gervaisgt

"Mag Wheels" In the AACA Official Revue : Disgusting !!!

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re GTO clones from LeMans/Tempest: there were several ways to tell if a 64-65 was real or not even before PHS. Were ways to spot 66 parts on a 67 and verse the vice but had to be a fanatic. Had one owner get really mad who spent a lot of time and effort creating a 67 GTO with hood tach, gauges, and clock but I took max points off because he had the clock and gauges in the wrong pods. I happened to have the original build information. Those experiences had a lot to do with why I stopped judging.

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9 minutes ago, padgett said:

re GTO clones from LeMans/Tempest: there were several ways to tell if a 64-65 was real or not even before PHS. Were ways to spot 66 parts on a 67 and verse the vice but had to be a fanatic. Had one owner get really mad who spent a lot of time and effort creating a 67 GTO with hood tach, gauges, and clock but I took max points off because he had the clock and gauges in the wrong pods. I happened to have the original build information. Those experiences had a lot to do with why I stopped judging.

As I said before 1964-65 GTO's are a option on a LeMans and they have a LeMans  Body Style number. According to AACA rules which say anything goes as long as it could be ordered. Example: a guy buys a 1961 Pontiac Catalina with the standard engine ( 389) and automatic , 10.25 comp ratio 2bbl carb, 267 h.p. with a 2.67 open rear end. Under AACA judging rules he can make that Catalina any way you could have ordered that Catalina in 1961. So he can make that car a 389 engine with Tri-Power (3-2bbl) , 348 h.p, 4 speed stick,  Safety Track 4:10 gears in the diff. So any 1964/65  LeMans could be ordered with the GTO option. No problem making your LeMans into a GTO. according to the rules applied to the 61 Catalina. The factory internally called the GTO optioned car a " LeMans GTO ". After 1965 model GTO becomes it's own model and you can't clone that.

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Pfeil,

            While I like the mags on my muscle era cars I agree with you on the vintage cars. I'm about 75% through the resto on my '38 Plymouth coupe and I love it for it's plain simplicity. This was a very low option car (two tail lamps and passenger side sun visor) and that's the way I'm keeping it. Right down to the black wall tires. I always think it looks cheesey when one of these lower end, inexpensive cars are all dressed up with fog lamps, visors, fender skirts, trim rings, etc.

I suppose that makes me a little hypocritical. I can't really justify why I think its OK for one type of car but not another.

Greg

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8 minutes ago, GregLaR said:

Pfeil,

            While I like the mags on my muscle era cars I agree with you on the vintage cars. I'm about 75% through the resto on my '38 Plymouth coupe and I love it for it's plain simplicity. This was a very low option car (two tail lamps and passenger side sun visor) and that's the way I'm keeping it. Right down to the black wall tires. I always think it looks cheesey when one of these lower end, inexpensive cars are all dressed up with fog lamps, visors, fender skirts, trim rings, etc.

I suppose that makes me a little hypocritical. I can't really justify why I think its OK for one type of car but not another.

Greg

How will feel when your muscle cars become vintage cars?

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21 minutes ago, nick8086 said:

Use a pictures like this..

 

Not sure about the GM car.. I would own one..

 

 

fthis.JPG

IMG_5260.JPG

IMG_5265.JPG

IMG_5251.JPG

 

 

 

 

 

She's not sitting on a G.M. car. It's a Frazier Manhattan 

Edited by Pfeil (see edit history)

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Just now, Pfeil said:

 

 

 

 

 

She's not sitting on a G.M. car. It's a Frazier Manhattan 

She can sit wherever she wants. 

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"Outrage" and "shame" are pretty strong words over an aftermarket accessory.  Okay, I get that you don't personally like it, but I would suggest that it is our differences in tastes that make for such eclectic and interesting meets.  I may be wrong, but I seem to remember a time in the past when AACA accepted up to three period-correct factory accessories.  Of course, at the time, that meant you could have a manifold heater, a motometer, and an air cleaner on your Model A.  Heck, back in the "period'', I was a teenager putting 'period correct' accessories on my car.  I think it's fun to see some of them again.  What is a bigger "outrage", a 1950s car with mag wheels, or an over-restored classic era roadster with a mirror-finish basecoat/clear coat "concours" finish on every chassis and undercarriage part?  IMHO, what will keep our hobby and our club strong Is some appreciation of what the other guy is doing, regardless of whether or not it is what you might do with the same car.

