trailer weight question

[C Carl]

I don't tow often, but when I do, I drive slower than when I'm "bobtailing". Even slower than the max legal towing speed limit. I always question the sanity of drivers blasting past me at 10 over pulling a trailer. Any trailer, any rig.  -  Carl 

[Bloo]

1 hour ago, C Carl said:

I don't tow often, but when I do, I drive slower than when I'm "bobtailing". Even slower than the max legal towing speed limit. I always question the sanity of drivers blasting past me at 10 over pulling a trailer. Any trailer, any rig.  -  Carl 

 

Same here. I guess now that everyone and their grandmother's poodle has a 1 ton dually and an equalizer hitch, maybe it's ok? I don't know. I still cringe at anything over 50mph.

[Robert Street]

On 6/22/2018 at 10:04 AM, edinmass said:

 

Yes John, I agree. What I see going down the road scares the hell out of me. I learned the hard way in my teens, trying to use a Chevy Blazer to tow a BIG car. Even with a good trailer, I didn't have a weight distributing hitch, and the truck was way too short and light. I bought a Chevy Dually after having twenty close calls in two hundred miles. I asked around and learned about the weight distributing hitch, which I have now had for well over thirty years. I spent the big bucks in the old days and bought the adjustable one...........remember this was when I was still having trouble finding the gas money for the truck..........its amazing what we got by with when we were young. Now I run a crew cab dually with a 34 foot tag. Its a triple axel spread with torflex axles. I run load range G tractor trailer tires at 110 psi, the tires never blow out, and wear like iron. I run Michelins on the truck. I have been thinking of going over to a 4500 series truck, but then CDL and log books start to apply in many states. I was thinking of buying a 4500 series truck, and putting 3500 series trim/markers on it so I could have the safety factor and not get stuck up in the DOT thing more than we already are. 

 

Ed having been stopped at several scales in Maryland and even run down by the Maryland DOT!  I have learned one hard lesson.  It doesn't make any difference what the  "stickers" are on the side of the truck or trailer they always go for the truck GAVW door plate and the trailer manufacturer GAVW plate and go from there to determine if CDL territory.  Then there is the fun stuff of taking a pad of paper out and adding the tires capacity to ensure the total is over the trailer manufacturer sticker. I could go on but this is a family show. I am at 25,000 GCVW so all I need is a medical card due to the trailer.

Robert

[Grimy]

California allows up through 9,999 lbs gross trailer weight on a Class C (passenger car) driver's license, but the prime mover can be up to 26,000 GVW (read "motor home").  If your gross trailer weight is 10,000 or more per manufacturer's plate/sticker, you need a Class A Non-Commercial license with medical card and a behind-the-wheel test, most of which is backing the combination.  Accordingly, there are many trailers out here built stronger but whose capacity on the sticker/plate has been "administratively downgraded" by the manufacturer to just under 10,000 lbs.  Likewise, there are few gooseneck trailers (almost certainly >10K) for the same reason.  We envy you residents of other states with more generous allowances.

[edinmass]

I understand the trailer tire capacity, I run load range G tires on my triple axle trailer, that gives me 4300 per tire or just under 26k  just for the trailer which is rated at 21,000, so no issue there. My truck is rated to tow 16,700 on a ball hitch. My car and trailer together usually run 13,500. My GCVW is 23,500 .  Since I am non commercial, and own the truck, trailer, and car, and ai am using it for  occasional recreational use, I am DOT exempt. All my equipment is like new, all lights and break away work, I carry triangles, extinguisher, ect........ and have never had a problem. I carry a copy of the Federal DOT rules, showing the exemption. Had a hard ass in  Connecticut  Bust my chops, checking everything, and finally was upset and let me go. He kept accusing me of breaking the law.........I am a licensed Mass State Inspection Sticker agent, and explained that if the truck is legal in Mass, it’s legal on ALL federal highways, get of on a state road, and that MIGHT be another story. If you are usually polite, and they see your doing your best, most of the time they will let you go. I keep my luggage in the rear seat of the truck, to show I am on vacation. I even keep my flare kit, triangles, air pressure guage, oil, washer fluid, and other assorted items in a box in the back where they can see them. I even carry a spare break away battery and switch.........all that with a plain white rig that is well maintained will usually keep you on your way. But sometimes they just try and bust your balls. Photo is my latest trailer, Ford is gone, I’m towing with a GMC now.

