71Riviera questions

[Pfeil]

46 minutes ago, lump said:

To each his own. Been driving antiques and hot rods for nearly years. NEVER seen any legal problem with modifying cars for more horsepower, greater performance, and with many models you can achieve greater fuel mileage too...if that is what you crave. Manufacturers are forced to make vehicles which please ALL kinds of customers all at the same time, so everything on the car has to be compromised. Not too stiff while cornering for grandma, and yet must provide good handling in the curves, etc, etc. 

 

It's your car...build it to please yourself. My only advice is while a 71 Riviera makes a wonderful, classy cruiser...it's not an easy platform to make a hot rod out of. In MY opinion it's better to "go with the flow," and make the Riviera better at being the kind of car it was designed to be. There are far too many other cars out there which are better choices for hot rodding. 

Clean Air Act Vehicle and Engine Enforcement Case Resolutions - EPA

https://www.epa.gov/enforcement/clean-air-act-vehicle-and-engine-enforcement-case-.

[Pfeil]

 

54 minutes ago, Pfeil said:

Clean Air Act Vehicle and Engine Enforcement Case Resolutions - EPA

https://www.epa.gov/enforcement/clean-air-act-vehicle-and-engine-enforcement-case-.

Heaven help you If they found out you installed a LS engine in a 1966 Chevelle. Did you know that when you do a swap in Ca. Legally that the engine if newer than the vehicle must conform to the year the engine was made and all it's emissions including a three way cat. The rules also say that you cannot put a older engine in a newer car without bringing that engine up to the year of the cars emission standards and emission equipment. 

And then you watch all these car shows on TV and they are doing all sorts of these things. What a good example they are setting.

Edited September 20, 2018 by Pfeil (see edit history)

[ted sweet]

more reasons  to not live  there

[Duff71Riv]

9 hours ago, lump said:

To each his own. Been driving antiques and hot rods for nearly years. NEVER seen any legal problem with modifying cars for more horsepower, greater performance, and with many models you can achieve greater fuel mileage too...if that is what you crave. Manufacturers are forced to make vehicles which please ALL kinds of customers all at the same time, so everything on the car has to be compromised. Not too stiff while cornering for grandma, and yet must provide good handling in the curves, etc, etc. 

 

It's your car...build it to please yourself. My only advice is while a 71 Riviera makes a wonderful, classy cruiser...it's not an easy platform to make a hot rod out of. In MY opinion it's better to "go with the flow," and make the Riviera better at being the kind of car it was designed to be. There are far too many other cars out there which are better choices for hot rodding. 

I dont really feel the need to "hot rod" per say... subtle things like a tacho or a few gauges I don't think infringe in its classiness. There are way better (cheaper/lighter) cars to hot rod. 

[Duff71Riv]

The vacuum gauge, temp and oil pressure are more for me ensuring the cars operating normally. I've read that old buick 455 have very very low oil pressure at idle, and I'm not to worry about it. Does that sound right?

[JACK M]

4 hours ago, Duff71Riv said:

The vacuum gauge, temp and oil pressure are more for me ensuring the cars operating normally. I've read that old buick 455 have very very low oil pressure at idle, and I'm not to worry about it. Does that sound right?

 

I just built an old 425 Nail head for my neighbor.

It had plenty of oil pressure when I primed it but only about 25 lbs when running and warmed up.

The owner told me that 25 lbs is plenty for that engine and its some what higher than when we started. It was in a beater Riviera but ran pretty good.

Its a hot rod now with dual quads in a 33 Buick sedan.

Fun stuff.

[JACK M]

I should have mentioned that it does indeed dip to about 15 lbs at a hot idle.

[John_S_in_Penna]

On 9/19/2018 at 8:41 AM, Duff71Riv said:

I have a friend who daily drives a 70s MG (if its working) on historical plates and hes never had any trouble. I dont think this law is really enforced but to be safe I just got regular plates. ...

 

You did the right thing!

 

Over the years, antique-car hobbyists have gotten 

reasonable laws passed that make owning an old car 

easier.  One such law is for antique plates for qualifying cars

that don't get driven much.  Because the old cars don't

get driven much, often the fees are less, or the fees

are paid once instead of annually, and the old cars don't

need annual inspections.  Laws vary by state.

 

Your friend, and anyone like him who doesn't follow the law,

endangers the hard-won privileges that genuine old-car owners

have achieved.  The more wide-spread the abuse, the

more likely the privileges could be taken away.

