1952 MG TD

[Tate]

“Due to the ongoing pandemic” or “During these uncertain times” have become dare I say popular excuses for  lacking services with no relation at all to Covid. What are people going to do someday when they can’t use it as an excuse any more. 

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Late in the game, but occasional forum poster "Daytona" is also not so new owner of Abingdon Spares here in CT, providing MG T series and now  MGB parts.  Marty is as honest as they come and he, his team all have MGs.  If you still need some odds and ends, highly recomend them. 😊

[Luv2Wrench]

2 hours ago, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Late in the game, but occasional forum poster "Daytona" is also not so new owner of Abingdon Spares here in CT, providing MG T series and now  MGB parts.  Marty is as honest as they come and he, his team all have MGs.  If you still need some odds and ends, highly recomend them. 😊

I have bought a couple of things from Abingdon Spares and I've been happy with I bought.  I do have a growing list of things that I'll need to complete the car and I'm definitely in the mood to send money somewhere else at this point.

[Steve_Mack_CT]

I feel your pain, one nice thing about the mainstream Brit cars, like early Fords, is some good supplier sources.  The car looks fantastic, BTW!!

 

BTW, you likely know this but I just saw where the New England MGT Register is holding the annual Gathering of the Faithful in Long Island in mid-October.  Looks like you could possibly make the meet?? 🤔

Edited August 30, 2021 by Steve_Mack_CT (see edit history)

[Luv2Wrench]

The past few days I've been working on getting the interior doors panels on, along with the handle/latch mechanism.  Tedious nightmare would be a nice way of describing the process.   The basic challenge with these cars is that they were "built" one by one.  Aside from the engine and suspension components, there are no "hard" dimensions.  They built a wood frame, bent sheet metal around it, hung the doors and ran bolts/screws in place.  At least half of the fasteners are wood screws which, really, can screw in any old place.  I spent about 4 hours getting the door latch mechanism in place, got the door shutting nicely, everything nice and aligned, interior panel in place, etc, etc.  I had to take it all back apart because the exterior door handle can only be in one place as it has two screws that go through the metal skin.  That dictates the angle and location of the latch mechanism on the inside.  As I found out... you have to put that on first, then get everything else to fit.   Anyway.. the doors are on, driver's side is just about perfect, passenger's side is close and probably as close as it will ever get.   I really like the look of the chrome on the dark green.  Very happy with the color.

 

 

 

[chistech]

Looking very sharp!

[Luv2Wrench]

I tweaked the hinges on the passenger's door again and I'm now happy with the fit.  I'm still waiting on the piping so there's not much more I can do interior wise.  In addition to a bunch of small tasks, I installed the transmission cover with its 12 screws in unreachable locations.  The transmission cover adds a bit of stability to the entire cockpit area.  It ties the floor boards together and to the firewall.   This car is really a sum of its parts.  Unfortunately I'm really getting to the point that I can't do anything else until I get the piping.   The area under the dash is tiny and very difficult to work in... unfortunately a bunch of stuff happens there.  Both front interior panels terminate in there.  There is a foot rest in the passenger's side. There is a panel that covers the area underneath the dash.  All of those things need to be squared away before the dash goes in and they all depend on the two interior panels which, of course, can't go on until I have the piping.   I have some welding to do on the bumper support bar so I can do that and I couple of other things in the engine bay.  After that... I'm idle until the piping gets here.

 

 

Edited September 4, 2021 by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)

[Luv2Wrench]

Finished bumper support bars as well as a pretty long list of little stuff.   Had to take the transmission cover back off as well as remove the passenger's side floor board.  I missed 2 screws when I was putting down the floor board.  Unfortunately they're covered by the transmission cover so that had to come out.  Then I realized the screws wouldn't fit anyway because the floor was a little too far towards center... so out it came and I trimmed a bit off the side.  I eventually got every back together and I'm very happy with how solid it is.  This is the first time I've had all of the pieces 100% connected.  I built a battery tray, nickel plated the body/chassis ID plates and other small tasks.  I'll try to get some pictures up tomorrow or next week. 

[nickelroadster]

You say you have nickel plated some small tasks.  Are you doing your own nickel plating?  Are you using Caswell kits?

[Luv2Wrench]

11 hours ago, nickelroadster said:

You say you have nickel plated some small tasks.  Are you doing your own nickel plating?  Are you using Caswell kits?

