telriv Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 YES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 I bought my 63 from the original purchaser back in Oct of 1982. The cast cover that were on the car at that time had the clip on weights on them. The build date for my car is 2E. I have no idea how many are needed, how it's determined where they go, or why they're needed so close to the center of the rotating mass. Some of the other covers I've acquired have had them, others have not. Looks like "The Turbinator" has some more research ahead of him. Ed 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 2 hours ago, telriv said: YES Tom, if the weights were put on the wheel covers before the covers left the factory how did the person putting the weights know where to place them? The tire, the car all could have variables that needed to be assessed at the time the covers were put on. please help me on this one Turbinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 In the event the weights were put on the cast aluminum cover at the time the Riviera was purchased then the wheel cover would have experienced a period of time on the car. My burning question is how could such a wheel cover be represented as new old stock when listed for sale.? Maybe NOS is a catch all acronym for gently used or nearly new. Seems a better description of other than new car parts could be better written. Just my opinion. People can write what they want. Caveat Emptor. Turninator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 Bob, I`m quite sure the wheel covers were neutral balanced after manufacture and before they were installed on the car when new. Perhaps they were statically balanced like the old school method of tire balancing with the bubble, etc...or perhaps the manufacturer dynamically balanced them because they produced enough volume to justify the investment in fixtures. Tom Mooney 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 1 hour ago, 1965rivgs said: Bob, I`m quite sure the wheel covers were neutral balanced after manufacture and before they were installed on the car when new. Perhaps they were statically balanced like the old school method of tire balancing with the bubble, etc...or perhaps the manufacturer dynamically balanced them because they produced enough volume to justify the investment in fixtures. Tom Mooney Tom, so if I understand correctly dynamically balanced is when the wheel is balanced while it is spinning? The only balance of tires and wheels I know about was as you mentioned with the bubble balance. I understand how that was done. No wheel cover on the bubble balance that I witnessed. Buick may well have had dynamic balancing machines for the wheelcovers to justify a quick end of the fiscal year expenditure. It wouldn’t be the first time a large corporation or government agency spent end of the year budget leftover monies on something superfluous. I’m the meantime Ill just leave the weights where they are on my used hubcaps. It puzzles me how two different “ wheels “ that go together are balanced independently and it works! Thanks to all Turbinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 How much do the clip weights weigh in relation to the amount of material removed then drilling out the hole for the valve stem? I've tried considering this when looking at clip placement in relationship to the valve stem hole but haven't come up with anything consistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 7 minutes ago, RivNut said: How much do the clip weights weigh in relation to the amount of material removed then drilling out the hole for the valve stem? I've tried considering this when looking at clip placement in relationship to the valve stem hole but haven't come up with anything consistent. Ed, would not the loss of the weight from the hole being punched out not be an issue in balancing the hubcap or the wheel? The balancer just balances what he has to work on. Some have done high speed balancing of the tire and wheel ,but hubcaps were not on the car. I remember guys that were insistent all four of the valve caps had to be plastic or metal. You couldn’t mix plastic and metal valve caps? Give me a break! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) 18 hours ago, Turbinator said: Tom, so if I understand correctly dynamically balanced is when the wheel is balanced while it is spinning? The only balance of tires and wheels I know about was as you mentioned with the bubble balance. I understand how that was done. No wheel cover on the bubble balance that I witnessed. Buick may well have had dynamic balancing machines for the wheelcovers to justify a quick end of the fiscal year expenditure. It wouldn’t be the first time a large corporation or government agency spent end of the year budget leftover monies on something superfluous. I’m the meantime Ill just leave the weights where they are on my used hubcaps. It puzzles me how two different “ wheels “ that go together are balanced independently and it works! Thanks to all Turbinator Bob, yes, I was referring to "dynamic balancing" as in spinning versus statically placing the wheel/tire (or wheel cover) on a bubble balancer. Surely you have had wheel/tire combos dynamically balanced...unless you havnt purchased a set of tires since the `60`s? I dont know if Buick balanced the covers or the sub contractor/supplier (this would be my guess) but it makes sense to me the cover would be neutral balanced. Otherwise, one could not separate the cover from the wheel/tire combo without concern. If the cover is neutral balanced it could be placed in any position on the car without ill effect. Tom Edited January 31, 2019 by 1965rivgs (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 37 minutes ago, RivNut said: How much do the clip weights weigh in relation to the amount of material removed then drilling out the hole for the valve stem? I've tried considering this when looking at clip placement in relationship to the valve stem hole but haven't come up with anything consistent. If you closely at the covers there is a raised square boss of extra material which is always adjacent/in line to the hole for the valve. Tom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 18 minutes ago, 1965rivgs said: If you closely at the covers there is a raised square boss of extra material which is always adjacent/in line to the hole for the valve. Tom I'll have to check that out. I thought that I'd studied these pretty closely; apparently that got past me. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 45 minutes ago, RivNut said: I'll have to check that out. I thought that I'd studied these pretty closely; apparently that got past me. Thanks. Just look at the pic of the repaired cover Bob posted in this thread Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 8 hours ago, 1965rivgs said: Bob, yes, I was referring to "dynamic balancing" as in spinning versus statically placing the wheel/tire (or wheel cover) on a bubble balancer. Surely you have had wheel/tire combos dynamically balanced...unless you havnt purchased a set of tires since the `60`s? I dont know if Buick balanced the covers or the sub contractor/supplier (this would be my guess) but it makes sense to me the cover would be neutral balanced. Otherwise, one couldnt seperate the cover from the wheel/tire combo without concern. If the cover is neutral balanced it could be placed in any position on the car without ill effect. Tom Tom, thanks for your assistance in helping me understand. The subject is tedious and those experienced in auto mechanics may view my concern as not an important item and known as a given in accepted wheel balancing. On the other hand I was in mailing/small parcel shipping and mailing industry for 31 years and folks would complain about poor delivery or no delivery. I would ask, "did you use address hygiene?" I was trying to say to the mailer did you use correct addressing methods ? The cliche "no brainer" applies to balancing wheels and mailing a letter. Mailing a letter and balancing wheels have standard accepted practice. I appreciate your patience and help. To mix a metaphor and stab at humor, " I'm going to stop banging my head up against a dead horse." Turbinator...... on balance this AM. 3F in Lutherville Md Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 7 hours ago, RivNut said: I'll have to check that out. I thought that I'd studied these pretty closely; apparently that got past me. Thanks. Ed, my boyhood pals would say, " Use a micro-fying glass and see if you can see it!" I have three or so of those micro-fying glasses in my shop. One of the few good things about aging is somethings that get by you learn not to care so much. Now, matching colors when repainting air cleaners on the 63 Rivieras is no margin for error. Yep, like nailing jello on the wall. Turbinator ( 3F in my neighborhood... close to a Maryland record ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Gents, would anyone know the type of metal treatment the webs on the 63 Turbines have on them? I heard the the webs between the vanes were anodized. I get the covers in all conditions ( mostly rough) and the metal in the webs behave differently compared to the tops of the vanes, center cap crown, and 3 tier circumference. I'm thinking the cast aluminum in the webs of the vanes were metal finished differently than the rest. Turbinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PWB Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 One could clear anodize the aluminum. You'd have to remove the patina and all contaminates first. Only a fresh non-metallic media blast would well achieve that with the appearance desired? I would opt for silver argent paint. I'm gonna bet paint is what was originally used as it would have been simpler. But I'm no first gen. expert either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Having owned my '63 since 1982 and buying it from the original owner (knowing nothing was done on either watch to the finish of the cast covers) I'm saying that there was no coating on the covers. The webs were raw cast aluminum and the vanes and rims were smoothed and polished. All natural. In '64, they were the same except that the webs were painted black. A very light media blast with something like soda or crushed walnut shells to get rid of years of built up grime, and some 2000 or 3000 grit sanding disks on the vanes and rims would bring them back to their original state. If Buick had wanted them all nice and shiney, they probably would have just stuck with something chrome. Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Gents, are the webs in between the vanes on the 63 Turbine wheel cover anodized? Seems like the very best 63 turbine covers I’ve seen the metal in between webs does not have the same finish appearance as the circumference, top of the vanes and center cap crown. I speculated the webs had been treated with a different sanding treatment OR just anodized. I’m giving this topic a rest. Thanks to everyone’s helpful comments. Turbinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 On 2/15/2019 at 12:59 PM, RivNut said: Having owned my '63 since 1982 and buying it from the original owner (knowing nothing was done on either watch to the finish of the cast covers) I'm saying that there was no coating on the covers. The webs were raw cast aluminum and the vanes and rims were smoothed and polished. All natural. In '64, they were the same except that the webs were painted black. A very light media blast with something like soda or crushed walnut shells to get rid of years of built up grime, and some 2000 or 3000 grit sanding disks on the vanes and rims would bring them back to their original state. If Buick had wanted them all nice and shiney, they probably would have just stuck with something chrome. Ed Ed, your recipe format is correct. Walnut shells and the 2000, 3000 grit sandpaper will not cut the mustard. At least on the gems I’m bringing in!🤓 Turbinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 On 2/15/2019 at 11:29 AM, PWB said: One could clear anodize the aluminum. You'd have to remove the patina and all contaminates first. Only a fresh non-metallic media blast would well achieve that with the appearance desired? I would opt for silver argent paint. I'm gonna bet paint is what was originally used as it would have been simpler. But I'm no first gen. expert either. PWB, thank you for your observation and input. I’m no metal finishing or auto paint expert in the least. Finishing the webs on the 63 and 64 take time..a lot of time. I’m powder coating the webs in an effort to restore for a better product. The powder coat has a harder surface and hopefully hold up better than paint. Cast aluminum powder coating is tricky. Not rocket science. If you don’t treat the metal correctly during the powder coating the finish can have tiny bubbles. Ask me how I know. Thanks again for the help. Turbinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbinator Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 Something different, but still all Buick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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