Laws ARE enforced, and you should encourage him

to do the right thing.

[ted sweet]

there is no benefit to antique plates in ny . it does allow you to register a yom but only benefit is using the plate

[Duff71Riv]

3 hours ago, John_S_in_Penna said:

 

You did the right thing!

 

Over the years, antique-car hobbyists have gotten 

reasonable laws passed that make owning an old car 

easier.  One such law is for antique plates for qualifying cars

that don't get driven much.  Because the old cars don't

get driven much, often the fees are less, or the fees

are paid once instead of annually, and the old cars don't

need annual inspections.  Laws vary by state.

 

Your friend, and anyone like him who doesn't follow the law,

endangers the hard-won privileges that genuine old-car owners

have achieved.  The more wide-spread the abuse, the

more likely the privileges could be taken away.

Laws ARE enforced, and you should encourage him

to do the right thing.

Well its an MG... itll probally break down soon enough!! But you do bring up a good point. Our town is really small though so I dont think they could have to much power to make any drastic law changes. It is good to follow the law 

[rocketraider]

Ohio is one of the most active old car states in the country so finding like-minded individuals shouldn't be hard. Cruise night season is winding down but hit as many of those as you can, with or without the Riv. You may find a bunch of grumpy old men who wear blinders to any car other than the one they own, but you just might find yourself a mentor who loves cars and loves helping a young buck learn how to wrench- esp if said young buck has proven he likes old American iron and not rice-a-roni.

 

Plus the cruise night crowd generally knows who does quality work at fair prices, and who can find old car parts when the parts store's computer says it don't exist.

 

Get yourself the factory shop manuals for the Riv. They're not hard to find and should be reasonably cheap. You need the 1971 Buick chassis service manual and the Fisher Body manual.

 

 

 

 

[Duff71Riv]

My XC coach actually owns a junkyard in Lorain OH and has an amazing car collection. I always go to him if I have a question about old cars. Our small town has an old car show almost every weekend in the summer, definitely at least  one every month until it gets cold. There’s lots of old retired people with old cars which is always fun to see on runs. I once saw a Pantera go by that was really neat. 

[Duff71Riv]

And yes rocketraider, old American iron is way better than rice-a-roni.

[Pfeil]

18 hours ago, rocketraider said:

Ohio is one of the most active old car states in the country so finding like-minded individuals shouldn't be hard. Cruise night season is winding down but hit as many of those as you can, with or without the Riv. You may find a bunch of grumpy old men who wear blinders to any car other than the one they own, but you just might find yourself a mentor who loves cars and loves helping a young buck learn how to wrench- esp if said young buck has proven he likes old American iron and not rice-a-roni.

 

Plus the cruise night crowd generally knows who does quality work at fair prices, and who can find old car parts when the parts store's computer says it don't exist.

 

Get yourself the factory shop manuals for the Riv. They're not hard to find and should be reasonably cheap. You need the 1971 Buick chassis service manual and the Fisher Body manual.

 

 

 

 

 Something wrong with rice-a-roni ? Explain please.

[Duff71Riv]

I have nothing against old Japanese cars, in fact I have a sweet spot in my heart for old RX7s. I just don’t like the unnecessary spoilers for a FWD Honda or wheels with 45 degree camber.. etc. The 80s 90s and 00s Japanese cars seem to be more prone to a cheap unnecessary mod (probably because of their cheap prices) but I guess the same attitude could be felt for people who build rat rods, which I for one love.  Although if it gets people into cars it can’t be too bad. I guess it’s all a matter of taste so I’m sorry if the term offended anyone. I just never heard rocketraiders “rice-a-roni “ before and thought it was humorous. 

[Pfeil]

49 minutes ago, Duff71Riv said:

I have nothing against old Japanese cars, in fact I have a sweet spot in my heart for old RX7s. I just don’t like the unnecessary spoilers for a FWD Honda or wheels with 45 degree camber.. etc. The 80s 90s and 00s Japanese cars seem to be more prone to a cheap unnecessary mod (probably because of their cheap prices) but I guess the same attitude could be felt for people who build rat rods, which I for one love.  Although if it gets people into cars it can’t be too bad. I guess it’s all a matter of taste so I’m sorry if the term offended anyone. I just never heard rocketraiders “rice-a-roni “ before and thought it was humorous. 

