twin6

Then and now: where did these prewar cars go?

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There must have been a special on brown paint early in the decade!

 

Could be an early Bill Harrah's tour........

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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More Popes.  The 1910 at rest belonged to Bill Johnson of Rhode Island, and the 1909 belonged to the Remingtons of Rochester, NY.  Does anyone know where these are today?

Johnson.jpg

1909.jpg

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I first saw the Remington Pope in an early Floyd Clymer book. It may have been the same white Pope the McGee brothers repainted black, very sharp looking car. Bob 

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The Pope Hartford on the right was my fathers Plez Nance and is a 1909 Pope. This is and old faded color photo and the brown color should be maroon. The other Pope Hartford  ( 3rd from the the right) in the photo is a 1913 Pope Hartford that belong to John Ogden of San Diego. The photo was probably taken on a La Jolla Regional Group local tour. All the other cars in the photo were cars owned by La Jolla members. John Ogden’s Pope  now belongs to John’s son James of San Diego. My dads Pope now belongs to my brother Bill Nance of San Diego and is now being restored. 

 

John

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On 1/14/2019 at 8:23 AM, Curti said:

My hobby is building them. I like the challenge of restoring a car the way it sat on the showroom floor after dealer prep.

When I get done with one I start on another. If I want a great driving experience I hop in the late model Corvette.

Yes, but I have seen you driving plenty of them in Auburn for ACD festival too :)

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On 1/14/2019 at 6:02 PM, SC38DLS said:

Did you see the Duesenberg J sold for $850,000 and a Cadillac V16 sold for $155,000 At Mecum. I would have thought they both would have gone for more. 

Dave S 

It just depends on the car and depends on the interest level too (ie Mecum is trying, but they are still thought of more as 50, 60's, 70's market and if a Duesenberg buyer or V-16 buyer is not reviewing their website, and ... then really any car can go with little notice to them).  The Duesenberg, while beautifully restored is a reproduction bodied car (Fran Roxas does incredibly nice work though) and the Cadillac is a closed car (Coupe) and strikes me as pretty well done though I spotted a few interior authenticity issues and possibly older restoration (I do not recall ever seeing the car in person and that is always a test).

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)
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3 hours ago, edinmass said:

There must have been a special on brown paint early in the decade!

 

Could be an early Bill Harrah's tour........

Friends call that "stay around brown" (aka the brown cars stayed a long time on the dealer lots)

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The photo was taken some time around 1959 to 1961 in the San Diego area. The restoration of the 1909 Pope Hartford was completed in 1959. 

 

John

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The 14 Lewis lived in the Vancouver BC area about 30 years ago. One of our club members brought it in from the USA. He tried to tour it but it wouldn't stay cool. The rad was too small. I believe he eventually put an additional rad under the car. Shortly after he sold it back into the states. Seems like a long time ago now!

Ken

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Thank you to all who have contribute to identify the cars!  It's great to learn a bit about what happened to them over the decades.  Here are a couple Rolls Royces  in the 1950's, the first with Stan Tarnopol at the wheel, and the second a mystery (at least to me).

Stan.jpg

101.jpg

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That VMCCA movie is priceless!  Thank you so much for posting it.  I've taken the liberty of posting links to it on the Horseless Carriage Club and Model T websites for others to enjoy.

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584864018_39923VMCCAMeet1LRX.thumb.jpg.d4a5ba2cf4082d76eba7e62802afec1e.jpg

 

It's very exciting to see the battered 1905 Glidden Trophy out in natural elements at the VMCCA Meet.

 

990317430_GliddenTrophy1910NLChalmers.jpg.10c0d5d075c3618f0366071caebaaeea.jpg

1910 Nathan Lazarnick photo of the Glidden Trophy.

Even then, it appears that the little silver 1901 Napier, perched atop

the trophy, representing the car the Gilddens used on their multi-year

world tour is missing or perhaps just removed for safety's sake.

 

1690898343_GliddenTrophyAdj.thumb.jpg.c4dc5fdfc6ff26e7f84d8381cdb995fe.jpg

 

Its porcelain enameled finish shows plenty of abuse, and recent images indicate major touch-ups.

 

Thanks to the AACA Library & Research Center for bringing that early 16mm color film back to life!

 

TG

Edited by TG57Roadmaster (see edit history)
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Bob,

 

The Glidden Trophy lives at the headquarters of the AAA outside Orlando. The Anderson Trophy,

donated in 1911 by the city of Anderson, SC is at our county museum for another year.