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5 hours ago, Pfeil said:

How will feel when your muscle cars become vintage cars?

Well my '65 Corvette is over half a century old already, so I guess it is a vintage car. 😄

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7 hours ago, Akstraw said:

"Outrage" and "shame" are pretty strong words over an aftermarket accessory.  Okay, I get that you don't personally like it, but I would suggest that it is our differences in tastes that make for such eclectic and interesting meets.    What is a bigger "outrage", a 1950s car with mag wheels, or an over-restored classic era roadster with a mirror-finish basecoat/clear coat "concours" finish on every chassis and undercarriage part?  IMHO, what will keep our hobby and our club strong Is some appreciation of what the other guy is doing, regardless of whether or not it is what you might do with the same car.

Excellent!  Especially your last sentence.

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" No problem making your LeMans into a GTO. " oh I agree, as long as it is done correctly. If I can open the trunk and tell it was not a GTO then...There a few things on a 64-65 GTO that were different from a LeMans. Of course with PHS the question is moot.

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On 12/1/2018 at 8:29 PM, Joe in Canada said:

excerpt: . . . . We should except a car from the 60s with different period accessories that were available then  like we have for the early  cars.  . . .

 

I'm confused. Accept (in?) or except (out?)?

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19 hours ago, AJFord54 said:

I totally understand the reason for the article.  I suggest we all read it in its entirety before making harsh judgment. 

 

The Studebaker in question was designed to mimic the "concept car" designed by "Studebaker stylist Bob Bourke".  The owners, Vic and Connie Oliver attempted and were successful at building their car based upon the drawings of Mr. Bourke.  Page 50 gives specific reasons for each of the changes to the car, per the concept. The car was accepted by the AACA in Class 39, Special Interest Vehicles, which is a non-judged class, fully approved by the Class Acceptance Committee.  Per the article, it is a "display-only class" consisting of celebrity, movie/television props, historical significance or "an innovative design that never matured".  They received only the third ever granted Special Interest award for this category - on the show-field, not even at the awards banquet. There are several categories of AACA vehicles including Driver Participation, HPOF, etc. which have been previously added in an effort to accommodate different tastes among our members.  This little beauty fits nicely into another category and might even be considered a work of art.

 

I commend them for publishing, informing and educating us on this part of automotive history.

 

This sums it up. Thank you A.J.

 

AACA is for the preservation and appreciation for automotive history. The Corvette owner, Steve Eason, is promoting the hobby in many ways: preserving, showing and, most importantly, showing the world that vintage cars can been enjoyed on and off the show field. The Drivers Participation Class is for those who prefer to drive their cars as opposed to competing for Junior, Senior, Grand National and National awards (actually, there is a national award for DPC, too!!). DPC allows for a few alterations in order to make the car more enjoyable and safe to drive. It is an AACA official class, and none of the alterations that Mr. Eason has done to his Corvette have caused the DPC class judges to object.

 

My comment to Mr. gervaisgt: For more than 14 years, I have strived to feature all aspects of AACA. I receive many letters from members who think that all I feature are high-point award-winning automobiles. Nothing could be further from the truth. As most of us know, pictures lie. In fact, if you read through the Letters section of this very same issue (November/December 2018), there is a letter from a man who "claims" members of an AACA Region in his area have shunned his cars because they are the wrong make and wrong condition. Steve Moskowitz penned a perfect response of shock, adding that "There is a danger in equating All of AACA as having a singular view on the hobby ... Our magazine tries to add mixes of DPC, and HPOF cars along with exposing members to rare cars that [few] of us can ever hope to own. We are proud of those members who restore and maintain their cars for the enjoyment of the rest of us."

 

Snobbery is a cancer of the old car hobby, weather perceived or real. Why should we not feature as many aspects of AACA as we can?"

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West, I did not intend my post above to imply snobbery regarding the Stude or the Packard Speedster of last year. Rather, it deals with the double standard applied at the Hershey show.  How can the club justify refusing to allow even mildly modified cars in the car corral or even the flea market, and then allow home made cars in the show. I don't care what class you put the car in on the show field, it still remains that the cars identified were never produced, and thus did not come from the factory as they were shown. If an early LaMans gets changed to a GTO (as could be ordered from the factory) then OK... But at least the factory produced such a GTO. I'd like someone to explain to us plebes why the Stude above is not just a home made, modified Studebaker. If the standards are applied to one group of modified cars, why not to all....

