Access to Brake Lines under Hydraulic Assembly

[Biarritz]

As one of many having Teves ABS problems, Is there an easy way to gain access to the brake line connections under the hydraulic assembly?  The service manual glosses over this step.  I was curious if a panel could be easily removed in the wheel well or something?

 

Thanks.

[retiredmechanic74]

Depending on what area your wanting to get to I believe you ether need to remove the inner wheel well or make your own access panel.

[mensanguy]

Just did this job. If you have a lift, you got it made. If not, use a jack and follow  the procedure below.

 

1-chock all the wheels

2-loosen up the left front wheels lug nuts

3-jack up the left side of the car-high as possible

4-remove the wheel and tire

5-contort your body so you can reach underneath thru the suspension, and manipulate your arm up to the fittings

6-this is where a crows-foot wrench or stubbys are worth their weight in gold.

7-there are two sizes of fittings, I believe 11 and 13mm

 

With a little luck, and finesse, you should be able to loosen all three fittings and remove them. A WORD TO The WISE-- be very careful with how you move and handle the brake lines, in that if you get them out of alignment, they are a beach to get started again. Ask me how I know this.

[Hemi Dude]

14 hours ago, Biarritz said:

As one of many having Teves ABS problems, Is there an easy way to gain access to the brake line connections under the hydraulic assembly?  The service manual glosses over this step.  I was curious if a panel could be easily removed in the wheel well or something?

 

Thanks.

Tell me, what are you trying to accomplish? Also, tell us what engine is in the car as the procedure will be different between 4 cylinder and V6.

If it is the removal of the entire assembly, you will need to remove stuff from above and do not have to go for it from underneath.

 

You may also have a look at this site, https://www.allpar.com/fix/brakes/tc-brake-booster-replacement.html

Edited March 2, 2018 by Hemi Dude (see edit history)

[Biarritz]

 

My TC is the 4 cyl Turbo II Automatic (I forgot to mention that).  I have a complete re-manufactured hydraulic assembly I bought about 2 years ago knowing mine was starting to have issues.  Ideally, I wanted to find a local mechanic in the northern VA area to swap it out; but no one here wants to work on cars this old and this uncommon of a model (I've even asked mechanics who do odd-jobs on weekends at their house).  Usually I get around that issue by doing the stuff myself -- but the hydraulic assembly is something I'd rather not do myself.   Knowing what needs to be removed on the topside would be helpful information too (as well as knowledge of what is still available (to buy) if something breaks and what is not --- around that surrounding area under the hood!)

 

I "may" have access to a lift if one mechanic that I'm talking with now will take on the job (and thats a big "if"). 

 

Another related question:  The symptom of mine failing is that the brake pedal will drift to the floor slowly when constantly pressed such as at a stop sign, etc.  I've been told this NOT the accumulator .... so what is the symptom/differences of an "accumulator failing only" and "hydraulic assembly failure"?  Releasing the brake completely and re-applying the brake gives me ability to have average brake again ... until it held down again and pedal will slowly drift to the floor again.  I am not sure if this good enough brakes to even drive the car to a shop.  

 

 

 

[Hemi Dude]

To begin with, you do not need a lift to access the brake lines under the Hydraulic assembly.

In order to remove the entire thing, it is easier just to remove the air cleaner box and the throttle body which is necessary in order to get the ABS unit out from under the hood anyway.

If done carefully you don't even need to replace the gasket between the throttle body and the intake manifold. Once that is out of the way, you can reach the fittings under the assembly using the proper metric line wrench.

Since you will be installing a replacement assembly you will need some room to work inside the car. I removed the entire drivers seat and track as well as the steering column to gain sufficient access under the dash. If you looked at the photos and instructions on  https://www.allpar.com/fix/brakes/tc-brake-booster-replacement.html, you have seen what I did.

The 4 mounting nuts up under the dash are not all easy to get to, especially one of them. A 3/8" drive, deep well 13mm flexible socket will do the trick.

If you want to talk, 805-216-9257 is my cell #.

