rjp

26 11a visor installation

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Anyone got a good short story on how that all goes together?

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What is "that all" that you're asking about? 

 

Do you have some photos of what you've got you can post?

 

Roger

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Sorry about that ,the 1st part never came through. Iam working on a 26 11a Victoria and was trying to figure out how the visor attaches to the car, or the window hinge. What I can tell is the hinge cover is made from the same visor material.My windshield outer  frame is only about 1/2 inch from the top , so very little room for a strip of metal. I have looked in the drawings and really cant tell what Iam looking at. Any help would be good. Thanks 

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It looks like the visor part number 32954 has a flap of material that is above the edge of the frame 

image.png.6e22e5592f00362c5026fa5ac41ec972.png

 

and then a strip of metal ½" wide  (part 32952) goes on top of that to fasten it above the window. My car is currently missing its visor, but I do have a badly worn out one that I need to get refurbished and then fitted to the car .

 

Roger

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when your saying above the window is that the vertical above the window or horizontal on lower side of the roof

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7 minutes ago, rjp said:

when your saying above the window is that the vertical above the window or horizontal on lower side of the roof

 

The small vertical space above the window I would expect - that's where the ones I've seen are fitted to. As I said my car doesn't have a visor on it, and whoever did the bodywork covered over all the screw holes that would have been left behind (but I do have the screw holes and screws for where the supporting arms fasten to the pillars).

 

I'll be at the Gilmore Car Museum a week from today and can take a look at the yellow boattail car that's there.

 

Roger

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great, thanks my wood was all replaced also, so no screw holes. Thanks a bunch I should be able to get something going.  I t will be a week or two for me, getting metal for the visor frame tomorrow. maybe upholstery the 1st of month. Thanks a lot and have a good time at the museum. 

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36 minutes ago, rjp said:

Thanks a lot and have a good time at the museum.

 

I usually do - I'm a volunteer down there, as well as representing the Franklin Club at the Museum's Advisory Committee meetings, so I'm down there usually a couple of times a month at least during Winter and more often in the Summer.

 

Roger

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That's neat. There isn't much out here. I am in wash. state next to the Idaho border about 60 miles south of Spokane. Some day I would to see a museum with some franklins.

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The visors do not attach above the windshield hinge, they get fastened to the underside of the roof's front edge over-hang. Look for small screw holes up under there.

 

The top and bottom pieces of the visor covering get sewn together, with it's edge binding. The end that fastens to the car is left open, like a long pocket.  The cast iron frame, and it's felt fillers and wrappings  are then slid into the pocket and the pocket edge is sewn shut to form a long flap edge  - like in the drawing detail Kiwi posted above. See drawing 32085.

 

Then that flap is fastened up under the roof overhang with a small piece of 1/2 round aluminum moulding - painted black. 

 

 

FYI - wind shield hinge seals.

Up until Series 153, the windshield hinges were covered in scraps of imitation leather  left over from what was used for roof coverings (same as they did with fender welting).   The ends of the hinge seal get left about a 3/4 inch too long. That excess gets folded into the hinge when it's installed into the body to help seal the end gaps. If you were to cut the hinge seal strip the same length as the hinge it will leak at the ends in a driving rain.

 

Use autobody caulk, or weather-strip adhesive to seal the hinge seal to the windshield frame and opening, or it will leak there in a driving rain.

 

Paul

DSCN6782.JPG

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@PFitz - Paul - thanks for that photo - so my 11A Sedan is not at all like that - there is no overhang of the roof above the window.

 

IMG_5496.thumb.JPG.4e3a257cc02f4205b4ffbaa946cf537a.JPG

 

so the visor must have been fitted on that area above the window - about 2" or a wee bit more high?!

 

And the plastic? seal that is around the hinge is not as you described and showed - it's cut flush at the end of the hinge, and that area of the front of the car somewhere has leaked a number of times in the rain - both when the car is standing still and it's really raining, and when driving it in the rain, but not hard rain. I've put window sealer along the top of the frame part that is in the car, and down the side as you can see in that image. I'll see if I can work some into the ends of that to block it off - I'm not excited about trying to remove the window to put a new seal across there.

 

The car must at some stage have had a visor as the screws that hold the support brackets to the pillar are screwed into the pillar on both sides, but no sign of any screw holes above the window - presumably filled when the car was painted.

 

I have a visor off an 11A Sport Sedan that is in very rough shape, but the metal frame is intact and the two support arms are there, albeit one is missing the wing nut that locks it in place. Do you know of anyone skilled in rebuilding a visor? Anyone reading this that has a spare one of those wing nuts?

 

Thanks

 

Roger

 

Edited by theKiwi (see edit history)

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Roger.