 

Frank

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I cannot answer for those who monitor the car corral. Apparently it is not consistent.

As for allowing the Packard Speedster onto the show field last year, all I can say is that AACA and the Hershey Region have their hands full organizing more than 1,200 registered vehicles. They do the best they can. If someone registers his 1929 Packard in Class 19, it is difficult for the person handling the paperwork to know just exactly what the owner is going to display. As for trying to decide if a car belongs or not, that is not up to the volunteers who are doing their best to park cars in a quick and orderly fashion. Since I am not a judge, I do not know the process of reporting "hot rod" cars. That car was meant to emulate the actual 1928-29 Packard Speedster concept car (the real car was actually on display in the flea market during the week), and was being displayed next to a 1930 Packard Speedster owned by the same gentleman. While, in my opinion, the car did not qualify as a "hot rod," it did fall short of copying the real thing. Perhaps the judges felt it was close enough to what the factory built that they didn't raise a stink. Sometimes it's best to just "let it be".

As for the Studebaker, it was shown in Class 39. For good reasons, the acceptance committee felt it qualified under sub-heading "d."

Class 39: A display only, non-judged class. All vehicles in this class must be approved by the Class Acceptance Committee. The owner of such vehicle must provide documentation and authenticity documents to the Class Acceptance Committee. Consideration will be for the following examples: a. Celebrity vehicles b. Vehicles in movies or on television c. Vehicles of historical significance d. Vehicles of innovative design that never matured. This class is not for modified vehicles, hot-rods, street rods, choppers, etc.

All in all, AACA is quite consistent in keeping actual "hot rods" and "customs" off of its show field, other than for what is accepted in Class 39. Some cars are definitely in a grey area, and it is those that seem to come to the surface to raise a stink. Perhaps we should keep our focus on the 99 percent.

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Oldford, really no double standard at all.  The rule for the flea market is that if a vehicle could be exhibited in a AACA class it is eligible for the car corral.  Secondly, there is no AACA national police at Hershey running the car corral.  Hershey Region members and volunteers do their best at attempting to follow the rule book.  A VERY tough assignment for them.  They do a very good job but sometimes a car gets in that should not and maybe a car goes home that would qualify.  

 

As explained by A.J., the Studebaker was approved for a non-judged class by a committee of AACA judges.  As to the Packard, I think I know which one  you are referring to (rushed so have not gone back to your post) and all I can say is that if it is the Speedster it does not meet the criteria of the rule book but when it was entered in the show how was anyone to know?  Once it got there and in place then it was not asked to leave.  It was a hit though!

 

I am all for following the rules.  No reason to have them if you do not follow but sometimes you have to use common sense especially when "no babies or animals" are harmed! :) 

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It's really hard to police show fields on the spot. To their credit, I have seen Hershey volunteers ask cars to leave the car corral because they were modified, which I feel is appropriate. It's a tough thing to do, because the person being asked to leave inevitably gets angry about it, regardless of the reasons behind the request. We run a show each year that is for unmodified, stock cars only, but as West points out, there are always a half-dozen guys who simply write "1957 Chevy" on their entry form and initial the "I certify that my car is unmodified" statement, then show up with their LS-powered, air-bagged, 20-inch rimmed '57 Chevy. When they're asked to leave, they start shouting and getting indignant, they make a big scene, and with notable few exceptions they spin their tires on the way out the gate, creating a dangerous situation. We've kind of decided to just let them stay and quietly talk to them one-on-one and ask them not to bring that car back because it's inappropriate for the venue. Some understand, some don't, and it turns ugly about 70% of the time. You should have seen the guy who lost his mind when his custom Camaro didn't even get third place in his class after judging--our head judge looked at his score sheet and said, "Wrong engine, wrong interior, wrong wheels, wrong transmission, wrong color... shall I continue?" That guy, like the others, revved his engine loudly, said some unkind words at the top of his voice, and smoked his tires out the gate. Sometimes better to just not worry about it as long as the numbers of modified cars don't get out of hand (like I said, it's usually only 5 or 6 of them).

 

I would think that at a show like Hershey, showing up in an obvious hot rod would feel so stupid that you would self-remove and go home without a fuss. Imagine showing up at Corvettes at Carlisle with your 5.0 Mustang and demanding to be let in--you'd feel like such an idiot before you even got close to the front gate that you'd probably just quietly slide home and not try that again.

