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20g is thin stuff. It's going to buckle and warp some with that kind of heat.   I'm sure those old fenders are 18g.  Try welding some 18g and see if there is a difference. You're doing pretty good. Keep it up.

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I thought for sure they would be 18 but I measured them and found them closer to 20.  It could be because of where I measured... I might take some more samples and see what I find.  I think 18 would make a huge difference.    The 1913 Metz is 24g... so I'm going to need a lot of practice and patience for that!!!

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Still plodding along.  One of the repairs I've been dreading since day one is the quarter panel.  The quarter panel is, of course, steel wrapped and nailed around a wood frame.   Removing those nails and unwrapping the sheet metal is quite a chore.  Where the metal has gone around curves it has been expertly shrunk flat... the reverse is required to get it off and I had a tough time getting the doors done.   I finally decided to tackle that this afternoon and I was quite surprised to find that it can be slipped off.  Once the screws, nails and rivets have been removed the back comes out a bit, then forward a touch, then up and a slight rotate up while pulling the front up and the panel off nicely without much distortion.  I am glad I took it off because I found that these panels are separated by felt and that felt has probably been in there since it was made and there was a fair amount of surface rust.  I will need to do some research and find a suitable replacement that might be better at not holding water.  I will most likely take off the other quarter panel to treat that surface rust as well.  Glad it is easy to do!!

 

The wood along the top is fine but the vertical piece, at least at the bottom, could use some work.  I'll probably end up making a new vertical piece and re-glue/screw the joints. 

 

The welding practice has been going very well.  I've tackled a few small jobs I needed to do and it went very smoothly. 

 

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Edited by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)
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Use 30 weight tar paper instead of the felt. It won’t hold water and I use it all the time for anti squeak or shims for wood to metal fit. In other places black hockey stick tape works well.

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Jeff, great progress!

 

Don't mean to hijack the thread, but, chistech,  this sounds like a good idea.  With my MGA resto, I have the same issue with my wooden floorboards against the metal chassis.  I was going to go with an eastwood sealer, similar to body seam sealant, but seeing your post, I may reconsider.  

 

christech, do you think 30 weight tar paper would be a good replacement for the felt originally used between my metal chassis and plywood floorboards?  Seems the answer would be yes.  If so, where do you get 30 weight tar paper?  Thanks guys.

 

Chris

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After seeing the rust in that quarter panel it seemed likely that the rest of the panels were the same but just hadn't gotten to the point the rust ate through.  I think this is because neither the metal nor the wood were sealed before assembly.  I guess the epoxy primers we have today just were not available then.  As such... I took it all apart.  I'll replace a piece of wood or two, all of the wood panels, re-glue and screw the frame.  I'll epoxy primer the wood and metal frame, each of the sheet metal panels and then reassemble using the 30 weight tar paper (as suggested by chistech) between areas that originally had felt.  I feel that with two good coats of epoxy primer on everything prior to assembly it should be good for many, many years to come.  I'm headed to the lumber yard on Friday to get some marine grade plywood and some more 8/4 ash.  I'm pretty fortunate that we have a fantastic lumber yard about 45 minutes north of me.  

 

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Edited by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)
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Roger:  No, in addition to time to build, the structural integrity is sketchy at best.  The MG TD certainly has "crumple zones" but not quite like the modern definition of that. :)
 

At the start of this week the goal was to take the body off the frame.  That has been completed, however, not the way I had imagined.  The body is off the frame, but it came off piece by piece and is now stacked on a table. :(

 

I'm glad I hadn't already gone to the lumber yard because the requirement for ash has gone way up.   Fixing all of this will not take that much time and I do enjoy the wood work aspect so I'm not too disappointed but I was hoping to get the car in paint before the end of the year.  That seems to be a stretch now.

 

 

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Oh my.  Looks like something I wouldn't want to tackle.  I'm sure you will get it all fix upped and better than new.  At least your getting time to work on yours. 

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Great stack of 3 D puzzle parts.  Your skills will have it re-assembled in no time.  Like many here, you're very talented.  (Martin, you wood enjoy that too.)   frank

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Your car must have lived in a damp environment.  I have an Alvis that shows the same issues and it came from Pa.

Al

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On 11/8/2019 at 9:24 AM, alsfarms said:

Your car must have lived in a damp environment.  I have an Alvis that shows the same issues and it came from Pa.

Al

Al,

The car, at least since 1975, has spent its time in the South (Georgia and South Carolina).  I believe it was stored inside most of this time but I don't think the buildings were climate controlled.  As such, you had the humid south and likely pretty big temperature swings at times producing some condensation. 

 

Media blasted two of the panels on the right side, no other problems found.  One positive of having the body completely dissembled is that it now fits in the blast cabinet so I don't have to use the Clogmaster 2000. 

 

Rough cut two of the pieces I'm replacing.  I was pretty lazy this weekend but the little time I did spend in the shop went well.  Hoping to get a little more done this coming week.

 

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Edited by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)
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I have to admit, looking at the stack of parts on the 2x4 frame reminds me of scenes I see all over New England in fields. It looks just like a logging sled or farm wagon frame used by the farmers here. When they finally retired them, they would just stack the pieces of them and others on top of them. I personally bought a 29’ Chevy 1 1/2 ton truck in just the condition I described. It was in pieces and everything was just stacked flat on top of it. It ran good and I ended up selling it before I ever started working on it. Seeing since my family was originally  in the slaughtering business, I was going to make a cattle truck out of it, pt the family name on the door, and put one of those life size fiberglass cows in the bed! Unfortunately it didn’t happen, well, at least yet. 😆 

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Got everything blasted and treated. Sheet metal is either ready for patching or ready for primer. 