I just started nickel plating some small parts.  I am not using Caswell as my experience with their Zinc plating kit was not positive nor was their attempt at support.  I found a zinc plating formula online and I've been using that for a couple years now.

For the nickel plating I looked online as well.  I filled up a 5 quart bucket with white vinegar, used nickel welding rods as anodes, applied electricity and added salt until it was pulling about 3 amps at 20 volts.  I let that run overnight and the next morning I had a nice green nickel acetate solution to plate with.  I'm using a constant current power supply and set it for about 80ma per square inch that I'm plating.  The parts I've done were brass and they polished up to a mirror finish.   You can buy nickel acetate online but it seems a bit pricey. 

[nickelroadster]

Don't know about their zinc plating kits but I have used their nickel plating stuff for several years.

[Laughing Coyote]

22 minutes ago, nickelroadster said:

Don't know about their zinc plating kits but I have used their nickel plating stuff for several years.

I was thinking of one of those kits. Do you have to buff it after plating or does it have a chrome look after plating? Never messed with that kind of stuff.

[Luv2Wrench]

It looks good right out of the solution.  I think it might look a little better after light buffering.  I think the nickel plating is a lot easier than the zinc plating.

[nickelroadster]

You really need to buff before you plate.  Most items are (especially iron or steel) will work much better if plated with copper first.

[Luv2Wrench]

Piping arrived!!  Installed right side and center section along with a temporary install of the dash to check the placement of the piping.  Test fit the front and rear panels on the passenger's side and they look pretty good.  I did have to remove the leather from the wood and trim a bit here and there to get it exact but the initial fit was very acceptable.   I think the rear panel is probably in for good once I resolve how the back corner will work.   Moss provides very little information on the install, basically says to get the Horst Schach book and follow those instructions.  I do have that book and it has been helpful but it glosses over the details of how the back corners work.  Internet searches have returned all kinds of poor implementations.  I have some "unrestored pictures" and I think I see how it fits together so I'll be working through that next.  Once resolved it should be a rather straightforward job of fixing the panels in place.

 

One other thing to resolve is how to join two pieces of hidem.  Where the front and rear panels meet the hidem needs to be joined. I'm not real sure how this is supposed to be done.  My guess is to angle cut them flush and staple on both side. Any thoughts?

 

 

[chistech]

Hand sew the two butted ends together with heavy button thread. I never did much hand sewing until I started installing the Hampton coach interiors and now sew a lot of pieces together like that. It makes for a professional looking joint. It will be tedious but the result is worth it.

[Luv2Wrench]

12 hours ago, chistech said:

Hand sew the two butted ends together with heavy button thread. I never did much hand sewing until I started installing the Hampton coach interiors and now sew a lot of pieces together like that. It makes for a professional looking joint. It will be tedious but the result is worth it.

 

Perfect, thanks!!

[Bloo]

On 9/27/2021 at 8:41 PM, Luv2Wrench said:

One other thing to resolve is how to join two pieces of hidem.  Where the front and rear panels meet the hidem needs to be joined. I'm not real sure how this is supposed to be done.  My guess is to angle cut them flush and staple on both side. Any thoughts?

 

I can't seem to connect the picture with what you are talking about. Care to elaborate?

 

16 hours ago, chistech said:

Hand sew the two butted ends together with heavy button thread. I never did much hand sewing until I started installing the Hampton coach interiors and now sew a lot of pieces together like that. It makes for a professional looking joint. It will be tedious but the result is worth it.

 

What does that look like? Does it come out looking serged, or do you attempt to pull the two pieces of hidem together while hiding the stitches?

 

[chistech]

You can see the stitches but if done evenly and with a color matching thread, they will look very good and almost unnoticeable. Many things like this were hand stitched on our old cars when needed.

To stitch the ends, use a curved needle after tacking the hidem down. Stay about a half inch from each end with the tacks or staples so the ends can lift slightly so you can maneuver the tip of the needle through from the top of one side and up from the bottom on the other. Then just repeat the process. 

Edited September 29, 2021 by chistech (see edit history)

[Luv2Wrench]

Here's a picture to help explain.  The rear piece (on right) needs to have the hidem follow the curve and then magically attach to the front piece of hidem.  Where and how are not described in any instructions.  I think from what @chistec is saying I'd overlap the two on the front piece (left side), cut them to make a butt joint and then sew them together.  I think at that point they will be mostly hidden by the carpet and seat.  Possibly completely hidden.