 Well the unnecessary stuff ends up on a lot of cars these days, not just Japanese cars. Ever see the shameful things that is happening in the old VW scene? The de cambered slammed Beetles. Dr. Porsche would be appalled. I think it's more on the people's shoulders than the brand they are driving.

 The Asian cars, and the Japanese in  particular and not the German cars were the cars that gave American car makers a wake up call so that today the American cars make a decent product although today it's hard to tell "who is who" in the industry unless you were a part of it or at least studied it.

 With the threat of tariffs against Japanese auto firms in the late 70's and early 80's the Japanese decided it was better to make their cars here. So they have design centers, Motor Sports,  product planning, marketing, Technical centers, Test Centers,  Engineering,  Special Tools, Accessory development,  foundries, and manufacturing and American Jobs!

 By avoiding tariffs by being in the U.S.A. , they also realized that the closer you are to your customers the better the product will be to fit the needs of the customer. So when I say it's hard to tell who is who it really means Japanese cars today have just as much and in reality more U.S. content than so called American cars.

 I wish they were more a part of the Collector Car market though.

Edited September 23, 2018 by Pfeil (see edit history)

[kgreen]

nevermind

Edited September 23, 2018 by kgreen
comment was tangent, somehow can't delete post now. (see edit history)

[Duff71Riv]

13 hours ago, Pfeil said:

 Well the unnecessary stuff ends up on a lot of cars these days, not just Japanese cars. Ever see the shameful things that is happening in the old VW scene? The de cambered slammed Beetles. Dr. Porsche would be appalled. I think it's more on the people's shoulders than the brand they are driving.

 The Asian cars, and the Japanese in  particular and not the German cars were the cars that gave American car makers a wake up call so that today the American cars make a decent product although today it's hard to tell "who is who" in the industry unless you were a part of it or at least studied it.

 With the threat of tariffs against Japanese auto firms in the late 70's and early 80's the Japanese decided it was better to make their cars here. So they have design centers, Motor Sports,  product planning, marketing, Technical centers, Test Centers,  Engineering,  Special Tools, Accessory development,  foundries, and manufacturing and American Jobs!

 By avoiding tariffs by being in the U.S.A. , they also realized that the closer you are to your customers the better the product will be to fit the needs of the customer. So when I say it's hard to tell who is who it really means Japanese cars today have just as much and in reality more U.S. content than so called American cars.

 I wish they were more a part of the Collector Car market though.

I do agree. The collector car market is not as strong for old JDM cars, but it seems to be growing especially with the start of these new shows such as JDM Legends etc. They are really neat cars and differ so much from big brash American cars. Rotary engines especially fascinate me. 

[Duff71Riv]

A question.. what would be the best way of getting rid of this rust spot? It’s the only one on the car luckily. 

[JACK M]

20 hours ago, Pfeil said:

Something wrong with rice-a-roni ? Explain please.

 

This is one of those things that if it has to be explained you will never understand.

 

"likes please"

[ol' yeller]

Best way to get rid of rust spot is to replace the fender.  I don't know how hard they are to find.  It appears to be in a place where new metal could be welded in or find a donor fender that is good there and cut and weld a patch panel.  The unknown is how much rust damage is in the fender supports and cowl.  You won't know until you remove the fender.

[Duff71Riv]

16 minutes ago, ol' yeller said:

Best way to get rid of rust spot is to replace the fender.  I don't know how hard they are to find.  It appears to be in a place where new metal could be welded in or find a donor fender that is good there and cut and weld a patch panel.  The unknown is how much rust damage is in the fender supports and cowl.  You won't know until you remove the fender.

So you wouldn’t recommend bondo? I figured it was a cheap solution and probably not the best

[ol' yeller]

You asked for the best way, not the cheapest way.  Bondo over a rust hole is a temporary fix at best.  It never lasts for very long.  It doesn't cost that much to do a repair correctly and you learn a new skill along the way.

[Duff71Riv]

Ok thanks. I’d rather do it right the first time then 10 times with bondo. 3rd gen riv parts are hard to come by though 

[Pfeil]

49 minutes ago, JACK M said:

 

This is one of those things that if it has to be explained you will never understand.

 

"likes please"

Oh I get it alright. It's the San Francisco Treat.?

[DLynskey]

On ‎9‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 7:15 PM, Duff71Riv said:

No I actually just had the car looked over by a mechanic cuz it was sitting for a LONG time.