For the wood I decided to try Bondo Wood filler on a couple of questionable pieces.  I'm not using it to rebuild structural areas but more to fill in little notches and nicks that might either be left as is, have a piece scarfed in, or result in a new piece being made.  This certainly is the easier and more accurate of the choices.  I'll need to see how it handles brads/screws running through it.  I wouldn't use it somewhere that it would need to hold the screw/brad, but I think going through it into solid wood should be fine.  Like I say... I'll just need to see how it reacts.  It seems a bit more pliable.  Bondo has a companion product (rot restorer??) that is an epoxy much like West Systems.  I treated some of the less dense areas with that as well.  Both of them are rather expensive but they're easy to work with.  Mix the filler in small batches and trim it with a razor blade before it fully sets.

 

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Edited by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)
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Front frame assembled.  I replaced the sill and front rib.  I need to test fit the replacement riser in the back fender and then I can secure it on the sill.  I'll probably have to assemble the whole side on the supporting rail to verify that the front and rear meet correctly.

 

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Have you got to the point that you have a good idea about the wood filler/epoxy?  Your work looks good!

Al

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17 hours ago, alsfarms said:

Have you got to the point that you have a good idea about the wood filler/epoxy?  Your work looks good!

Al

Yes, the epoxy seems good, though not as good as West Systems.  It isn't two parts and doesn't soak into the wood as much as West.  That also means it is a lot less trouble. :)  I think it does a good job sealing slightly damaged wood before application of the filler within the limitations of the filler (not structural). 

The filler is a slightly more flexible version of regular body filler.  This is a good thing as it not likely to crack.  It would not be, in my opinion, suitable for holding screws nor would it be structural.  For filling, however, it seems superior to typical wood fillers as long as you painting (ie; not staining). 

Edited by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)
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Been following as a guest watching your progress.  Great workmanship!  I have a '53 that I picked-up as a project that someone else started.  New wood frame and sheet metal came with the car.  I'm trying to install sheet metal and hope that you can help with a question.  I noticed in the picture of your blasted front quarter panel that there is slight offset along the front top corner.  What are the dimensions of this offset on the panel?  I can see that at the front it is about the thickness of the scuttle panel and tapers to zero.  My panels are flat in this area and I need to recreate this feature. 

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28 minutes ago, Tom53MGTD said:

Been following as a guest watching your progress.  Great workmanship!  I have a '53 that I picked-up as a project that someone else started.  New wood frame and sheet metal came with the car.  I'm trying to install sheet metal and hope that you can help with a question.  I noticed in the picture of your blasted front quarter panel that there is slight offset along the front top corner.  What are the dimensions of this offset on the panel?  I can see that at the front it is about the thickness of the scuttle panel and tapers to zero.  My panels are flat in this area and I need to recreate this feature. 

Thanks! Post a picture of the area you need dimensions for and I'll try to help!

 

Edited by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)
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Connected the front and rear.  Will let the glue dry and, hopefully, take the sheet metal back off.  I've started on the driver's side already.

 

Tom53MGTD:  I think I understand what part you'd like to see and have attached some pictures.  It is a very slight offset.

 

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15 hours ago, Luv2Wrench said:

Thanks! Post a picture of the area you need dimensions for and I'll try to help!

 

The pics that you posted show the area in question.  This is the best view and explanation that I have seen.  Looks like the offset tapers approximately 2" and the amount of the offset in the front view is a little more than a 1/10".  Thanks, this will help a lot.

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8 hours ago, Tom53MGTD said:

The pics that you posted show the area in question.  This is the best view and explanation that I have seen.  Looks like the offset tapers approximately 2" and the amount of the offset in the front view is a little more than a 1/10".  Thanks, this will help a lot.

 

The offset is a little shorter in length, in the picture above it is completely smooth still at the 6/10th mark.   I will check later today but I think that there is a slight mismatch between the thick top side piece (under the scuttle) and the rib that runs down to the sill.  I believe the offset is where this mismatch occurs.  I remember thinking I had messed something up but went out and verified it on the parts car.

 

Update:  I checked and the passenger's side offset is a little longer, probably 1.75".  I think somewhere around less than 2" should be fine.  There is a cutout of the wood piece to provide the clearance for the offset but from the best I can tell, that cutout is not the reason for the offset.  I think the offset is to for clearance where the scuttle slides on.

 

Edited by Luv2Wrench (see edit history)
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Got the sheet metal off without issue and I'm very happy with the frame.  Got all the pieces rough cut for the driver's side.  I decided to scarf in some new wood on one piece rather than replacing it.  The spirit of the restoration is to keep what can be kept and this piece certainly could be saved.   Obviously the sill could not be nor the rib that goes on the front.  It was broken at a critical point and was too thin to patch.    The new sill still needs to be shaped and joinery is to come but I think I should get that done tomorrow. 

 

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Front and rear joined on the driver's side.  Good start to the Thanksgiving break, really hoping to get a lot done between now and Monday.

 

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!!

 

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