rdukw

1924 White Yellowstone bus Help

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After following this bus for 25 years I finally got it in my hands last weekend (My once in a lifetime barn find). I am hoping a expert may chime in and give me a little advise. I can not find any info or books on the engine. I am about to change the oil as the car has not run in over 25 years due to a stuck motor (that I have gotten freed up) and I don't know how much oil she takes, what grade or even where to pour it in. Also this bus has electric start and a generator system that looks factory.

 

Thank you in advance.

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Yellowstone Bus Tours...1 866-439-7375  I am not sure if they are still using original engines or have modernized them but if you can get to their maintenance department.  The 1924 White 2 1/2 Ton chassis truck two gallons of oil.  Our AACA Library & Research Center has a manual for this model.

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Do you know if the manual could be gotten in pdf form.

 

The engine has a sight glass with a float. The only place I have found to put oil in is the breather which requires taking a bolt out and is very clumsy for pouring oil in

 

car.jpeg

Edited by rdukw (see edit history)
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2 minutes ago, Steve Moskowitz said:

The manual could be scanned or copied.  Call Chris Ritter at 717-534-2082 for the cost

 

Thank you. I will give him a call

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I think you have found the place to add the oil. Lots of early engines have difficult oil fill procedures. You have a great bus. Best of luck with it!

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3 hours ago, fordrodsteven said:

I seem to recall seeing an article in Hemmings within the last year regarding the Yellowstone (white) trucks.

Yes, but that was for busses made 1930s to 1940s.

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Assume you have dropped the pan and cleaned all sludge including the oil pickup ? No better time to check the bearings. What did you find down there ? Pre lube everything you can reach (valve train , etc.) , with a very heavy motor oil , and prime the oil pump with the same. This can be done by feeding heavy oil (I have actually used a turkey baster - don't tell Sandy) , at the line outlet to the pressure gauge. It looks like you know your way around ancient vehicles , this is all S.O.P. Obviously you have lubed the cyl walls when you freed up the engine. As to first charge of oil , use a very light , perhaps 0W/20 , high detergent oil. It will turn very black very quickly , but you must insure that the oil circulates and reaches everything. Use cheap oil at first , and change VERY frequently if you can not adapt a full flow filter. Maybe at 40 - 50 miles first change. If it is not black yet , you might be able to go 100.

 

My '24 Cadillac had been used to a diet of 40 wt non detergent. I wanted to get that junk outta there and give it a treat. Here is a pic of the full flow oil filter with a cleanable 40 micron screen installation we did. You really have to look to see it from above. There was zero sludge ANYWHERE  when we dropped the pan. Zee - ro ! The bearings were fine. Filled with 15W/50 Synthetic , and ran a few hundred miles. Drained , and cleaned something like 1/2 cup , maybe a bit more out of the filter. Repeated over 500 miles or so , way less crud. Maybe a thimble full next. Now , changing at 1000 miles almost nothing. I would like to try to find a 20 micron screen. But after several thousand miles , the oil still gets black quickly. It does not hurt anything , and as I say , the filter comes up empty for all practical purposes. I am now using the finest oil possible for an old vehicle like this which has layup periods. Amsoil Z-Rod. I use the 20W/50. They also make a 10W/30. Or mix 50/50 for 15W/40. Or find a better oil and let me know. Nothing but the best for my cars. 

 

I love your new toy ! I am really happy that your long wait and patience paid off ! What fun !    - Carl 

 

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December 2017 Hemmings Classic Car magazine ran a story about the White bus from 1936-39 model years.  Nice read on the history of White buses used in the national parks.

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 My 1925 Model 15 White Truck has a lost oil system. It is different than your truck. Looks like yours has a governor and one oil filler is just along side of it. On my truck that oils the timing gears. Looks like a sight glass or it may have a level indicator with a float in the oil pan just behind the carburetor. My truck has sight glasses on the dash that you see the oil drip though and a tank on the firewall to put oil in. Very Cool save by the way. Dandy Dave! 

Edited by Dandy Dave (see edit history)

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Also to check the year there is a list of serial numbers. The number will be stamped in the left frame horn on the outboard side up front just below where the headlamp socket is bolted. Dandy Dave! 

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Our small town celebrated its 150th birthday in 1987. I borrowed the late Wil Markey's early White Yellowstone Park bus, loaded it up with my Son's entire 14 member day care class and drove in our celebratory parade. The kids loved it. Unfortunately it "failed to proceed" while I was delivering it back to its owner and we went home on the hook.

