Ethanol damage after 4-1/2 years

[avgwarhawk]

On 11/21/2018 at 3:53 PM, RivNut said:

Condensation also forms in the crankcase and oil pan.  To "steam" that condensation from the crankcase, you should actually take the car out and drive it until everything has been brought to full operating temperature.  Just starting it and letting it run for a few minutes to put fresher gas in the carburetor probably does more overall harm than good. 

 

I run mine up to full operating temp.  Thermostat open and heater on to circulate the coolant.   Usually 30 minutes.   I do not see the harm more than the overall good in running the engine as such.  Further, the oil is circulated once again to the upper engine thus keeping it from becoming completely dry of oil.  But yes, starting the engine and running for a few minutes does not appear to be helpful but I don't believe it it be detrimental.      

[Pete Phillips]

Most of the 1930s Buicks and early 1940s have that drain plug in the gas tank. But that doesnt' always solve the problem. In working on 1937 and 1938 Buicks recently, I removed or tried to remove the plug(s). In each case, the collar that has the threads inside the tank broke loose, leaving the plug totally useless, spinning in place. Soooooooooo....then you have to fill up the tank with water, cut it open, and get a brave welder to weld the collar or a new nut back in place in the bottom of the tank and then patch or weld your access hole, or else get rid of the tank. After having two separate tanks do that on me, I'm afraid to unscrew any more drain plugs in old gas tanks!

Pete Phillips

Edited November 23, 2018 by Pete Phillips (see edit history)

[NTX5467]

Agreed, a drain plug has to function to be useable.  Might be better to attach a pump to the fuel line where it attaches to the fuel pump?

 

The common suspicion that if the coolant is hot, everything else is too.  Only thing is that oil temp takes much longer to get to that coolant temp level than you might suspect.  It's got to get at least that hot to cook out the condensation it has accumulated (through no fault of its own).

 

Starting the engine for a few minutes, to let the oil pressure come fully "up", to move the other fluids around, probably won't put enough heat into the coolant/oil to really negarively affect things.  Nor build enough heat for the oil to drain off too quickly.  But condensate will happen somewhat anyway, just with temp swings, I suspect.

 

Remember the old oil change "severe use"  maint schedule?  Trips under 10 miles at a time?  Change the oil sooner, as a result?  In reality, many people were under that recommendation and didn't realize it.  In the moderate-sized town I grew up in, all of the main stuff was within a 2 mile radius from the house.  10 miles at a time would have been "out of town".

 

NTX5467

[EmTee]

9 hours ago, NTX5467 said:

In reality, many people were under that recommendation and didn't realize it.

 

Short trips are now considered in the algorithms that set-off the "Change Oil" warning on newer cars.

[NTX5467]

3 hours ago, EmTee said:

 

Short trips are now considered in the algorithms that set-off the "Change Oil" warning on newer cars.

 

Yes, and even a malfunctioning thermostat, which is open too much of the time, resulting in lower operating temperatures.  Like only 1/4 gauge rather than 1/2 gauge, which triggered the "Change OIl Soon" message (and a related "Check Engine" light code, earlier) at 3000 miles instead of longer, as it had been doing.

 

NTX5467

[Larry Schramm]

5 hours ago, NTX5467 said:

 

Yes, and even a malfunctioning thermostat, which is open too much of the time, resulting in lower operating temperatures.  Like only 1/4 gauge rather than 1/2 gauge, which triggered the "Change OIl Soon" message (and a related "Check Engine" light code, earlier) at 3000 miles instead of longer, as it had been doing.

 

NTX5467

 

If my memory is correct, the engine temperature sensor only needs to send a signal of temperature between -40F and +265 F and the computer considers the sensor good.  The computer will only flag a bad temp sensor if the circuit to the sensor wire is shorted to ground or open.

Edited November 24, 2018 by Larry Schramm (see edit history)

[RivNut]

2 hours ago, Larry Schramm said:

 

If my memory is correct, the engine temperature sensor only needs to send a signal of temperature between -40F and +265 F and the computer considers the sensor good.  The computer will only flag a bad temp sensor if the circuit to the sensor wire is shorted to ground or open.

Where does one find the computer and sensor on the 1956 Buick which was the car stated in the beginning of this thread? 🤔

Edited November 25, 2018 by RivNut (see edit history)

[avgwarhawk]

14 hours ago, RivNut said:

Where does one find the computer and sensor on the 1956 Buick which was the car stated in the beginning of this thread? 🤔

Usually in the front seat with the driver.  We affectionately call it a cellphone. 😀

[NTX5467]

16 hours ago, Larry Schramm said:

 

If my memory is correct, the engine temperature sensor only needs to send a signal of temperature between -40F and +265 F and the computer considers the sensor good.  The computer will only flag a bad temp sensor if the circuit to the sensor wire is shorted to ground or open.

 

My comments were in reference to oil change intervals from "short trips" and/or engine operating temps that are too low.  No more, no less. 

 

If I remember correctly, the '56 Buick uses a 160 degree thermostat?  Rather than the 180 degree version?  If it does use the 160 as normal equipment, is that to catch any engine heat rise before it gets too high?  Will the "better alloy mix" in the Nailhead's cast iron better tolerate the allegedly greater cylinder bore wear at the lower temps than other brands with lesser alloy blends, which need a 180 degree thermostat to minimize cylinder bore wear?

 

The reason I mention the cylinder bore wear issue is that back in the  "76 time frame, a friend wrote to Edelbrock about ways to get more power from his '64 Ford 352, including using a cooler thermostat for more power.  Vic wrote back that engine wear increased using the cooler 160 t/stat than the normal 180, so to use the 180 for the best results.

 

Using my recent experiences with the GM OLM to indicate that (sooner oil changes with lower engine operating temps, below the 180 degree level, with a 195 degree thermostat).  If the engine temp is not high enough for long enough, the oil needs to be changed sooner.  The computer on my '2005 Impala proves that, too.

 

NTX5467

Edited November 25, 2018 by NTX5467 (see edit history)

[JohnD1956]

3 hours ago, NTX5467 said:

Vic wrote back that engine wear increased using the cooler 160 t/stat than the normal 180, so to use the 180 for the best results.

 

I wonder what leads to this conclusion?

[D Yaros]

1 hour ago, JohnD1956 said:

 

I wonder what leads to this conclusion?

Me too?  😖

[60FlatTop]

When GM designed the LT small block engine's reverse flow cooling two main benefits were cooler entering flow to the heads, allowing higher compression ratios and higher block water jacket temperatures that improved cylinder wear. as tested and now demonstrated by the half million mile cars out there.

 

On a '56 Buick that has lower temperature coolant entering the block directly from the radiator a lower thermostat, even 20 degrees, could allow greater fluctuations in the block temperature with variations in air temperatures and combustion demands. I like my engines running at their high temperature limits, but I'm an old boiler guy and like my combustion rates high and my stack temps at the limit.

 

[Jim Nelson]

I bought a ‘35’ Vicky.  The gas tank had been removed as it had pin holes in about 2/3 of the bottom.   Getting a replacement custom tank was going to be expensive.  Plus, it won’t fit as the original.   I have a  ReNu tank repair shop about 100 miles away.   I brought my old tank with me JIC.   I was impressed with their process.   I left it behind and picked it up a week later.  Obvious, it fits like new.   It will out last me  by many many years.