 

Getting it checked by  mechanic was the best thing you could do. A lot can go wrong when a car sits a long time and those things should be fixed before you worry about the sound. Pay special attention to the brakes which have rubber parts that deteriorate with time even (or maybe especially) if they are not used. Brakes are more important than a muffler.

 

Congratulations with the Riviera. They are beautiful cars. I was lucky enough to have a dad who let me get my first car -- an antique needing lots of attention-- at age 15.  Sixty years later I'm still into cars.

 

Don

[rocketraider]

Does your highschool or school district offer autobody or mechanic courses? DK what you might get  into trying to enroll in a community or technical college summer program at 15, but it's worth looking into.

 

That's actually not a heinous repair. Cut the rotted metal out and tack weld a piece of sheetmetal in, then do the finish work with GOOD quality plastic filler- the kind you get at a body shop supply store.Then prime, and use closest match you can find in a spray bomb till you can get the car painted.

 

I talked with an 18-year old at a local show yesterday. He has a barn find 67 Cougar that seems much like your Riv. Boys your age are the future of the old car hobby and I will support you 100%.

 

Re: rice-a-roni. I like a lot of the Japanese cars. I owned several Celicas and Supras years ago, and wish we could get the performance variants here. But the picnic-table spoilers, fart-can mufflers and the like make the cars a complete joke IMHO. Yes, more a reflection of the owners than the cars. And yes, you see a lot of modern American-brand compacts dyked out the same way. Those are an even bigger joke.

 

Pfeil, try to remember that not all of us here are in the Republik of Kalifornia. We know that state is very restrictive on what can be done to any vehicle. I am truly thankful to live out in the hinterlands of southern Virginia where we're not subjected to all that eco-nazi shit.

[Duff71Riv]

Thanks!! My parents don’t really care about old cars but my great grandpa owned a few Buick dealerships and this was his baby. When he passed away the car went to my grandparents who drove it for a few months but stopped and it sat for 13 years. Over the summer they gave it to me to fix up and I got it running again and did everything I could without expert machinery. The tires and stuff I had the mechanic do and I had him check my work to make sure I didn’t mess up : )

[Duff71Riv]

Rocketraider, my high school doesn’t, I’m pretty much one of the inly kids who likes old cars. My other buddies have a few old cars (one has a super bee and another a 75 trans am) but the town next to us has a mechanic program and we are allowed to attend them. Sadly I’m in too many AP college courses right now to take an auto class so I just kinda learn from mistakes. I started on go karts ans mini bikes but I sold those to pay for some parts. 

[rocketraider]

As long as you're balancing your AP stuff with practical knowledge. 50 years ago in 4-H Club the motto was "Learn by Doing".  I'm pleased to know you won't be one of these idiots with a master's degree or doctorate who wouldn't be able to make a simple household repair. I have known many ppl with master's degrees who couldn't change out a faulty light switch.

 

I live close enough to Virginia International Raceway that I see a lot of exotics around, though I have yet to see a Pantera come thru here. I did once have to lead a lost Lamborghini Murcielago thru the backroads to get to the track. Guy had to be very aware of road crowns...

[Duff71Riv]

I live about an hour from Norwalk OH, and the Mid Ohio Raceway where they hold the Ohio mile. Those are really cool events and my grandpa used to drag race in Norwalk. 

[Duff71Riv]

Most AP nerds in my class just play video games. I figured working on old cars is more worthwhile. It’s definitly worth it when u pull up to a high school event or when I go to XC practice and everyone knows “that must be duff in that old car” 

They just have so much more character

[Pfeil]

2 hours ago, rocketraider said:

 

 

Pfeil, try to remember that not all of us here are in the Republik of Kalifornia. We know that state is very restrictive on what can be done to any vehicle. I am truly thankful to live out in the hinterlands of southern Virginia where we're not subjected to all that eco-nazi shit.

 Actually the EPA ( Federal Government) has all this ( especially after 1975 ) anti tampering laws already on the books. Enforcing them is another story, however you are responsible for what you do to a automobile.

I'm new here to the forum, do no live in Ca. but I did read and agree to this;

"You agree, through your use of this private forum, that you will not post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive or provoking tone, containing vulgar or profane language, threatening, harassing, hateful, sexually oriented, or containing personal attacks, or that are considered offensive of otherwise inappropriate by the moderators will be deleted. Certain conduct could result in revocation of AACA membership as outlined in the AACA By-Laws. Forum users unwilling to comply with the requests of the moderators or who ignore these guidelines will be banned. Moderators reserve the right to limit the time that a thread may be run. You agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyright is owned by you or by this forum.