 

Now that I look at the picture of my own car... it seems blindingly obvious that the area in question will be 100% hidden by the carpet and the seat.  I think I'll still do the technique @chistech suggested

 

Edited September 29, 2021 by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)

[John_Mereness]

On 9/29/2021 at 4:25 PM, Luv2Wrench said:

Here's a picture to help explain.  The rear piece (on right) needs to have the hidem follow the curve and then magically attach to the front piece of hidem.  Where and how are not described in any instructions.  I think from what @chistec is saying I'd overlap the two on the front piece (left side), cut them to make a butt joint and then sew them together.  I think at that point they will be mostly hidden by the carpet and seat.  Possibly completely hidden.

 

Now that I look at the picture of my own car... it seems blindingly obvious that the area in question will be 100% hidden by the carpet and the seat.  I think I'll still do the technique @chistech suggested

 

Factory or not, I gutted the cording out so the welt was relatively flat, glues it where I wanted it (with super glue), and then wrapped the welt around to the rear of the panel- it looks pretty good, though had I to do it over again i would have upholsterered the panel a touch and put a grove in it at edges for the welt. 

[Bloo]

On 9/29/2021 at 1:25 PM, Luv2Wrench said:

Here's a picture to help explain.  The rear piece (on right) needs to have the hidem follow the curve and then magically attach to the front piece of hidem.  Where and how are not described in any instructions.  I think from what @chistec is saying I'd overlap the two on the front piece (left side), cut them to make a butt joint and then sew them together.  I think at that point they will be mostly hidden by the carpet and seat.  Possibly completely hidden.

 

Now that I look at the picture of my own car... it seems blindingly obvious that the area in question will be 100% hidden by the carpet and the seat.  I think I'll still do the technique @chistech suggested

 

 

One more question, why is that hidem there? It looks to be tacked over a panel, and to not be hiding anything. Is it hiding nails that hold the panel on?

 

Edited October 2, 2021 by Bloo (see edit history)

[Luv2Wrench]

@Bloo yep, the panels are attached with staple/nails through the hidem.   @John_Mereness I pulled the cording out on the ends and wrapped it around the back using contact cement to keep everything in place.  It all turned out just fine.  Thanks for the extra info and tips!

 

[John S.]

Luv2Wrench, The MG is looking spectacular! Really nice work.

[Luv2Wrench]

Haven't had a lot of shop time but managed to get the right side interior completed.  Unfortunately I couldn't do the left side because I was missing 4 screws.  I ordered those 4 weeks ago and when they finally came in... they were not BSF thread so they wouldn't work.  Since I have a lathe I made them which, really, I should've just done to start with.  I was a little unsure about turning a 4" rod from 5/16" diameter (size of head) to 3/6" diameter (size to be threaded) as I felt it would just bend.   I took multiple really light passes and while it worked it really didn't... while it didn't bend it flexed enough that I cut a 20 thou taper from one end to the other.  I Googled how to do this different and found I should be using a follow rest and/or a box cutter (basically a follow rest and cutter combined).  Google also found a video where a guy (Joe Pieczynski - really great site) turned a 2" long needle out of 1/2" stainless steel.  He did so setting the depth of cut to be all of the material to be removed and only doing 1" at a time.   With only 1" out of the chuck it is easy to hog off the material to remove.  My lathe had zero problem with that and I was able to create my screws very quickly.  Very unintuitive at first but makes complete sense later.   Once parted I made a slot with a hacksaw and then zinc plated them. Another thing I learned was make your own parting tools.  I've been trying to use those thin ones thinking since it was taking less material it would work better.  Wrong.  I ground one that is a little bigger than 1/8" wide and it plows through the work with no issue.  Parting went from nightmare to no big deal.  Once I turned the rod to size I used a die to add the threads.

 

[Tate]

It’s super impressive you can just toss some metal on the machine and just whip up some screws. Great work!

Edited October 22, 2021 by Tate (see edit history)

[Luv2Wrench]

Making good progress.  All interior panels are in as well as 90% of the side curtain storage box.  I'm missing the male half of the snaps so I'll need to get those and a couple of correct woods screws to finish that off.  

 

 

I got the glove box insert installed and the dashboard in place ready to start putting the instruments in.   I'll probably get the instruments installed again and then install the "under dash".  Once that is in place I move to the top and side curtains.

