1922 Oil pan removal

[Mark Kikta 422]

Well,  I decided to drain my oil pan and remove it to clean it out today. When nothing came out of the drain, I knew it would be a mess inside. Removed the bell housing and I was amazed by the size of that flywheel.  What a monster!  Removed the pan and as expected the sludge was about 3/4” think.  The mice in Florida are just as you have all said,  made a huge nest in the bell housing/clutch.  

[Brian_Heil 1,378]

Good for you. 

 

I’m always amazed at the number of people who will not do this simple task on a new acquisition. 

 

Clean the pick-up screen too. And since it is a common issue, I would pull the oil pump cover and check for deep grooving of the cover by the gears.  Resurface it if needed. 

 

Look up at the cam lobes too. Check for bad lobes or bad grooves in the lobes due to bad lifter roller. 

 

If you really want to know, grab the loosest rod cap and plasti-gauge it. Watch out for those small shims at the cap split line. 

Edited December 29, 2018 by Brian_Heil (see edit history)

[Mark Kikta 422]

Thanks for the advice Brian.

 

I plan to try to clean the crank and cam as good as I can.  Still need to find out why it is still frozen up. I will do as you said with everything.  

 

Been soaking cylinders with marvel mystery oil first and atf second.  

 

Wonder if lifters are frozen?  I haven’t checked them yet. 

[Brian_Heil 1,378]

I must have missed that you are working on a frozen engine.  Apologies.  

 

Pack your patience

 

Soak, soak and soak some more 

 

Did I mention you should soak?  Ha. Use whatever your favorite brew is.  I won’t get in that discussion either. 

 

Most common is the piston to bore.  

 

Second is valves in the cages so pop pushrods out of rockers to save bending a push rod. 

 

I’ve heard of starter generators locking up, I assume because they are external and can get moisture in there.  Same thing with lifters, I’ve heard of it but in an extreme case with other things frozen first/also. 

 

Work on the bores first and pop the pushrods. 

 

Does the clutch release?  The multi disc Buick clutch likes to lock up too with corrosion. 

[Mark Kikta 422]

Brian,

 

rocker arms are removed and free

valves are free

water pump pump is not frozen

have not been able to remove the pin in the shaft between the water pump and starter however

 

[Morgan Wright 767]

Another thing that can freeze is the water pump. Real easy to check, just remove the two hoses, and remove the one bolt on the bottom of the pump, should be 9/16. If the pump is not frozen you can now move the pump around the shaft. You don't have to remove the shaft or the taper pins or anything else. Just one bolt and 2 hoses.

 

Well, for 1918 anyway.

[Mark Kikta 422]

Morgan,

 

Thats exactly what I did.  Removed hoses and 2 mounting bolts so I could rotate water pump housing. Now I need to isolate the starter/gen.

[Morgan Wright 767]

10 hours ago, Mark Kikta said:

Morgan,

 

Thats exactly what I did.  Removed hoses and 2 mounting bolts so I could rotate water pump housing. Now I need to isolate the starter/gen.

 

Just turn on the ignition and see if the motor spins. It doesn't engage the flywheel by itself in these cars.

[Mark Kikta 422]

Well I cleaned out my pan today and found two pinholes in it. Also cleaned the outside. Looks much better

[23hack 51]

Good for you ! I have never regretted taking down an oil pan with unknown history. You don't know what you'll find. Always worth the solvent, paint, gaskets, and new oil. Too many lazy people drive old cars.

[Brian_Heil 1,378]

Forgive me for mentioning it, but fill the six troughs before reinstalling the pan. You can add the remaining 6 qts once the pan is in place to help make it lighter when lifting it and not have a tidal wave of oil sloshing around. 

 

Where were the pin holes?

[Mark Kikta 422]

23hack,  where in Western Pa do you live?   All of my family was from Western, Pa. Uniontown, Connellsville area.

 

 

 

Brian,

 

Pinholes were just in front of the rear baffle. May call you today,

 

[Robert Engle 84]

Remove and clean the oil distribution tube.  With that much gunk, the tube is probably half full of gunk also.  

 

Bob Engle

[dibarlaw 1,443]

4 hours ago, Mark Kikta said:

23hack,  where in Western Pa do you live?   All of my family was from Western, Pa. Uniontown, Connellsville area.

 

 

 

Brian,

 

Pinholes were just in front of the rear baffle. May call you today,

 

Mark:

 Western PA was my stomping grounds for my first 29 years. I had relatives in Uniontown. I was originally from Monongahela.

 Now for the last 34 years in Chambersburg.

[Jim Bourque 43]

Cam can rust in its bearings.

Jim

[Morgan Wright 767]

The flywheel is not as massive as it looks from the bottom. The ring gear is wide, sure, but the flywheel itself is not that thick, it's sort of hollow in the back except for 3 big bolts to hold the clutch on. 

[Mark Kikta 422]

I saw that today.  That ring gear and teeth are sure larger than I have ever seen

[unimogjohn 197]

Mark, I hate to say it, but mine was stuck for almost three years.  In the end it was just a slight bit of rust between the piston rings and the bores.  The previous owner had left the spark plugs out during storage and his container had a lot of moisture in it.  Every day I would squirt in more aft/acetone into the cylinders and press/jump on the hand crank, being careful to hold on to something so I would not fall over in case it let go.  Then one day the rust just gave up and the engine as free.  It was a very happy day indeed.  I really did not care about the time it took as there was always something else to do.  I guess the moral of this story is patience and do not harm.  Good luck.

 

 

[Mark Kikta 422]

Thanks John,

 

I’m trying to be patient and squirting also.  I may take a couple of caps off to see the condition of the Babbitt bearings.  Great pictures.

[Mark Kikta 422]

I took one bearing cap off the crank and one off of one rod.  Still had the shims on both and they came off easily.  I think it’s just the pistons that are stuck.  But I lightly tapped on the piston under side and it moved in the cylinder slightly.

[DonMicheletti 594]

Journal and babbit look really good.

Plastigage them  and see what the clearance is - that will give you some general idea of the general condition of the engine.

 

 

[unimogjohn 197]

 

 

Wow, those bearings look really dry, even for sitting so long.  Getting just a little movement is a good thing.  It will allow the ATF to get past the rings easier.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[Mark Kikta 422]

I switched from Marvel Mystery Oil to ATF and acetone yesterday.  The bearings look dry because I sprayed them with brake clean to see how they cleaned up. I hope to get some plastigage and see what I get.  Does anyone know what the clearances should be?

[Robert Engle 84]

.001" per inch of journal diameter is the general guideline.  

 

Bob Engle

[unimogjohn 197]

It was recommended to me to use .002.  All of them were within that range, and it was newly rebuilt.