Edited July 17, 2018 by edinmass (see edit history)

[John348]

1 hour ago, edinmass said:

 Since I am non commercial, and own the truck, trailer, and car, and ai am using it for  occasional recreational use, I am DOT exempt.

 

 

Not in Maryland! 

as the sign says "ALL VEHICLES OVER 10,000 LBS MUST EXIT"

[edinmass]

Understood, but if it’s a Federal Interstate, the DOT exemption still applies. Since I am never at risk of being over weight, it wouldn’t bother me to run through the scales......but in hundreds of thousands of miles, I have only been stopped for passing a scale once, and since I was non commercial and not for gain, I was on my way in a few minutes. I have heard your state is aggressive on the scale issue. I probably drive through it five or six times a year, for the last twenty years, and have never been stopped after bypassing a scale. I’ll probably get jammed up next time......?

Edited July 17, 2018 by edinmass (see edit history)

[John348]

7 hours ago, edinmass said:

Understood, but if it’s a Federal Interstate, the DOT exemption still applies. 

 

Ed I thought that too on my back up to NY, I got pulled over for driving past the scale. Took my license said I would get it back at the scale house. I had to turn around at the next cloverleaf pay the toll going south, turnaround and pay the toll going north again and pull off on the scale. Told me to go to the impound yard for a safety inspection... it was a two hour ordeal and cost me 3X the tolls so it is your call.

By the way the troopers did not like me telling them about federal laws, so if it happens to you I suggest not even mentioning it, be safe

[edinmass]

Understood.......lots of it depends on both peoples attitude. A driver license in private property, and he can't keep it. That said, its not worth the pissing contest if your equipment is good. I think a lot of what goes down depends on your rig, and how it looks. I have a plain white truck and trailer that looks generic. As time goes by I think the electronic enforcment changes will start catching up to everyone. Since I am never heavy or overloaded anymore, and I do check all my bulbs and safety equipment, I wouldn't expect any issues. Every time I have been stopped its been very early morning daylight hours. I think I'm going to continue to drive by them untill something new occurs. I also try my best to avoid the 95 corridor from Richmond to New Haven, just because of the expensive tolls and bridges, and the 81 & 84 route are much less traveled, less accidents, and less delays over all. It's a shame that honest and decent people get hassled. Lets face it....it's a money game for them. Recently 45 Mass State Troopers were caught stealing from the state in an organized RICO scheme. A big black eye for them, is seems to still be getting worse. 

[John348]

Maryland does not have a facility on 81. They were state troopers who requested my license, my truck was 2 year old GMC 2500 diesel and the trailer was a plain gray that was three years old, and it was empty. From what I could gather they were looking for pirate car transporters not paying road use tax, who use the similar rigs as us... Do what you want, but it looked like they were looking to make money for the state

[Robert Street]

I agree with all and have spent much time trying to figure out why I have had so much scale issues in my home state.  Since my trailer is one of those previously mentioned 9,990 models and only 11 pounds under the 10,001 that puts me in class A non CDL in Maryland as well as California I do have a medical card and have previously been asked for it when stopped.  I don't intend to get A non-CDL yet!

I have done my homework and have discovered the Maryland issue.  Yes, as John stated Maryland is the only state I have towed in the requires a rig such as ours to go into the scales as we are all certainly over 10,000 GCVW.  The main reason for this is for the visual inspection process as unfortunately there have been a couple significant towed accidents here that caused loss of life thus creating the legislature to go beyond the 26,000# federal requirements(which they can).  A "half ton" pickup and "landscaper" trailer will always be over 10,000 GCVW and they get some legendary fines for the usual safety items ignored. It was this type of vehicle that caused a very serious accident on the Bay Bridge(not I95)

The Maryland Commercial book does NOT exempt our privately owned trucks or car trailers but in the fine print there is a statement that the section that Federal exemptions are in has been adopted by Maryland legislation.  The Maryland commercial book is the book that the scale house members train on as it has been shown to me previously.  I have met with our area state senator and delegate on this when I discovered it to have the book changed but it never has been.  I have received calls from MD DOT headquarters confirming that I am exempt if the truck and trailer are owned by me with my matching address on file with my class C driving license. Thus I carry the Federal and Maryland motor carrier books with me AND my luggage on the back seat.