  • Haha 1

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15 hours ago, C Carl said:

Assume you have dropped the pan and cleaned all sludge including the oil pickup ? No better time to check the bearings. What did you find down there ? Pre lube everything you can reach (valve train , etc.) , with a very heavy motor oil , and prime the oil pump with the same. This can be done by feeding heavy oil (I have actually used a turkey baster - don't tell Sandy) , at the line outlet to the pressure gauge. It looks like you know your way around ancient vehicles , this is all S.O.P. Obviously you have lubed the cyl walls when you freed up the engine. As to first charge of oil , use a very light , perhaps 0W/20 , high detergent oil. It will turn very black very quickly , but you must insure that the oil circulates and reaches everything. Use cheap oil at first , and change VERY frequently if you can not adapt a full flow filter. Maybe at 40 - 50 miles first change. If it is not black yet , you might be able to go 100.

 

My '24 Cadillac had been used to a diet of 40 wt non detergent. I wanted to get that junk outta there and give it a treat. Here is a pic of the full flow oil filter with a cleanable 40 micron screen installation we did. You really have to look to see it from above. There was zero sludge ANYWHERE  when we dropped the pan. Zee - ro ! The bearings were fine. Filled with 15W/50 Synthetic , and ran a few hundred miles. Drained , and cleaned something like 1/2 cup , maybe a bit more out of the filter. Repeated over 500 miles or so , way less crud. Maybe a thimble full next. Now , changing at 1000 miles almost nothing. I would like to try to find a 20 micron screen. But after several thousand miles , the oil still gets black quickly. It does not hurt anything , and as I say , the filter comes up empty for all practical purposes. I am now using the finest oil possible for an old vehicle like this which has layup periods. Amsoil Z-Rod. I use the 20W/50. They also make a 10W/30. Or mix 50/50 for 15W/40. Or find a better oil and let me know. Nothing but the best for my cars. 

 

I love your new toy ! I am really happy that your long wait and patience paid off ! What fun !    - Carl 

 

image.jpeg

image.jpeg

I started with ATF and thinner in the cylinders till I got movement then I gave them a heavy dose of straight ATF and got her to hand crank thru. I have not pulled the pan as that is a very big project and I am not planing on driving the car at this point as it needs all new wood. I did how ever pull the large cover / screen and drain the nasty sludge / sheet of petrified oil. I was able to reach in and scrap most of it out. After that I put it back together and filled it with mineral spirits to let it soak for a few days to get rid of the last of the sludge. It looks as though the nasty oil is contained to the pan as the crank and rods look perfectly clean. All of the valve train is getting a good soaking of motor oil as well. I have heard two different trains of thought on detergent oil versus non detergent and I have not come to a consensuses which is better for this case..

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On 2/22/2018 at 8:03 AM, rdukw said:

Do you know if the manual could be gotten in pdf form.

 

The engine has a sight glass with a float. The only place I have found to put oil in is the breather which requires taking a bolt out and is very clumsy for pouring oil in

 

car.jpeg

 

It looks like a giant touring car.

I like it!

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The buses currently in service in Yellowstone Park have Ford F350  chassis and running gear to include automatic transmissions. I think Ford participated in this conversion which preserves the ambiance of the buses while providing the safety required for hauling people on crowded park roads.

Edited by jerry k (see edit history)

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1 hour ago, jerry k said:

The buses currently in service in Yellowstone Park have Ford F350  chassis and running gear to include automatic transmissions. I think Ford participated in this conversion which preserves the ambiance of the buses while providing the safety required for hauling people on crowded park roads.

Those are the newer busses than mine.

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I have no specific idea if this might help you.  The 22nd edition of Dykes has pages of information on a "White 3/4 -Ton Truck".  The drawings look like your engine, spokes match and some of the descriptions match yours. Does yours have the backwards shift?  Lots of information about ball earing main bearings (2) and that the oil in the crank case is only for cooling.  Maybe some of the information would help.  No indication of the year of the truck in the article. 

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The president of the Yellow Stone Bus Company is Bruce Austin, Nye, MT.  Bruce can tell you all about your car, be prepared for a long conversation.  In fact I purchased the one that President Franklin Rosevelt used during his tour of Yellowstone.  It is 1928 Cadillac.  Bruce has it now.  His associate, Sage Olson, Billings, MT has the same car as yours that has been restored.  You can contact Bruce at baustin1@earthlink.net or (909) 273-4613

Dan Marx

803-425-8649

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When we were in Chattanooga for a reliability tour a few years ago,  Corky Coker had one about that era that they used to shuttle us up to his house during an afternoon stop. You may try and contact Coker tire for some information.

 

Edited by Binger (see edit history)

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