 

It might be that the Hershey volunteers do it as a judgement call--cars like the aforementioned Packard get a pass as long as it's not being judged, but any car showing up with a fuel-injected late-model engine and trick wheels would certainly be asked to leave. You don't have to die on every single hill. Who has the energy for that?

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3 hours ago, padgett said:

" No problem making your LeMans into a GTO. " oh I agree, as long as it is done correctly. If I can open the trunk and tell it was not a GTO then...There a few things on a 64-65 GTO that were different from a LeMans. Of course with PHS the question is moot.

If all the changes were made it's a no brainer. POCI, GTOAA, and AACA don't walk around the show field with PHS documentation.

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2 hours ago, West Peterson said:

 

 

 

My comment to Mr. Pfeil: For more than 14 years, I have strived to feature all aspects of AACA. I receive many letters from members who think that all I feature are high-point award-winning automobiles. Nothing could be further from the truth. As most of us know, pictures lie. In fact, if you read through the Letters section of this very same issue (November/December 2018), there is a letter from a man who "claims" members of an AACA Region in his area have shunned his cars because they are the wrong make and wrong condition. Steve Moskowitz penned a perfect response of shock, adding that "There is a danger in equating All of AACA as having a singular view on the hobby ... Our magazine tries to add mixes of DPC, and HPOF cars along with exposing members to rare cars that [few] of us can ever hope to own. We are proud of those members who restore and maintain their cars for the enjoyment of the rest of us."

 

 

I didn't say anything about featuring cars in AACA, besides I don't know what you've featured anyway.

I did say that Mimicking is not the real deal.

I did say that the Starfire shown with aftermarket mags would be better off with Real mags that were offered by Oldsmobile.

I did say a Pontiac LeMans could be made into a Pontiac GTO and shown at a AACA event as a GTO according to judging rules.

I mentioned the girl was sitting on a Frazier Manhattan.

I agreed with Padgett when he said:

 

   "So I get a bit confused in that pre-war coach builders are venerated while modern ones are despised"

 

I mentioned that a Steve mole car would not receive the same recognition as a Bohman / Schwartz.

I did say I thought AACA was for preserving Antique cars.

 

What I would like to see at the head of the web page, and at the beginning of the forum is a "MISSION STAMENT" of what AACA stands for.

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1 hour ago, Matt Harwood said:

It's really hard to police show fields on the spot. To their credit, I have seen Hershey volunteers ask cars to leave the car corral because they were modified, which I feel is appropriate. It's a tough thing to do, because the person being asked to leave inevitably gets angry about it, regardless of the reasons behind the request. We run a show each year that is for unmodified, stock cars only, but as West points out, there are always a half-dozen guys who simply write "1957 Chevy" on their entry form and initial the "I certify that my car is unmodified" statement, then show up with their LS-powered, air-bagged, 20-inch rimmed '57 Chevy. When they're asked to leave, they start shouting and getting indignant, they make a big scene, and with notable few exceptions they spin their tires on the way out the gate, creating a dangerous situation. We've kind of decided to just let them stay and quietly talk to them one-on-one and ask them not to bring that car back because it's inappropriate for the venue. Some understand, some don't, and it turns ugly about 70% of the time. You should have seen the guy who lost his mind when his custom Camaro didn't even get third place in his class after judging--our head judge looked at his score sheet and said, "Wrong engine, wrong interior, wrong wheels, wrong transmission, wrong color... shall I continue?" That guy, like the others, revved his engine loudly, said some unkind words at the top of his voice, and smoked his tires out the gate. Sometimes better to just not worry about it as long as the numbers of modified cars don't get out of hand (like I said, it's usually only 5 or 6 of them).

 

I would think that at a show like Hershey, showing up in an obvious hot rod would feel so stupid that you would self-remove and go home without a fuss. Imagine showing up at Corvettes at Carlisle with your 5.0 Mustang and demanding to be let in--you'd feel like such an idiot before you even got close to the front gate that you'd probably just quietly slide home and not try that again.

 

It might be that the Hershey volunteers do it as a judgement call--cars like the aforementioned Packard get a pass as long as it's not being judged, but any car showing up with a fuel-injected late-model engine and trick wheels would certainly be asked to leave. You don't have to die on every single hill. Who has the energy for that?

You need a MISSION STATEMENT up front of what you stand for at Hershey, the Forum, anything you do. It must be up front so there is no mistake. A big sign no hot rods modified cars etc.