"eco-Nazi s..t" and you are a Moderator???

[Duff71Riv]

Doesn't California have the highest ethanol percentage in its gas out of all the states? That must be quite harmful to old carburetted cars, especially if they sit with gas in them. I remember Roadkill did an episode and the California gas just ate away at the carb. I got the Riviera started on gas sitting for a dozen years, which in hindsight was a poor idea, but it still ran. I did drain it after though and it was basically a paint thinner/varnish. 

[John_S_in_Penna]

3 hours ago, rocketraider said:

I have known many ppl with master's degrees who couldn't change out a faulty light switch.

 

Everyone has specialized knowledge!  

I've known people who didn't use good English;  or who didn't

know King George III from King George V;  who couldn't write

a legally enforceable contract;   who couldn't measure and cut

a hip rafter;  or who weren't well-versed in computers.

 

 Ah, if we could only know everything,

able to play the piano well and rebuild a Hydramatic transmission

at the same time!  (Some of those inabilities apply to me as well.)

Edited September 23, 2018 by John_S_in_Penna (see edit history)

[Pfeil]

1 hour ago, Duff71Riv said:

Doesn't California have the highest ethanol percentage in its gas out of all the states? That must be quite harmful to old carburetted cars, especially if they sit with gas in them. I remember Roadkill did an episode and the California gas just ate away at the carb. I got the Riviera started on gas sitting for a dozen years, which in hindsight was a poor idea, but it still ran. I did drain it after though and it was basically a paint thinner/varnish. 

 No, Ca. is "E" 10. Just like most , if not all the states.

[Duff71Riv]

Oh ok I guess I was lead to believe false info... I’ve always wondered, what would one run a leaded engine on nowadays since lead has is illegal? I know the lead was a lubricant in the gas but since it’s been illegal for a while, what should someone run them on?

[Pfeil]

Lead has been Illegal for over 20 + years. You can get leaded fuel at airports and some race tracks but using leaded fuel is illegal on city streets. You can use E10 in your Buick but listen for detonation/pinging while your driving. Also if you haven't already change your fuel hoses to the compatible E 10 friendly fuel hose do it now because E10 eats the old fuel hose, some plastic's, some cork and some pot metal-( carburetor body ) . After I run/use my old cars I use a fuel shup off and let the engine run out of gas because I don't like the fuel sitting in the carburetor. One of my cars which has over 10:00 to one compression from the factory just couldn't take E10 so I had to change the compression ratio down to 9.5 and it's OK now. Cars with cast iron heads built after 1975 have hardened valve seats to prevent valve recession and leakage and they are ok with E10. Air cooled VW's with aluminum heads have always had hardened seats going back to 1938.

My newest car is a 2012 and in the owners manual it says NEVER use anything above E10.

[Duff71Riv]

26 minutes ago, Pfeil said:

One of my cars which has over 10:00 to one compression from the factory

Thanks Pfeil !! I’ll ask if the mechanic checked if the hoses were compatible with E10 fuel because I remember he saying that he replaced them. Just curious what car do you have with factory 10:1 compression??

[Pfeil]

2 hours ago, Duff71Riv said:

Thanks Pfeil !! I’ll ask if the mechanic checked if the hoses were compatible with E10 fuel because I remember he saying that he replaced them. Just curious what car do you have with factory 10:1 compression??

1962 Pontiac Catalina with a Pontiac 428 Cu. In. 10.75 compression with non Factory Pontiac aluminum heads. A Track /Road racing car.

1963 Pontiac Catalina with it's matching numbers 389 Cu. In. engine 303HP with 10.25 compression. 4 Range Hydra-Matic.

1969 Pontiac LeMans H-O hardtop coupe ( I special ordered in Nov. 1968 received in Dec. 1969- hard to believe I will have owned it 50 years in Dec.) a Pontiac 455 .030" overbore to 462 CU.IN. Originally with # 64 heads with 10.25, I switched to a pair of 1972 7K3 400" Pontiac heads to lower the compression to 9.5 to run on 92octaine pump gas. This car I also road race and occasionally go to cruise nights with. It has hardened valve seats because it's driven hard at the track.

Edited September 24, 2018 by Pfeil (see edit history)