Some did, and some didn't have an overhang to the front of the roof. Either way, if you look at other Ser 11 you'll see that the attachment point of the visor would still be about the same height above the windshield hinge.

 

Look across the  windshield header toward a good light and see if you can notice where any paint or filler has made a "ghost" of screw holes because it shrunk a tiny bit.

 

The front of yours has obviously been changed so I wouldn't put much faith in that hinge seal being the original - especially since it leaks. I've seen a few originals and they all wrap excess length  around the end of the hinge and tucked it into the hinge to prevent the leaks you have.  Plus, all the ones I've seen have some type of grain pattern. Yours looks too smooth in that picture. The factory made use of the roof material scraps - for those hinge seals and the fender piping. They even used a lot of the same scraps inside the car for the side and rear boxing of seat cushions and tie-down straps for the spring frames to the seat wooden frames, and the inside pocket of the registration pockets in the kick panel under the passenger side  of the dash board .  All those hidden scraps are grained just like the roofs.

 

Paul

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Thanks Paul

 

When it warms up a wee bit, and my strained/sprained shoulder settles down a bit I'll go take a closer look for the missing screw holes.

 

The "thing" that covers my hinge is I'm sure new. I'm not sure exactly what it is, but its' not very thick, and is smooth. I think as a first attempt (well actually it will be the 3rd or 4th) I'll run a bead of black silicone across the gap between that plastic and the window frame, and the plastic and the car frame, and try and seal up the ends with black RTV too.

 

I haven't seen any scraps as you describe used anywhere else in the car - one thing I did notice was that along some of the gaps in the floorboards there are strips of a linoleum type substance tacked over - eg where the wire for the rear dome light runs. It seems similar to the chunk of a reddish coloured linoleum type substance that was in the bottom of the tool compartment under the driver's seat.

 

Thanks

 

Roger

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Often, those places that Franklin used the roof scraps are not replaced when interiors are restored, or repaired.  

 

I've had to opportunity to work on some very original cars. When we redo upholstery, we use roof material scraps  (cobra grain) the same way and places that the factory did.

 

Here's a common example - a rear seat cushion for a 153 sedan. Notice the cobra grain boxing starting part way on the sides - where it wouldn't be seen in place - and it wraps around the rear. Just as the original had it. And as the originally reason for doing that, the top material holds up to chaffing better at all the rubbing it gets with people getting in and out of the back seat, as the seat cushion rubs up against the upholstery on either side of it.  The broad cloth can not withstand that rubbing near as well.  They also did it with leather seats, too.

 

Paul

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Edited by PFitz (see edit history)
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44 minutes ago, PFitz said:

Often, those places that Franklin used the roof scraps are not replaced when interiors are restored, or repaired.  

 

 

Yes, that is the situation in my car - it has been reupholstered "recently" before I bought it, so all new fabric right through it.

 

Roger

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51 minutes ago, theKiwi said:

 

Yes, that is the situation in my car - it has been reupholstered "recently" before I bought it, so all new fabric right through it.

 

Roger

 

Sadly, many upholstery shops don't bother with details like that, even when they have the original, or good pictures, to go by. Many don't even bother to re-bag and clip the springs so that the spring sets work as they were designed to do - give comfortable support.  

 

BTW.  Franklin didn't use those top material scraps just to cut corners to save money. They used them in places that the upholstery material would not hold up as well to the chaffing wear of everyday use. Or as with mounting spring sets to the wooden seat framing, the top material is stronger in tension than upholstery material, in addition to, it wears better than canvas webbing. And, they used that method with leather upholstery, too.

 

Paul

Edited by PFitz (see edit history)
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When I made my sunvisor for my 11B coupe, I used a piece of solid aluminum for the visor and then beveled three edges.  This made a nice, even visor.  This probably could be done with a nice piece of white oak or yellow pine as well.  Would last for a hundred years the way the cars are garaged today.    

Series 11 A does not have a roof overhang.  I'll check mine tonight to see where the visor attached.  

I may have a sunvisor bracket around. 

JR

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45 minutes ago, ak said:

I may have a sunvisor bracket around. 

 

 

If you have a spare bracket, I'd be interested in at least the wing nut off it, or the whole bracket - I have two brackets, but am missing one of the wing nuts that lock the sliding parts together to adjust the visor angle. This part here

image.png.1a804d4c5a294099f1605fa03e12d661.png

 

Roger

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To attach the visor on Ser 11A that doesn't have a front roof overhang (the coupes did) try drawing number 31908. It's 3/4 inch aluminum "bull nose"  molding. After July of 26 it was replaced by drawing 34393, which is a 1/2 inch aluminum half-round molding.

 

Paul

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