 

1275774595_TrophyCHSide1X.jpg.9488845fd1de63a3de327e43b2313fa7.jpg

 

In 2007, we arranged for AAA to share the Anderson Trophy's possession on a biannual rotational basis with our county museum.

 

TG

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On 1/16/2019 at 5:59 PM, John_Mereness said:

It just depends on the car and depends on the interest level too (ie Mecum is trying, but they are still thought of more as 50, 60's, 70's market and if a Duesenberg buyer or V-16 buyer is not reviewing their website, and ... then really any car can go with little notice to them).  The Duesenberg, while beautifully restored is a reproduction bodied car (Fran Roxas does incredibly nice work though) 

 

850k for that is plenty of money.  If it was real it would be 2-3 million bucks or more.  Reproduction coachwork sits in a narrow space.

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Apologies for the tint.  A well protected Stoddard Dayton at an event in 1955.

1955.jpg

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Looks to be a 1909 Model K. 1909 was the last year to have straight rear fenders. Wheels look to be later demountable type wheels.

 

John

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A couple Packard 8 runabouts I'd love to connect to cars on the roster.  First one was owned when the photo was taken (1960's?) by Art Kenniff of Southold, Long Island. It sports a 1926 NY plate. The other is a complete mystery but dual rear spares was not a common setup, which might help someone recognize the car.

runabout 1.jpg

runabout 2.JPG

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Twin6, those two Packards remind me of the pair of late '20s Packard roadsters (one a boat tail), that Sat on the North side of the Sheridan Market for far too many years. North of Seattle on Bothell Way at about the 15+xxx level on the R.H. side Northbound, the market still stands, vacant. I remember the cars back in the late '50s, into the early'60s. They sat for several years, poorly tended. They were tenuously covered in various degrees by canvas tarps in all the misery Seattle precipitation could inflict on them. Maybe some Old Lion who roamed the area in that era knows/remembers.? Harold  ? Anyone ?  Far too valuable even back then for the scrap heap, someone obviously did not value them enough. Maybe after their neglect at the market, they were scrapped.

 

While I am up : What happened to Felix Derjinsky 's Rolls Royce  ?        -   Carl 

 

P.S. Maybe someone up on early 20th century Russian history will know from whom Derjinsky "acquired" the RR, and under what circumstances.

Edited by C Carl
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Re: Stoddard-Dayton - Ray W. Rodgers of Warren, Ohio drove a "Stoddard-Dayton 1909 Speedster" on the 1955 Glidden Tour.  Interestingly, the article on the tour includes a photo of the Remington Pope-Hartford, which looks like it was taken just before the family put on their jackets for the color photo that was posted earlier.

 

Rodgers also drove his car in the 1956 Granville, Ohio rally.  It rained - maybe the posted photo is from that event, what with the covers on the brass.  He had it at Hershey in '57, and at Lake Forest in '58, where the next photo was taken.  If it's the same car, it must have been re-restored -  gas tank moved, different demountable wheels.  Still has the big spotlight, though.

1958-22-4_AntiqueAutomobile_Rodgers.jpg.cf08315105265ea9dcd90b500b9593aa.jpg

 

By 1964, it had one of those amazing exhaust organs.

1964-28-1_AntiqueAutomobile_Rodgers.jpg.eb8902c50b56057c8f33baa8d641f77c.jpg

 

Rodgers advertised it for sale in 1965, and by the time of the Swigart Museum meet in 1966, it was owned by Joel Finn.  (Voted Most Popular Car.)

1966-30-6_AntiqueAutomobile_Finn.jpg.04bf93a89a3fcc7c6384488f22ee078f.jpg

 

At that point the trail goes cold...

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I think it is the Stoddard Dayton that is at the Seal Cove Museum in Maine.The Museum list it as a 1910 but it is a 1909 Stoddard Dayton. Try this url.  https://www.sealcoveautomuseum.org/collection-test/1910-stoddard-dayton/

All 1909 Stoddard Daytons had straight rear fenders and 1/2 olliptical real springs. All 1910 Stoddard Daytons changed to round rear fenders and 3/4 olliptical rear springs. My brother was at the museum and ask to look at the engine to see if it was a single rocker engine but they would not let him. He said the chassis was definitely a 1909 chassis.

 

John

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