A friend of mine tows with a motor home and a triple trailer like the one pictured and he is licensed in Delaware and the vehicles are licensed in Delaware.  He has never been stopped previously in Maryland but this spring was stopped near the Bay Bridge by a mobile Maryland DOT not on I95 and received a $1,500 fine for NOT being DOT licensed.  The reason was the motor home address was his business address and the trailer and his non CDL license were his home.  Thus he was deemed driving a not registered commercial rig in Maryland.  Due to Delaware taxes his best option was to obtain an A CDL license and register the motor home with the federal DOT!

 

Summary:  Make sure your stuff is correct while traveling through Maryland!  Odds are that you will get stopped even by a mobile unit or on I95 they occasionally set up a weekend only temporary scale house at the stadium lot on I95 and pull all units in for "inspection".

Ed my photos were Ford but like you. I am now GMC with the new Duramax.  Much more power and better fuel economy.

Robert

 

Edited July 17, 2018 by Robert Street (see edit history)

[bluefishgary]

Hi  Lets start by saying I live in Maryland 30 years now. Retired from state work.  Next I have a home in Baltimore so my truck and trailer are licence here. Next I have a home in WVA off of 70

so I go to WVA and back to Baltimore once a month. Now my big garage is in WVA,so I trailer my car or truck at least 2 a month, and have NEVER stoped at the scales.

 My truck is a 2015 dually my trailer is a 2017 vintage at 44 ft goose. Truck is 15,000 gwr trailer is 18,000 . I do have a Maryland  class A licence. no medical card needed for A maryland. Now here the trick my trailer has FULL Living Quarters bath, shower,stove, sink and a queen bed, so In the eys of maryland it's a RV. I have never ben stopped I run the speed and do not drive like a crazy person.

My stuff is clean and taken care of but I do not stop at the scales. You do not see RV in the scales, Motorhomes are well over 10,000 gvw and a lot with a trailer. Now when the truck and trailer do not match up they may be a problem but the might be a nother reason that your friend was stoped. Please rember that a CDL is commercial that neans that you get paid to haul somthing.

Now the big thing is a race team that wins prize money at a track or has a sponser can be commercial. If you are going to a show you pay to enter your car that is not commercial.We can so far 

as to look at last year tax forms.  One thing that will get you stopped in Maryland is if you have Example   Maryland tags on truck and Maine tags on trailer.

One last thing to remember is 65 ft overall. Most big motorhomes and a short trailer will be ok Example 40 ft motorhome 24ft trailer = 64 ft but you have 4 ft of toung so to long.

[John348]

Well gary, all I can say is what happened to me, and what the sign says "ALL VEHICLES OVER 10,000 POUNDS" 

[bluefishgary]

Johm348 I do not doubt what you said. But just think if (ALL VEHICLES OVER 10,000 POUNDS")  big long line to get to scale  had to stop then why do the RV not stop???

 If the vehicle is commerical it must stop,  But if not go past!!    Heck that would mean my one ton p/u would have to stop GWR 15,000 lbs. 

The big thing is ,are you commercial !!!commercial !!!     

 Its a fine line and I will tell you most LEO do not know what they are looking at. Now a LEO who is DOT or truck inspector will know what they are lookin at.

 

  

  

[John348]

Gary, I thought the first time was a mistake, so the second time I did pull off and asked the person at the scale "Am I supposed to stop here, I am non commercial" he said "yes sir" I tow my cars in many states and Maryland is the only one that says "ALL VEHICLES"

 

Just like the agricultural stop entering and leaving Florida that to is more specific stating all vehicles with trailers, rentals,  blah blah blah..... 

 

I am not commercial everything but. The initial time I was stopped my trailer was empty and he was questioning as to why, and did not think it was his business. I am just a retired guy going between my home in Florida and my home in NY who stores some of his cars in Florida,  his answer was (typical) "Ignorance and a failure to read and understand the law is no excuse"  and went on to tell me to share this with all of "my car club  buddies" "that Maryland is all vehicles not just commercial" 

And yes I drove past the Maryland scale south bound on I-95 two weeks ago and the was a real long line of vehicles. and yes there were RV's on that line I had no trailer so I went past but they seem to be now more prepared for the anticipated  traffic flow.

 

Do what you want, I personally just need to invite any of Maryland's finest trying to take my pension money. All I can do is share my experience which is similar to Robert's. I am not a retired law enforcement member so I don't have any magic ID cards, and I know the hard way debating the law with a law enforcement officer is not a going to be a winning proposition for me at the time and place of the situation

[Robert Street]

bluefishgary:

 

Interesting comments from a fellow MD resident.

