Turbinator

Getting the color right

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On 3/19/2018 at 7:44 AM, rodneybeauchamp said:

Hi Bob and Jim,

would a white primer be a good choice instead of the grey primer to bring out the red in the VHT? ( not wanting to change the recipie but just a thought)

 

You have just given me a project for my new grit blast cabinet ?????

 

And I used some masking tape to join the seams on the aluminium decal plate and seems to work ok. Though this time I may use a silicone adhesive.

 

cheers

Rodney

 

Rodney, I’ve had a devil of a time getting the seams to come in  place on the metal decal. I’m close with the seems and I am willing to live with less than perfect. BUT, 5 feet away the air cleaner is Rembrandt quality.?? on another? Please post a pic of your aircleaner with the white paint as opposed to the cream color. I’d be interested to see your fine work.

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2 hours ago, KongaMan said:

If the top coat is opaque, it doesn't matter what color is under it.

 

Wrinkle red paint is NOT opaque.  You have to work with it to see what I mean.  The underlying color really influences what the final color looks like.

 

So perhaps instead of . cream base like Buick used, we should use an orange sherbet color.

 

 

Edited by Jim Cannon (see edit history)

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3 hours ago, KongaMan said:

Random thoughts...

- Red turns orange over the years.

- It's entirely possible that different paints were used at different times during the production run.  There's no reason to assume that an air cleaner painted in October was identical to one painted the following April.

- Why not prime it, paint it with a light-color wrinkle finish, then cover with a top coat of the correct color?  Wouldn't that end up with the correct texture and color?

Mr. Konga Man, I believe a paint color code or name by the manufacturer of the shade appropriate orange/red would be helpful. 

( Granada ) Red Riviera Bob

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3 hours ago, RivNut said:

I looked again and found other pictures.  It appears that either the color from month to month may not have been consistent or perhaps as,  Jim says, who knows what heat and age may have done, but I saw something this time that I'd not made a note of before.  None of the original air cleaners for which I found pictures are painted in a gloss; they're all either a satin or flat finish. 

 

Back in '68, Carolyn and I used to sit in a little bar on the south side of Emporia and play G9, Otis singing "Sitting on the dock....." a couple of times per night.and drink PBR on tap.

Ed, I can say PBR was one of my favorites. Ive been a R&B hound since I was a boy. 

Could an agreed upon color appropriate of the air cleaner be color matched at an automotive paint shop?

Thank you,

Bob Burnopp

 

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5 minutes ago, Jim Cannon said:

 

Wrinkle red paint is NOT opaque.  You have to work with it to see what I mean.  The underlying color really influences what the final color looks like.

Using the process I mentioned, it doesn't matter if the wrinkle paint is opaque; it's just there to provide texture.  It is the top coat which is opaque, and that's what counts.

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15 minutes ago, Red Riviera Bob said:

Ed, I can say PBR was one of my favorites. Ive been a R&B hound since I was a boy. 

Could an agreed upon color appropriate of the air cleaner be color matched at an automotive paint shop?

Thank you,

Bob Burnopp

 

Yes, but you'll still have to use the  VHT wrinkle to get the desired finish.  As Chip states, if your paint is opaque rather than translucent, the color of the base won't make any difference.  

 

These cars are now 55 years old and as few as there are remaining, not too many folks are going to know what was OE.  However, it's our responsibility to get as close as possible for posterity.   

 

I sincerely doubt if anyone in the AACA has a clue as to what the true color should be.  The average Joe in the ROA probably can get you closer.

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31 minutes ago, RivNut said:

Yes, but you'll still have to use the  VHT wrinkle to get the desired finish.  As Chip states, if your paint is opaque rather than translucent, the color of the base won't make any difference.  

 

These cars are now 55 years old and as few as there are remaining, not too many folks are going to know what was OE.  However, it's our responsibility to get as close as possible for posterity.   