 

Symptoms of a bad hydraulic assembly (master cylinder) is as you describe.

A bad accumulator will give you a HARD pedal immediately or on the 2nd application of the brake pedal. But the pedal will not sink to the floor.

 

The safety of driving to the shop is your call. 

[mensanguy]

Wish I'd known about removing the air box and throttle body--it would have saved me a bunch of frustration and scraped forearms!

Hemi, you are a wealth of good information. Glad you are around!!!

 

[Jim Bird]

I agree with mensaguy. Hemi is an invaluable resource for our club. Along with many others

[Biarritz]

Hemi,

 

Thanks for your reply.  I did look at the photos you had.  I hadn't anticipated removing the steering column.  I assumed that was needed to replace the brake pedal swing-arm to convert to non-ABS; but, I wouldnt be replacing the brake pedal swing-arm if putting-in another hydraulic assembly. 

 

So I guess I'm asking if removing the steering column is needed for this swap?

[Hemi Dude]

6 hours ago, Biarritz said:

Hemi,

 

Thanks for your reply.  I did look at the photos you had.  I hadn't anticipated removing the steering column.  I assumed that was needed to replace the brake pedal swing-arm to convert to non-ABS; but, I wouldnt be replacing the brake pedal swing-arm if putting-in another hydraulic assembly. 

 

So I guess I'm asking if removing the steering column is needed for this swap?

It is not mandatory but it gives your body a little more room. The column just slips out of the universal joint connector at the steering rack. True, you have to disconnect some harness connectors. Have a look up under the instrument panel and make your own decision.

[Biarritz]

Are there any tips to removing the electrical connectors to the hydraulic assembly?  Due to age, the connectors are not very pliable and seem somewhat hardened.  I'm concerned about breakage.  A lot of the connectors are further secured by a metal clip (each different) and its not obvious how to release it so that it can be unplugged w/o damage.  Some connections are barely visible  -- Do those get unplugged "after" the assembly is unbolted from mounting nuts so you have access?

 

Per the shop manual, it identified the main valve connector and pump/motor connector as ones with spring clip.  Where exactly does the clip get pressed? 

 

For the main hydraulic assembly (figure 11), the manual states to "just pull to unplug", but I can see a metal restraining clip on the connector body (harness side).  How is it really removed?

 

As for the pressure switch it does have a "interlocking edges" molded into the connector body on both sides (hydraulic assembly side of connector), so some kind of releasing force needs to be applied so it unlocks/releases.  Again, with the connector body on the harness side being so stiff/hard (non-pliable), what's a good way of removal?

 

In general, is there anything that can be applied or sprayed on the connectors to make them more pliable?

 

 

[Hemi Dude]

7 hours ago, Biarritz said:

Are there any tips to removing the electrical connectors to the hydraulic assembly?  Due to age, the connectors are not very pliable and seem somewhat hardened.  I'm concerned about breakage.  A lot of the connectors are further secured by a metal clip (each different) and its not obvious how to release it so that it can be unplugged w/o damage.  Some connections are barely visible  -- Do those get unplugged "after" the assembly is unbolted from mounting nuts so you have access?

 

Per the shop manual, it identified the main valve connector and pump/motor connector as ones with spring clip.  Where exactly does the clip get pressed? 

 

For the main hydraulic assembly (figure 11), the manual states to "just pull to unplug", but I can see a metal restraining clip on the connector body (harness side).  How is it really removed?

 

As for the pressure switch it does have a "interlocking edges" molded into the connector body on both sides (hydraulic assembly side of connector), so some kind of releasing force needs to be applied so it unlocks/releases.  Again, with the connector body on the harness side being so stiff/hard (non-pliable), what's a good way of removal?

 

In general, is there anything that can be applied or sprayed on the connectors to make them more pliable?

 

 

Those 'spring' chips, just press down in the middle of the BRIDGE of the spring clip and it releases at the 2 sides. The ones without the spring clip, grab the connector between the plastic end and the rubber boot and give it a "smart, quick pull' straight off. 

If you have read the book as I just did, you will know which is which.