Yes your trailer is classed as an RV thus is exempt in the Maryland commercial book.  Your RV is exempt from stopping at the scales unless the power unit or the trailer has commercial logos.  My friend's big fine was that the motor home power unit was addressed to his business thus he was no longer exempt thus a pretty big fine. I am not sure how the MD DOT decided to stop him except I always suspect they ran the tag and knew they had found a commercial unit.

You must have a medical card in Maryland if towing 10,001 plus pounds no matter what the GCVW but since you are probably classed as RV probably exempt.

Yes I agree about your over length example as in that case you are exceeding Maryland OAL and that is a healthy fine also.

A friend is a long time drag strip owner very close to a Maryland scale even though his racing facility is in Delaware.  Yes, he is frustrated by some of the racer's experiences that have to go into the scale or have been stopped after running the scale but his advantage is that his busy times are Sunday's or Saturday night when the scales are usually closed.  Some of the racers have big corporate sponsors and that is a gray area as the business most of the time are writing off the sponsorship as a business expense but the individual racer usually doesn't reap any of the revenue as it goes into the race car and they don't file an expense report on the racing activity just like John or I don't expense our trips to a national show. 

To summarize I am not commercial and the GCVW is just under 26,000 but I have been random stopped a few times. And yes I have had my license clipped to a "book" and returned after getting to the scale house inspection area.  Yes we are legally required to stop as our trucks without trailer are well over 10,000 GVW but I have heard that isn't enforced but I have stopped at a scale with truck only and was green lighted.

Robert

[bluefishgary]

Let me ask a question, If you need a medical car for a class (A) in maryland please get me the reg # so I can look that up. Yes you must have a medical card for a CDL But not required for a 

class(A) in Maryland.    If you need it for class (A) Maryland how does a person get the drug testing (randon)??  All CDL holders are in the random pool the company that they work for can and does send you out when ever your number comes up.They have to send a %% of there CDL holders every month.I was sent out 3 times in one month.   When I was employed by the state we had to have a CDL (A) .

When I turned in my CDL(A) for a class (A) I was told no medical card needed!! Now in my former job I did accident investigation on Big rigs or Buses. I worked very closely with MSP

and still have manny friends who still work there. Just so you know I worked at MDOT/MTA

 

[edinmass]

Seems if you hit the scales your giving them the chance to bust your b**ls, drive by, they need manpower, and need to not be busy, after 300k and only two stops, I’ll keep driving bye them and make them chase me down. They can scale me, but since I  am never heavy, I’ll be on my way. On 84 to 81 MD s about twenty miles or so.......let them catch me.........

Edited July 19, 2018 by edinmass (see edit history)

[charlier]

Just some advice for anyone who tows a trailer that is more than a few years old. When you have time check the Vehicle Identification Number on your trailer. Most trailers have the V.I.N. printed on a decal/sticker on the side of the trailer. Over time, the sun fades the printed V.I.N. and it becomes unreadable. A friend was stopped in MD, when towing his trailer. The Trooper could not read the V.I.N. on his trailer when he tried to check the paperwork against the V.I.N. on the trailer. That was one EXPENSIVE citation. My friend called me and told me to check my trailer. Sure enough the V.I.N. on my trailer had faded and was unreadable. Lucky for me the trailer dealer where I bought my trailer (in MD)  engraved my trailer's V.I.N. on a metal plate which I then attached to my trailer. Turns out that this dealer had been getting a LOT of requests for metal V.I.N. plates but would only do it for customers who bought their trailer from them if the dealer still had the paperwork for the trailer on file.

 

Bottom line, if the V.I.N. on your trailer is not readable get a replacement or you are looking at one EXPENSIVE ticket.

[Grimy]

3 minutes ago, charlier said:

Just some advice for anyone who tows a trailer that is more than a few years old. When you have time check the Vehicle Identification Number on your trailer. Most trailers have the V.I.N. printed on a decal/sticker on the side of the trailer. Over time, the sun fades the printed V.I.N. and it becomes unreadable. A friend was stopped in MD, when towing his trailer. The Trooper could not read the V.I.N. on his trailer when he tried to check the paperwork against the V.I.N. on the trailer. That was one EXPENSIVE citation. My friend called me and told me to check my trailer. Sure enough the V.I.N. on my trailer had faded and was unreadable. Lucky for me the trailer dealer where I bought my trailer (in MD)  engraved my trailer's V.I.N. on a metal plate which I then attached to my trailer. Turns out that this dealer had been getting a LOT of requests for metal V.I.N. plates but would only do it for customers who bought their trailer from them if the dealer still had the paperwork for the trailer on file.