 

I sincerely doubt if anyone in the AACA has a clue as to what the true color should be.  The average Joe in the ROA probably can get you closer.

Ed, I would bet a good auto paint man could paint match the color of the air cleaner  and get the right wrinkle finish. I would add the painter would need an example in hand of the color to be duplicated.

 

i agree, AACA would have no clue what the right color would be for the subject air cleaner. A recognized auto collector group like the ROA could publish and show what the air cleaner color looks like. You may not have a standard, but we would be closer to nailing down the color for the air cleaner Riv collectors are trying to land.

Red Riviera Bob

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1 hour ago, Jim Cannon said:

 

Wrinkle red paint is NOT opaque.  You have to work with it to see what I mean.  The underlying color really influences what the final color looks like.

 

So perhaps instead of . cream base like Buick used, we should use an orange sherbet color.

 

 

Jim, the Chevrolet orange that is used to paint Chevy valve covers looks real close to what I ve seen Ed show. I’m happy to be wrong on the color; however, I am trying to get a one step color application.

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Upon further investigation, it looks like it's possible to get a wrinkle finish with standard spray enamel.  There are lots of "recipes" for doing this (use your google-fu for details), but the gist of it is that it depends on the top and bottom of the paint layer drying at different rates.  Heat seems to be a common ingredient: a heavy coat of paint, then put it in the oven for 20-30 minutes. Some folks call for spraying a layer of thinner (or lacquer), then painting over it; others call for laying down the color coat first, then spraying thinner on top of that.  It's also been suggested that you can use commercially available wrinkle paint (e.g. VHT), then immediately spray it with the color coat. All seem to agree that whatever you do, you don't let the paint dry between coats, and you hit it with the heat while it's still wet.

 

If you don't want to stink up the kitchen (which might seem to be a real risk), you should be able to make an oven of sorts with a cardboard box and a heat lamp or two (think Suzy Homemaker).

 

As a practical matter, a production process would be as simple as they could make it.  Baking the parts in an oven would be bad enough; would they use a two-coat process if they didn't have to?  The key may be that they used a paint which isn't readily available today, as the older wrinkle paints supposedly incorporated tung oil to get the different drying rates across the paint layer.

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The Devil is in the detail:

Outstanding research on the paint topic. RivNut made an observation the finish on the air cleaner was a satin, matte, or flat finish. The finish on my air cleaner had a gloss. I believe the gloss on my air cleaner was the from the VHT Red Wrinkle paint I applied.

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Gents, I saw in the Riview issue dated January/February 2018 Steve Read’s “Gone! But not Forgotten” article. The story and photographs, of course, are top shelf. The color Blue is my favorite color and the automobile made me green with envy.

i partcularly enjoyed viewing the air cleaner color on Steve’s 63. The color of my air cleaner is closer to Steve’s air cleaner lid color than the more orange red I’ve seen.  Additionally, my finish is a gloss as opposed to satin or matte seen on the orange red or cleaners. I’m delighted with either color on the air cleaner. I’ve stripped and painted my air cleaner twice in an effort to get the more orange red color. I’ve not achieved my desired color, but I’m done-stick a fork in me.

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It is true people are finished and chicken gets done?

R3d Riviera Bob

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In the classroom, I always questioned students as to the last time they crossed the "done" line.  Or when they'd respond, "I'm done"  I'd ask them if "I were stick a fork in them would it come out clean."  Total confusion on their part..   

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3 hours ago, RivNut said:

In the classroom, I always questioned students as to the last time they crossed the "done" line.  Or when they'd respond, "I'm done"  I'd ask them if "I were stick a fork in them would it come out clean."  Total confusion on their part..   

I’m certain the students were confused. I’m a student of English grammar and the study is not for the weak willed individual. I had to go to a prep school for my 13th year of high school to raise my SAT scores. All of our instructors were retired Naval Academy or West Point officers. The retired military instructors did a good job teaching what I needed to know to get my boards up and complete college.

i do not believe our newspaper writers of today took any writing classes.

