mikesbrunn

radial tires

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9 hours ago, John_Mereness said:

46709209_10157069460497189_7684756773940494336_n.jpg

 

What is that picture showing? I dont see a broken wheel just a flat tire. I dont think anybody said radials go flat any easier. I thought we were talking about radials breaking wheels? Flat tires happen all the time. I have to agree that I have never seen a broken wheel from a radial.

 

By the way I have used radials on my 56' Olds 98 since 1984. Four set's of them. Never any issues I just replace when they start to feel old. I know its not an older car like some others but the wheels are the same design as 40's cars maybe even some 30's. I dont know if I would put them on a car with wood wheels or anything like that but steel wheels should handle it no problem.

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10 hours ago, billorn said:

 

What is that picture showing? I dont see a broken wheel just a flat tire. I dont think anybody said radials go flat any easier. I thought we were talking about radials breaking wheels? Flat tires happen all the time. I have to agree that I have never seen a broken wheel from a radial.

 

By the way I have used radials on my 56' Olds 98 since 1984. Four set's of them. Never any issues I just replace when they start to feel old. I know its not an older car like some others but the wheels are the same design as 40's cars maybe even some 30's. I dont know if I would put them on a car with wood wheels or anything like that but steel wheels should handle it no problem.

It is actually a multi-point discussion - and one of the points in addition to rim issues is often running tubes in radial tires (especially w/wire wheels).  

 

Sidenote:  I doubt a 1956 Oldsmobile would ever have an issue (I ran radials on my 1955 Buick without issue - other than I put some strips on Duct Tape in the rim to give the hubcap teeth something to grip into (just in case) as near perfect 1955 Roadmaster Hubcaps are not easy to find). 

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it looks like I will reconsider radials, but is there a better brand or tread type that will give me a better ride?.  The tires now make my front end go all over the place when I hit an imperfection in the road

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2 minutes ago, mikesbrunn said:

it looks like I will reconsider radials, but is there a better brand or tread type that will give me a better ride?.  The tires now make my front end go all over the place when I hit an imperfection in the road

 

"You can't have your cake and eat it too.". Mom

 

  Ben

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mikesbrunn, check your toe-in now.  I find that my 1930s Pierces need 1/4" total toe-in although the specs say 1/8 to 1/4.  When I got my 1930, the wheels were actually toed OUT and had the same reaction you describe.  Of course, hold off on the full front-end alignment (at a place which does medium-duty trucks) until new tires are installed.

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25 minutes ago, mikesbrunn said:

it looks like I will reconsider radials, but is there a better brand or tread type that will give me a better ride?.  The tires now make my front end go all over the place when I hit an imperfection in the road

 

I know this thread didn't help you much and it ultimately is a personal decision. I don't have any investment in radials beyond being a happy user. I will say that on my '41 Buick, installing radials made half the bumps and half the noise disappear and it tracks like a cruise missile. That somewhat queasy lurch you feel when you hit a truck rut is gone. It steers with a fingertip rather than two hands. Admittedly, my '41 is a bit more modern with an independent front suspension and steel wheels that are welded like modern wheels, but it's not that much more advanced than your Packard. I have also put them on my wife's 1956 Chrysler with wire wheels and I as I said, I'd like to put them on my Lincoln, which uses the same size your Packard would.

 

That said, I suppose it's all moot anyway--there are currently no 17-inch radials available for us to use. Bias-ply tires and a good alignment are your best bet. Pick the ones that look best to you--they're all made by the same company anyway, so quality differences are negligible. I personally like the aggressive tread of the Firestones, but they're a bit noisier than the BFGoodrich Silvertowns. Prices are about the same. And as I said, if I go with blackwalls, I'll be using those cheap Denmans I linked earlier simply because they're not made by Coker and at that price, if I ultimately switch to something else, at least it won't kill me to peel them off the car.

 

Good luck and happy motoring!

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For my money, Universal's Lester tread is the softest, most comfortable ride of any bias tire. You can get 700 x 17 in black wall for $222 or the white wall for $306. They don't seem to offer a 17 inch tire in the 750 size.

 

Fran

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On 12/17/2018 at 1:10 PM, billorn said:

John are those wire wheels under the cover's? Is it a radial?

Yes, those are 16" wire wheels under the covers and that is a radial tire - I could not determine the exact cause other than I assume the tube went flat and then the tread (perfectly intact) separated off the sidewalls. 

