PhilAndrews

'51 Chieftain - Transmission overhaul

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13 hours ago, PhilAndrews said:

Is there meant to be a lower bellhousing cover?

Do you mean that cover in the back of the table? The cover for the flywheel?

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4 minutes ago, PhilAndrews said:

Is that just a pressed steel cover?

 

Yup...along with a tiny hole drilled in the bottom, I guess as an indicator of a seal leak up above like I got. Engine will have to be removed to fix that one. I hate leaks and I pretty much got it dry except for that one. I'm sure that cover would be available and not that expensive. Wouldn't want any debris hitting the flywheel. 

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There's a bunch of random tinware missing from mine. I need to replace the crank ventilation tube also.

 

I think I may paint the engine the correct shade of green while it's out. 

 

What color should the gearbox be?

 

Phil

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I painted my engine the blue/green colour and got it from Bill Hirsh. I'm very happy with the brushability and durability but I've only ran it one summer. Can't help you with the trans...couldn't find much info on it. Mine is a combination orange and metallic blue....probably the past owners left overs! 

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That sounds very.. eighties. I think I'll stick with the light gray, it's a sensible color.

 

I'm going to get something approximately Pontiac green for this go around.

 

Thanks

 

 

Phil

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1 hour ago, PhilAndrews said:

That sounds very.. eighties. I think I'll stick with the light gray, it's a sensible color.

 

Haha....agreed. I wasn't so concerned about the hydramatic colour....you can't really see it from above and looked a lot harder to paint installed. You've got the convenience of removal so go at it. 

 

I didn't like the blue/green when I first put it on but it grew on me and now I love it! I painted the horn, air cleaner, battery cover, inner fenders etc. semi gloss black and like that look too.

 

Cheers,

Mark

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Edited by Summershandy
add picture (see edit history)

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That looks really smart!

 

I'm going for a similar look, only the black items are gloss enamel instead.

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To

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I like the shiny black. I figured I couldn't make it look any worse!

 

Phil

Edited by PhilAndrews (see edit history)

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I like gloss and flat also. Looked at a lot of examples for results that I liked. It's one question you can't ask anyone else but yourself!

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22 hours ago, PhilAndrews said:

Is there meant to be a lower bellhousing cover?

 

The manual picture looks like there should be.

 

Phil

yes, pontiac engines have a sheet metal lower flywheel/torus cover. p/n 515090 1948 to 1954 pontiacs.

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8 hours ago, PhilAndrews said:

Yeah that. Is that just a pressed steel cover?

 

Mine is missing in that case.

 

Phil

yes, it is stamped steel.

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8 hours ago, Summershandy said:

 

Yup...along with a tiny hole drilled in the bottom, I guess as an indicator of a seal leak up above like I got. Engine will have to be removed to fix that one. I hate leaks and I pretty much got it dry except for that one. I'm sure that cover would be available and not that expensive. Wouldn't want any debris hitting the flywheel. 

so is your rear engine rope seal leaking ?

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15 minutes ago, pontiac1953 said:

so is your rear engine rope seal leaking ?

 

That's what I figure....it's a minor leak with a more major fix. I'll cross that bridge when I get there. I didn't get the car on the road as soon as I wanted to last year and I'd like to enjoy it a little more this summer. Which by the way, are very very short up here in Northern Ontario!

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I did however, fix the front crank seal which was leaking really bad when I got the car. Of course, I didn't have to remove the engine, crankshaft or transmission for that one......

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4 hours ago, Summershandy said:

I did however, fix the front crank seal which was leaking really bad when I got the car. Of course, I didn't have to remove the engine, crankshaft or transmission for that one......

the rear rope seal can be replace with the engine in the car, dropping the oil pan, removing the rear main cap and using a "sneeky pete" tool to remove and install the upper half of the rope seal.

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9 hours ago, pontiac1953 said:

the rear rope seal can be replace

 

9 hours ago, pontiac1953 said:

using a "sneeky pete"

 

Interesting....this "sneeky pete" prevents having to drop the crank as the manual states? I'll have to check into that...thanks for the heads up!👍

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Summershanty, How did you clean your motor in the car?  did you remove the manifolds? did you gas to clean the grease and oil?  I have a 37 Olds straight with all the front sheet metal off? I know with bare metal just use wire brushes..  Thanks for your reply.  Your motor looks very nice.

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Edited by GARY F (see edit history)

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10 minutes ago, GARY F said:

Summershanty, How did you clean your motor in the car?  did you remove the manifolds? did you gas to clean the grease and oil?  I have a 37 Olds straight with all the front sheet metal off? I know with bare metal just use wire brushes..  Thanks for your reply.  Your motor looks very nice.

