Dodge 8 Drawings

[Guest]

My Dodge 8 has worn steering. So does the other Dodge 8 in this town and another I know of. The standard joke is that the slop was installed new. Has the Chrysler company kept any old drawings? I am specifically interested in the worm and sector for right hand control Dodge 8 at the moment. There doesn't seem to be a supply so maybe we can make some.

[Guest]

It looks like,from your question, you know a worm from a sector but I'll say it anyway. Don't all steering boxes on Chrysler vehicles have worm and sector mesh play adjustment and steering shaft end play adjustment?

[Guest]

Thanks for your reply. Yes they do. But they wear in the middle half to three quarters turn each way (previous owners have seen a nipple and thought "ahuh, grease nipple" when it wasn't). I understand that when they were made the worm/sector were very slightly tapered so the adjustment was good in straight ahead and less good near full lock, but now ours are (too) sloppy straight ahead and tight near full lock, so we cannot remove the problem. I have rebushed the sector shaft (new box bearings not available, so far) and adjusted everthing, but still have 20 mm of play at straight ahead. Any less, and it binds when turning. Another box we have is worse. Hence we are thinking of making new ones. We could grind the sector, but the curvature and amount to grind will be difficult to determine. And then the bolt holes on the sector housing will need to be elongated...

[Guest]

Be aware that Chrysler used metric parts in their vehicles and the bearings and seals you're looking for may be metric. I had a guy here at the house today that has a '33 Dodge sedan and he was complaining that his source was having trouble converting his bearings and seals over to modern equivalents. I told him that I use SKF metric ,made in Sweden, bearings and seals and they fit perfect. In fact the old bearings say 'made in sweden' on them. (I hadn't noticed.) You may find that you can't find replacements because your source is using the wrong measuring system. By personal experience I have found the transmissions in '33 Dodge,'33 Plymouth and '35 Dodge trucks all to be metric! About the steering box problem. If I'm not wrong the ratio is not the same at the center of the steering as it is at the ends. This makes for slow turning while driving down the road but makes for quick moving of the wheels while trying to park. I think this would make it impossible to fix your problem without building up the worn surface of the worm. As you say if you try to make the mesh distance smaller in the center you only succeed in jamming the gears at the steering extremities. I would think the only way out is to have a machine shop put some metal back on. I wouldn't worry too much about the changes that might come about in the steering afterwards. What's the worst that could happen? You might change the ratio from 4 turns lock to lock to 3.75 or 3.5 turns lock to lock? You're going to use this car maybe 10-15 times each year on sunny days only and how many times are you going to have to parallel park it anyways? The up side is that the play will be gone and that will make it safer to drive at speed. Maybe it would be better to just make it safe and drivable then to try to put it back exactly the way it was. [color:"green"] [color:"green"] [color:"green"] [color:"green"] [color:"green"] [color:"green"] [color:"green"] [color:"green"] [color:"green"]

[Guest]

Thanks for your post.

Re the bearings. I agree that bearings are generally metric, except for specials. I have put new metric bearings in the gearbox and diff. My 1939 Studebaker is the same. Steering box bearings, however, seem to be specials. The shaft is definitely 7/8 inch. They are Timken, stamped MM12 and MM13 on the cone and cup. Timken don't even list them now! SKF are the one outfit I haven't been to here, but the others have emailed and faxed everyone everywhere (that's what they told me anyway) and no luck.

Back to the steering. Building up the worm is problematical. Electroplating (e.g. hard chome) and metal spray just peel off because of the large point load and shear forces involved in those parts' work. It has been tried by others. The other problem is that of metallurgy; the worm is probably a high strength steel and I don't want to hit it with heat without knowing what I am doing to it. It could be disasterous if it broke on the road! Even after building up the worm, what profile do I grind it to? I only have worn ones for samples. Anyway, I suspect the main problem is wear on the sector, which is probably where the difference in radius is. Actually we have thought about grinding the sector and slotting the mounting bolt holes for more adjustment. But again, I only have worn sectors for the profile. My fellow Dodge brother has a machine shop and he is also scratching his head.

Regards

Graham

[Guest]

I found my library has the 1934 Dodge passenger repair manual in it and the book has an extensive write up (with drawings) on adjustment of the steering box. It describes how to add and subtract shims,where the shims are,how to line up the box on the frame using the elongated mounting holes,etc. I also checked the same info on the 1933 to 1936 Plymouth and it seems to be the same. Chrysler used pretty much the same steering box over many years. If you want I can scan the pages and send them to you if you think they'll help? It's all LHD of course.

[Guest]

There are no shims in the adjustment procedure for Dodge Brothers 8 steering. There is a large nut and locking bolt for the end float on the main bearings, there is a bolt and lock nut for the sector shaft end float, and there is a bolt and lock nut for the sector mesh with the worm. For the latter you also have to loosen the nuts holding the sector shaft housing onto the steering box because you move that housing relative to the box in the mesh adjustment.

I have rebushed and readjusted and readjusted and readjusted. I can make turns lock to lock (although I am on the limit of tightness on the extremities) but there is still 20 mm of slop in the steering wheel straight ahead. I have a March 1930 DB8 owner's handbook and an August 1930 one.

The only options we can see are to either grind something(s) or make new one(s). Original drawings will take the guess work out of it.

Anyone have any other ideas? Thanks for your help.