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So why did it go flat? Puncture: but how? I had several tube pinches at the overlap in the rust bands (flaps, you call them). Continuous bands don't do this. Maybe the tire rotated on the rim and pulled the valve out? I have had that too, with bias ply tires. I have also had tread separation for no reason other than ..... hu noze? manufacturing fault? Was there a rust band in there? is the dumb question.

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I have post war cars with older style wheels and radial tires, and never have had an inordinate problem, other then caps that want to come off or make noise. With my pre-war cars I never ventured into the radial unknown.

 

It did lead me to ask a question that I simply couldn't answer. I have seen the videos of cars with wooden spokes handle the early rutted roads in a way that stamped steel wheels wouldn't have a chance. They did it with the wheel's ability to flex. Not just a little bit either, but with so much flex that you would swear  that the spokes would break, but they always retained their shape. I know that when we were kids we tore up a set of wire wheels on a 1959 MGA, but what we did to that car I doubt that any wheel would have survived. But wire wheels have to flex, by their nature, correct? So my ultimate question-wouldn't wooden, or wire pre-war wheels, be a better choice then stamped steel, either artillery or disc, for use with radial tires? Pleas tell me if I'm missing something.

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I ran Diamondback radial whitewalls (Hankook) on my 37 Packard Six Convertible Coupe for years and miles of trouble free motoring. The wheels (not rims) sealed and no loss of air pressure over months of time. Just more fuel for the discussion. JWL

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On ‎12‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 7:23 PM, mikesbrunn said:

it looks like I will reconsider radials, but is there a better brand or tread type that will give me a better ride?.  The tires now make my front end go all over the place when I hit an imperfection in the road

 

Besides looking at the toe in as suggested earlier, I would look closely at the caster.  If not enough caster in the alignment, the car will want to wander anyways.  If you are just driving, does the steering wheel want to center it's self when driving on a straight flat road or does it want to wander.   If it does not want to self center, then probably not enough caster in the system.  Just IMO.

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Phil Bray (unfort. now deceased) showed up at a CCCA Grand Classic several years back with a perhaps 1932 or 1933 Chrysler imperial that I think had a 17" whitewall on it - I do not recall who made though, but they were pretty well done and I think we maybe took a point off or did not take anything off.  I also Diamond Back had some 17" sizes via radials. 

 

As to bias ply - I tend to like a BF Goodrich (I have always been happy).

 

The reproduction authentic tread Firestones are nice too (as far as look - I have installed a few sets with friends though cars have not yet been driven or seen time yet).

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On 12/18/2018 at 2:42 PM, Spinneyhill said:

So why did it go flat? Puncture: but how? I had several tube pinches at the overlap in the rust bands (flaps, you call them). Continuous bands don't do this. Maybe the tire rotated on the rim and pulled the valve out? I have had that too, with bias ply tires. I have also had tread separation for no reason other than ..... hu noze? manufacturing fault? Was there a rust band in there? is the dumb question.

I am leaning toward an aggressive rib pattern to the inside of the casing of a  6:50 x 16" _ _ _ _ _ Classic Radial Whitewall and the tubes seemed to basically rub/wear thin/scuff at point of failure (and manufacturer recommends they be run with a tube, so ...).  Heavy duty truck tubes installed seemed to last longer (all be  still seemed an issue).  And, I talc the tubes and casings (allows them to slide in the casings) - several old timers have recommended and I have generally had faultless service from bias ply tires doing such.   The first flats with the radials were from little aluminum stickers that prior owner did not realize were inside the casings (not a fault of the tire).  I think we had  5 or 6 flats in 14 years and roughly 10K miles of touring (mostly flats were in garage after pulling in from a tour) - that is pretty decent service all things considered.  My concern was the one flat after just  pulling off highway and the last flat was out on the State Route while driving.    Also, 3 tires were on car the entire time, and one tire was out of round and required far too  much weight, they gladly replaced that tire, though the replacement was not all that much better. 

 

Here is what I am more use to: I ran my 1941 Cadillac with several sets of Firestone and the last set of tires was BF Goodrich - 80K miles of driving and only one flat - it was in the garage and spot looked like a defect in tube.  Also, plenty of Auburns on 6:50 x 16 Goodyears running around without issue (have installed probably 6 sets now and not a complaint from anyone yet and several people drive plenty more than I do).   And, bad example, but I have driven a lot of stuff around on ancient tires installed in 60's, 70's, & 80's  - without issue (but I am not driving 65mph either with that stuff). 

 

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)

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