low on oil, which I topped up, but I think the damage was done and when in my driveway, with the inspection plate off the gearbox and the engine idling, I held the clutch all the way in with firstly reverse selected and slowly released the clutch, it looked like the lower shaft was shaking from side to side at the front, but in first, similar, but the car did move forward. I'm a mechanic, so yeah I won't be driving it until it's sorted. I've got a good spare gearbox I want to put in to keep it mobile while I pull down the old and rebuild it. I just can't find any manuals detailing the procedure, the oldest car I've pulled the engine and gearbox in and out of and rebuilt was a 52 Plymouth Cranbrook and this is a totally different ball game, but I'll just have to proceed slowly and methodically for the time being! Thanks for your reply Wayne, appreciated.

[Jamie L Butler]

Yes Wayne, that's the one. Yes I think what you have described is the problem as it seems to drive ok in second, just not in reverse and first is now bad since reverse went, which is how I discovered second was fine, I used second to park it back in the driveway. Yes it is a ute of sorts, but often the older ones with flat trays like mine are called buckboards. The gearbox started making a noisy whirring sound in neutral last year after ascending a very steep hill in second and then firs and I later discovered the gearbox was low on oil, which I topped up, but I think the damage was done and when in my driveway, with the inspection plate off the gearbox and the engine idling, I held the clutch all the way in with firstly reverse selected and slowly released the clutch, it looked like the lower shaft was shaking from side to side at the front, but in first, similar, but the car did move forward. I'm a mechanic, so yeah I won't be driving it until it's sorted. I've got a good spare gearbox I want to put in to keep it mobile while I pull down the old and rebuild it. I just can't find any manuals detailing the procedure, the oldest car I've pulled the engine and gearbox in and out of and rebuilt was a 52 Plymouth Cranbrook and this is a totally different ball game, but I'll just have to proceed slowly and methodically for the time being! Thanks for your reply Wayne, appreciated.

Edited February 21, 2019 by Jamie L Butler (see edit history)

[Jamie L Butler]

I'm starting to think the gears are stripped, anyway I'll make that assessment later when I have my spare gearbox here and a Dodge manual. I'm going to have to fix it in my driveway because I don't have a shed, just tarpaulins.

 

[Spinneyhill]

First and reverse and not second makes it sound like something in the first and reverse system. The idler gear or the counter shaft gear. Or bearings of one or both.

 

Your low-oil episode is probably where this started. It may also just be worn out. If it has needle rollers and the lubrication was not so good, the needles might start not rotating and you get "square barrels" instead of cylindrical needles.