 

 

[DrData]

Beautiful work. Maybe I should ship my TD east so you can apply the same great skill to it 😎

[Luv2Wrench]

Finally completed the "under dash" panel.  There are some measurements for this on the web and they're close but I checked against my car and could tell they wouldn't fit.   I ended up making mine by creating the first templates from pieces.  The center part was easy because it was just a rectangle.  I cut that out of cardboard and stuck it in place.  I could the measure from there to the right side in front of the roll bar.  I cut that piece out and glued it to center section with hot melt glue.  I repeated that for the all the other sections until I had one piece.  Once complete I, of course, couldn't remove it... lol.  I had to make a few mods just to get it out.  I transferred the assembled template to another sheet of cardboard and then spent some time tweaking that.  Once I was happy with how it fit I made the bracket.  It attaches to the inner dashboard in 3 places and then to a wood support just behind the roll bar on each side.  With all of that complete I visited my local custom auto upholstery shop and got some "door board" which is a waterproof heave cardboard of sorts.  They called it "waterproof board" and I've heard it called "Cowlboard".  I transferred the template to that, cut it out, test fit it and then covered with vinyl.  I'm happy with how it came out and thrilled to be done with that task.  There's just zero room under that dash and getting down there and then back up was taking its toll on my knees!!

 

 

 

 

I have most of the instrument panel assembled but, of course, I'm waiting on a couple of items to complete that.  I'll probably start on the top and side curtains next.

[Luv2Wrench]

Instrument panel and dashboard are in... but... another setback as the small line that feeds the oil pressure gauge will need to be replaced.  It was too short and I bought some tubing to lengthen it and that worked great.  Except I must have gotten some flux up in the tube when I was putting the connectors back on so the solder wicked up the inside effectively blocking the tube.  I don't have enough tubing to do it again and Moss sells a ready made tube for not much more than the tubing would cost.  Lot less hassle so I'll be going that route.

 

I started fitting the top and side curtains.  From my many hours of reading about this online it seems the trick is to fit the side curtains such that the front frame is parallel to the windshield and the rear frame is parallel to the front frame.  One end of each frame is essentially fixed in position but you can adjust the other end to try and achieve the proper alignment.   On the driver's side I was able to get them adjusted and locked into place with no issue.  The front frame is 7/16" from the windshield which is a good gap for the side curtain fabric to cover.  This leaves just enough of a gap between the front and rear frames so the fabric for the two frames can overlap.  Driver's side is done!

 

 

I wasn't as lucky on the passenger's side.  While I could get everything parallel and level, the front frame is 31/32" (about 1/2" too much) from the windshield.  The gap between front and rear is 1/2" too small.  Fortunately I believe this means if the front frame slides forward 1/2" everything will be great.  Unfortunately the only way I see to do that is to cut the welds where the vertical bar meets the bottom of the frame, slide the bar back 1/2" and weld it back.  There's a bit of an angle where that is welded on as well (not flat against frame) so I'll need a jig of sorts to get it welded back correctly.  Repaint will be in order as well. 

 

 

Once the passenger's side frame is fixed and in place I can install the top bows.  The front is fixed onto the windshield and then you adjust the height/depth of the middle to get it to the correct height such that the top will sit parallel to the side curtain frames and just far enough away that the side curtains will slide under the edge of the top when you close the doors.  Too far away and there isn't enough overlap to provide protection.  Too close and when you open/close the door the side curtain will remain on the outside of the top.

 

I've read that installing the top and side curtains is one of the more difficult tasks on the car and is often not done correctly.  I can certainly see why but I believe the community has put out some good tips and there seems to be a logical way of getting this to fit correctly.  Getting the side curtain frames perfect before proceeding any further forward is, I believe, the key to a good results.  So tomorrow I'll be firing up the torch.

 

 

[uweny]

Hello Luv,

can you send me the link where you wrote about the how to fit the wooden floor panels - I am stuck ther

[Luv2Wrench]

I'm not sure I covered the floorboards here on the site but I do have some of the work done in a video.  Good luck on your restoration! 

 

[Luv2Wrench]

Cut the post off the side curtain, slid it back 1/2" and welded it back with no issue.  Started fitting the top bows only to find that in one of the joints a rivet had broken at some point and was replaced with a bolt/nut.  As such the bows do not open all the way on one side as the nut interferes.  Of course I don't have the correct size rivet laying around so I ordered that and it should be here tomorrow.  