But I must tell you that by adding modified cars to a DPC or having any modified cars at local AACA shows clouds and confuses people. As one person once shouted to me said they are a bunch of hypocrites.

This has nothing to do with me, just make it perfectly clear what you stand for, and if there is any hypocrisy change it.  

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51 minutes ago, Pfeil said:

You need a MISSION STATEMENT up front of what you stand for at Hershey, the Forum, anything you do. It must be up front so there is no mistake. A big sign no hot rods modified cars etc.

But I must tell you that by adding modified cars to a DPC or having any modified cars at local AACA shows clouds and confuses people. As one person once shouted to me said they are a bunch of hypocrites.

This has nothing to do with me, just make it perfectly clear what you stand for, and if there is any hypocrisy change it.  

 

I'll tell you what, YOU can be the guy standing at the gate, stopping cars to check for modifications while everyone else backs up onto the street, blocking traffic, honking horns, with overheating radiators and slipping clutches on a hill. YOU can give out YOUR phone number for complaints after the show. YOU can be the guy everyone comes to complain to when it takes too long to get in the gate and their cars overheat. YOU can be the guy going out to face an extremely irate hot rod owner who will tell you that you, your mother, your kids, and everyone related to you is a piece of crap because his car isn't welcome at the show. YOU can be the one who has to find the other car owners and move the other cars already properly parked so the angry guy can leave with his exhaust roaring and his tires spinning. YOU can be the guy who takes the blame when the irate guy goes on the internet to tell everyone what pieces of crap the people running the show are. YOU can be the one whose wife gets yelled at because she manages the gate and gets called all sorts of unkind words. Step right up. If it's as easy as writing a mission statement and making a sign, you should have no problem with this job. Do we have a deal?

 

People LIE to get into shows, including the Stan Hywet Father's Day show our club hosts, and probably into Hershey as well. They KNOW it's for stock cars and they simply don't care. They think their shiat is just too cool to be missed and they also want on-field parking. We get people calling and asking if their car is permissible because it has an electric fuel pump (yes, of course) but we never get guys calling to ask if their 1948 Ford with a supercharged V8 hanging out of the hood and a 6-speed and air bag suspension is permissible, they just show up ready to fight their way in. By the time they're rolling through the gate, either it's time for a confrontation with swear words and screeching rubber and a big hold up to the rest of the line where 499 other cars are trying to get in, or it's let them in and hopefully have a quiet conversation later where they understand they made a mistake and nobody gets embarrassed. Or God forbid it's something like we had last June where an Autokraft Mark IV showed up--is it a Cobra replica or a legitimate production car? It's aluminum, made on the original tooling, by a guy who bought the original company, using vintage Ford parts. Let him stay or throw him out? Does a mission statement cover that kind of situation? Someone's going to be pissed no matter what you do. 

 

A sign, big letters on the sign-up form (as I mentioned, we actually make them sign the form indicating that they understand the show is for unmodified cars only and they ALL do), whatever--none of it stops the handful of guys with modified cars from showing up and pushing their way in. Rather than screw up everyone else's day, we let it ride and handle it quietly. They KNOW they don't belong. They just don't care--they JUST HAVE to be there, rules be damned. I presume the few (VERY few) non-stock cars at Hershey are treated the same and they choose not to make a scene by turning them away at the busy front gate.

 

Sometimes it's just not very easy. If you're at the front gate, 500 cars are streaming in, and you see this car in line. It drives by quietly. Are you letting this car in (no fair scrolling down and cheating)?

 

002.thumb.jpg.0c7996ec51fecf10332eca6de5edd509.jpg 033.thumb.jpg.f8660a7f66ae71a8679f602875e1066c.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Uh oh, looks like you just let a hot rod in. Time for a showdown, some shouting, and an angry visitor!

 

077.thumb.JPG.537814783135aea662fbb2208ad9a0ee.JPG

 

 

 

Edited by Matt Harwood (see edit history)
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2 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

 

I'll tell you what, YOU can be the guy standing at the gate, stopping cars to check for modifications while everyone else backs up onto the street, blocking traffic, honking horns, with overheating radiators and slipping clutches on a hill. YOU can give out YOUR phone number for complaints after the show. YOU can be the guy everyone comes to complain to when it takes too long to get in the gate and their cars overheat. YOU can be the guy going out to face an extremely irate hot rod owner who will tell you that you, your mother, your kids, and everyone related to you is a piece of crap because his car isn't welcome at the show. YOU can be the one who has to find the other car owners and move the other cars already properly parked so the angry guy can leave with his exhaust roaring and his tires spinning. YOU can be the guy who takes the blame when the irate guy goes on the internet to tell everyone what pieces of crap the people running the show are. YOU can be the one whose wife gets yelled at because she manages the gate and gets called all sorts of unkind words. Step right up. If it's as easy as writing a mission statement and making a sign, you should have no problem with this job. Do we have a deal?