 

Bottom line, if the V.I.N. on your trailer is not readable get a replacement or you are looking at one EXPENSIVE ticket.

Good advice.  Because my tall trailer AKA Fugly has its VIN sticker in a place requiring a trooper (or me) to lie on his back in the dirt and look up, I've photographed it and carry a print of the photo in a document protector affixed to an inside wall.

[edinmass]

Another case of having to prove your innocent. More BS, and you wonder why people are moving away from the whacked out tax and spend states to the more livable and lower tax states...........that’s right........I just did that. I’m glad I no longer live in the Northeast. No state income tax anymore......there’s a seven percent pay increase from day one. And it’s just one instance of less expensive living.......the only people moving into the over taxed states are the ones trying to live on the public gravey train.

[Grimy]

39 minutes ago, edinmass said:

Another case of having to prove your innocent.

Actually, Ed, that's a pragmatic means of getting released from a potential stop in record time and getting on my way again.

[Robert Street]

On 7/19/2018 at 6:44 AM, bluefishgary said:

Let me ask a question, If you need a medical car for a class (A) in maryland please get me the reg # so I can look that up. Yes you must have a medical card for a CDL But not required for a 

class(A) in Maryland.    If you need it for class (A) Maryland how does a person get the drug testing (randon)??  All CDL holders are in the random pool the company that they work for can and does send you out when ever your number comes up.They have to send a %% of there CDL holders every month.I was sent out 3 times in one month.   When I was employed by the state we had to have a CDL (A) .

When I turned in my CDL(A) for a class (A) I was told no medical card needed!! Now in my former job I did accident investigation on Big rigs or Buses. I worked very closely with MSP

and still have manny friends who still work there. Just so you know I worked at MDOT/MTA

 

 

I have just obtained a copy of the revised 2018 Maryland DOT book and it isn't specifically mentioned (medical card) in the 2018 edition as was in previous years.  The old  reference was if towing a 10,001# or over non commercial trailer a physical card was needed but not subject to random as CDL.

Interesting our car trailers still aren't specifically exempted in Maryland from commercial but they have added utility trailers classification as exempt?  I wonder if that is where we are as in the federal we are clearly exempt as "car trailers not for hire personal use only".

Oh, an interesting reading in the 2018 book is  a section on towing GVW trailer weights with various classes of vehicles and saw "3/4 ton" mentioned.  I am one ton but are they limiting the towing ability in MD on 3/4 vehicles now?

Ask your friends in DOT that 3/4 ton question and I will ask mine also. oh, and ask about the card if over 10,000 # trailer GVW.

Yes, when I was working for the county we had the dreaded random testing for CDL's.

Robert

[Robert Street]

17 hours ago, edinmass said:

Another case of having to prove your innocent. More BS, and you wonder why people are moving away from the whacked out tax and spend states to the more livable and lower tax states...........that’s right........I just did that. I’m glad I no longer live in the Northeast. No state income tax anymore......there’s a seven percent pay increase from day one. And it’s just one instance of less expensive living.......the only people moving into the over taxed states are the ones trying to live on the public gravey train.

 

Yep Ed just bought in Boca Raton a couple of month's ago for the reasons given above.

Robert

[MikeMike]

Us calls 'em seesaws.

 

The skinny kid sits at the end.

The fat kid sits nearer the middle.

 

Trailers and tugs are much like seesaws.

 

If yer puts a heavy kid on the bar,

yer takes weight off the front wheels.

 

Mucks up your steering summat wrotten,

 

Smart folks move the load backards and foreuds

to get the nose weight right.

 

A longer nose means you can

overload your trailer front axle

wi'out lifting so much weight

orf of the front wheels on your tug.

 

Not so much swings and roundabouts

more the toy you had fun when you wuz a kid.

 

Or, first order levers if want a bit o' simple science.

http://www.dynamicscience.com.au/tester/solutions1/hydraulicus/simplemachineslevers1.htm