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i would use brake part cleaner, comes in a handy aerosol can and evaporates rather quickly leaving the cast iron very clean.

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36 minutes ago, pontiac1953 said:

i would use brake part cleaner, comes in a handy aerosol can and evaporates rather quickly leaving the cast iron very clean.

 

Charles nailed it. The brake cleaner works really well. Of course if you have any heavy build up (like I did) you need to get most off you can. Any degreaser will help but you don't want any residues left behind. Lots of elbow grease, stout rags and wire brushes. My manifold had to go in to be machined so it was off. I painted the intake same colour still attached to the exhaust manifold. The exhaust manifold I just took a wire wheel drill and gave at it. I liked the raw look. I didn't plan on painting the engine but after I had so much stripped off I realized, it was now or never. I'm a man of patience and when the car was up in the air getting checked over ready for the road, my mechanic asked, "did you remove the engine to paint it?"....he couldn't believe I didn't......

 

 

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As it's an unknown quantity, I've loosened off a few random head bolts to attach lifting chains, I decided to pull the head to inspect inside the top end.

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Deck looks okay, needs a gentle clean and checking with a straight edge.

 

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Head looks good, there is a bit of variance in color across the pots but the manifold hadn't been tightened correctly and wasn't sealing correctly across its width and the valve lash was terrible.

 

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The gasket looks fairly recent. Not sure if this type can be reused?

 

The pistons are all forty thou' over, and a couple of the bores have fairly heavy hone marks on them still, none are badly scored or ridged.

 

I'm going to replace the head bolts because a number are corroded quite badly on the neck. I'm going to get myself a tap too and chase the holes in the block clean.

Thermostat, a bit of paint and I'm going to call it on the engine.

 

Next question- how do you split the gearbox from the engine correctly?

 

Phil

 

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1 hour ago, PhilAndrews said:

As it's an unknown quantity, I've loosened off a few random head bolts to attach lifting chains, I decided to pull the head to inspect inside the top end.

20190222_182150.thumb.jpg.44f7523aaea6cdf10672b377273d8ca4.jpg

Deck looks okay, needs a gentle clean and checking with a straight edge.

 

20190222_182104.thumb.jpg.0e35ae8017e3feb4b089af03c8461384.jpg

Head looks good, there is a bit of variance in color across the pots but the manifold hadn't been tightened correctly and wasn't sealing correctly across its width and the valve lash was terrible.

 

20190222_182108.thumb.jpg.fee2b25cfdfa30af5a91e34ffaf126c3.jpg

The gasket looks fairly recent. Not sure if this type can be reused?

 

The pistons are all forty thou' over, and a couple of the bores have fairly heavy hone marks on them still, none are badly scored or ridged.

 

I'm going to replace the head bolts because a number are corroded quite badly on the neck. I'm going to get myself a tap too and chase the holes in the block clean.

Thermostat, a bit of paint and I'm going to call it on the engine.

 

Next question- how do you split the gearbox from the engine correctly?

 

Phil

 

hi phil, you don't want to reuse the old head gasket, on removing the transmission, there are 30 bolts holding the torus member to the flywheel, and 6 bell housing bolts, after you have the trans unbolted, slide back about 2 inches and then raise the rear of the engine so the torus flange will clear the bell housing.

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1 minute ago, pontiac1953 said:

hi phil, you don't want to reuse the old head gasket, on removing the transmission, there are 30 bolts holding the torus member to the flywheel, and 6 bell housing bolts, after you have the trans unbolted, slide back about 2 inches and then raise the rear of the engine so the torus flange will clear the bell housing.

also do NOT run a tap through the 30 threaded holes in the flywheel, you'll ruin the interference threads there if you do. interference threads are there to act like a lock washer and keeps the 30 bolts from coming loose.

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Figured not- it it's only copper fire rings with some sort of composite innards.

 

I wasn't going to tap the flywheel, but than you for the warning nevertheless. A lot of people don't realize the different thread types used.

I'm only going to gently run the correct size tap down the threads of the head bolt holes as they are full of crud and rust, some stuck, some were tight some came undone correctly. None felt like they were torqued to the same ballpark. Manual states clean threads with a film of lead white on them to torque up.

 

I'm going to eyeball the valve seats too. Everything passed the first calibrated eyeball visual though.

 

Going to make a shopping list;

 

Gearbox seal rebuild kit

Head gasket

Head bolt set

Thermostat + gasket

 

 

 

Phil

Edited by PhilAndrews (see edit history)
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