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2 hours ago, Red Riviera Bob said:

I’m certain the students were confused. I’m a student of English grammar and the study is not for the weak willed individual. I had to go to a prep school for my 13th year of high school to raise my SAT scores. All of our instructors were retired Naval Academy or West Point officers. The retired military instructors did a good job teaching what I needed to know to get my boards up and complete college.

i do not believe our newspaper writers of today took any writing classes.

 

Bob,

 

Persistence should be your middle name! Hanging in there for 13 years to get through high school is amazing. Most people would have quit after 5 or 6. How did college go? We Riv owners know that persistence is a good quality to have to get through the twists and turns of Riv ownership. Keep up the good work.

 

Bill

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"Seven years of college down the drain. Might as well join the f***ing Peace Corps."

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Edited by EmTee (see edit history)

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2 hours ago, Riviera63 said:

 

Bob,

 

Persistence should be your middle name! Hanging in there for 13 years to get through high school is amazing. Most people would have quit after 5 or 6. How did college go? We Riv owners know that persistence is a good quality to have to get through the twists and turns of Riv ownership. Keep up the good work.

 

Bill

Bill, I worked my through college working midnight to 8 in a quality control lab. I’d hustle to school and hang as long as I could. Graduated University of Maryland Baltimore County campus with a BA in Economics. The learning experience at Maryland served me well in my 32 year selling career with Pitney Bowes.

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9 hours ago, Red Riviera Bob said:

Bill, I worked my through college working midnight to 8 in a quality control lab. I’d hustle to school and hang as long as I could. Graduated University of Maryland Baltimore County campus with a BA in Economics. The learning experience at Maryland served me well in my 32 year selling career with Pitney Bowes.

UMBC. History making school. First #16 seed to topple a #1 seed.  Congrats, but my bracket was burst along with probably 99.99% of the rest of the public's.   Had to look up UMBC to see what it stood for.  ?

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22 hours ago, Riviera63 said:

 

Bob,

 

Persistence should be your middle name! Hanging in there for 13 years to get through high school is amazing. Most people would have quit after 5 or 6. How did college go? We Riv owners know that persistence is a good quality to have to get through the twists and turns of Riv ownership. Keep up the good work.

 

Bill

Bill, every time I see scratch removal products I wonder if you worked out the scratch in your wife’s car. I remember seeing a demo of how pro’s move the paint from either side of the scratch to fill in the ‘’valley” the scratch created.

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22 hours ago, EmTee said:

"Seven years of college down the drain. Might as well join the f***ing Peace Corps."

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I loved that movie. Seven years down the drain was a great line.

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On 3/26/2018 at 8:16 AM, RivNut said:

UMBC. History making school. First #16 seed to topple a #1 seed.  Congrats, but my bracket was burst along with probably 99.99% of the rest of the public's.   Had to look up UMBC to see what it stood for.  ?

Ed, The Retrievers had a day in the sun with the win over Va. UMBC stands for “ U Made  a Bad Choice or UMust B Crazy. The Retrievers have an internationally recognized winning Chess team.  A number of years ago UMBC was busted for recruiting too many older players for the Chess team. I suppose collegiate Chess teams have recruiting rules to abide by. Go Retrievers!

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9 hours ago, Red Riviera Bob said:

Ed, The Retrievers had a day in the sun with the win over Va. UMBC stands for “ U Made  a Bad Choice or UMust B Crazy. The Retrievers have an internationally recognized winning Chess team.  A number of years ago UMBC was busted for recruiting too many older players for the Chess team. I suppose collegiate Chess teams have recruiting rules to abide by. Go Retrievers!

UMBC - U Must Be Cinderella in the basketball world.

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22 hours ago, RivNut said:

UMBC - U Must Be Cinderella in the basketball world.

 

22 hours ago, RivNut said:

UMBC - U Must Be Cinderella in the basketball world.

Ed, even a blind squirrel can find an acorn.?

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