[John S.]

Luv2Wrench, beautiful work all way round. John

[Luv2Wrench]

Nearly a month has gone by and I'm still fighting with the top and side curtains.  I can get either to fit great but I can't get them to fit each other. The top I'm using is, of course, a reproduction and is made by Robbins.  It seems to be very high quality and I'm happy with it.  The side curtains are also made by Robbins and again, very high quality.  I can compare the side curtains to a possibly original set that came with the car and the reproductions are very close. In the places in question they're actually a bit bigger so that should be helping.  I'm starting to think that the top bows I have are reproductions and while you can make the top fit great with them, the top will be too high to meet the side curtains.  I've noticed pictures online that have this exact problem (too high in the center, too low in the back) and I think it is an issue with the top bows.   I have some bows that I think are original but they've been heavily modified in the front.  When I tried the top with those bows it did fit better.  After a lot of comparisons I think I've found the difference between the two and it shouldn't be that difficult to correct.  One of the metal pieces in the front is about 0.35" too short.  I've cut some new pieces and look forward to giving it a try after Omicron finishes having its way with me.  I managed to evade the COVID virus all through the initial mutations but this last one spreads too easily.  It seems mild and if this were 3 years ago I would say I just had a cold... a helluva cold.  The kids got it first and they're pretty much fine now so I think I probably have a day or two to go.

[keiser31]

33 minutes ago, Luv2Wrench said:

Nearly a month has gone by and I'm still fighting with the top and side curtains.  I can get either to fit great but I can't get them to fit each other. The top I'm using is, of course, a reproduction and is made by Robbins.  It seems to be very high quality and I'm happy with it.  The side curtains are also made by Robbins and again, very high quality.  I can compare the side curtains to a possibly original set that came with the car and the reproductions are very close. In the places in question they're actually a bit bigger so that should be helping.  I'm starting to think that the top bows I have are reproductions and while you can make the top fit great with them, the top will be too high to meet the side curtains.  I've noticed pictures online that have this exact problem (too high in the center, too low in the back) and I think it is an issue with the top bows.   I have some bows that I think are original but they've been heavily modified in the front.  When I tried the top with those bows it did fit better.  After a lot of comparisons I think I've found the difference between the two and it shouldn't be that difficult to correct.  One of the metal pieces in the front is about 0.35" too short.  I've cut some new pieces and look forward to giving it a try after Omicron finishes having its way with me.  I managed to evade the COVID virus all through the initial mutations but this last one spreads too easily.  It seems mild and if this were 3 years ago I would say I just had a cold... a helluva cold.  The kids got it first and they're pretty much fine now so I think I probably have a day or two to go.

Get better soon!

[Luv2Wrench]

So... I've given up on the top for now.  I made the changes to the top bows and it did fit wonderfully but, of course, it wouldn't fold up!!!  Lengthening the piece did fix my fitment issues but since there were two pieces tied in two points the lengthened part kept it from folding correctly.  I've decided I will use the original top bows that someone hacked up.  It will take some time to repair the damage that they did but I think it will work out in the end. 

With the top out of the way for now, I've been going around the car and getting all the last little bits done.  As you all here have experienced this part is taking forever.  Each little detail seems to take hours.  The stupid COVID is a pain as well because it certainly takes some energy away.  I'm definitely "out of the woods" but it is still a drag.   I'll post some pictures this weekend.

 

 

[Luv2Wrench]

I managed to work at least half a day all week and the weekend.  It was great to have some quality time to work on the car.  I got a ton of tedious detail work completed.  

 

 

I also manage to get the carpet in.  I need to vacuum it but I'm thrilled with how it turned out.  There was a LOT of trimming involved and I was very relieved that I didn't trim too much or in the wrong place.

 

 

I also start getting the fenders on, including both rear fenders and one of the fronts.   Really thrilled with how they look and how the chrome plays off the dark green.

 

 

As usual the list of things I'm missing continues to grow so my progress slow back down to a crawl over the next week or so. 

 

[frank29u]

Looking fabulous!  hope you feeling better soon!

[Laughing Coyote]

At least you get to get back to work on yours.  I'm waiting for some warmer weather to start back on the Merc.  Looks good and get better.