 

People LIE to get into shows, including the Stan Hywet Father's Day show our club hosts, and probably into Hershey as well. They KNOW it's for stock cars and they simply don't care. They think their shiat is just too cool to be missed and they also want on-field parking. We get people calling and asking if their car is permissible because it has an electric fuel pump (yes, of course) but we never get guys calling to ask if their 1948 Ford with a supercharged V8 hanging out of the hood and a 6-speed and air bag suspension is permissible, they just show up ready to fight their way in. By the time they're rolling through the gate, either it's time for a confrontation with swear words and screeching rubber and a big hold up to the rest of the line where 499 other cars are trying to get in, or it's let them in and hopefully have a quiet conversation later where they understand they made a mistake and nobody gets embarrassed. Or God forbid it's something like we had last June where an Autokraft Mark IV showed up--is it a Cobra replica or a legitimate production car? It's aluminum, made on the original tooling, by a guy who bought the original company, using vintage Ford parts. Let him stay or throw him out? Does a mission statement cover that kind of situation? Someone's going to be pissed no matter what you do. 

 

A sign, big letters on the sign-up form (as I mentioned, we actually make them sign the form indicating that they understand the show is for unmodified cars only and they ALL do), whatever--none of it stops the handful of guys with modified cars from showing up and pushing their way in. Rather than screw up everyone else's day, we let it ride and handle it quietly. They KNOW they don't belong. They just don't care--they JUST HAVE to be there, rules be damned. I presume the few (VERY few) non-stock cars at Hershey are treated the same and they choose not to make a scene by turning them away at the busy front gate.

 

 

OTOH, Doing a multi page feature in the mag and having the Stude on the show field says to one and all "COME ON DOWN". (And if not, just why not ?)

Please don't shoot the messenger.

I'm just sayin.............Bob

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1 hour ago, Pfeil said:

I didn't say anything about featuring cars in AACA, besides I don't know what you've featured anyway.

I did say that Mimicking is not the real deal.

I did say that the Starfire shown with aftermarket mags would be better off with Real mags that were offered by Oldsmobile.

I did say a Pontiac LeMans could be made into a Pontiac GTO and shown at a AACA event as a GTO according to judging rules.

I mentioned the girl was sitting on a Frazier Manhattan.

I agreed with Padgett when he said:

 

   "So I get a bit confused in that pre-war coach builders are venerated while modern ones are despised"

 

I mentioned that a Steve mole car would not receive the same recognition as a Bohman / Schwartz.

I did say I thought AACA was for preserving Antique cars.

 

What I would like to see at the head of the web page, and at the beginning of the forum is a "MISSION STAMENT" of what AACA stands for.

 

My total apologies. I meant to address the OP, gervaisgt. I have gone back and edited my post.

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17 hours ago, Pfeil said:

If you have to put a mag wheel on a car like that Olds, please make it a Olds Mag!

Image result for 1963 oldsmobile starfire images

 

I actually love those wheels and if I could have found a perfect set I would probably use them. Although some would even criticize that since they are not correct for my 63 - they were only used in 64 and 65. Think I'll keep my 17s.

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18 hours ago, GregLaR said:

Pfeil,

            While I like the mags on my muscle era cars I agree with you on the vintage cars. I'm about 75% through the resto on my '38 Plymouth coupe and I love it for it's plain simplicity. This was a very low option car (two tail lamps and passenger side sun visor) and that's the way I'm keeping it. Right down to the black wall tires. I always think it looks cheesey when one of these lower end, inexpensive cars are all dressed up with fog lamps, visors, fender skirts, trim rings, etc.

I suppose that makes me a little hypocritical. I can't really justify why I think its OK for one type of car but not another.

Greg

Greg, your not being hypocritical. You said that you agree with me on vintage cars, so now that muscle cars are vintage cars, no aftermarket mags.

  • Haha 1

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