Dodge and Graham Brothers truck data needed

[30DodgePanel]

Continuing to work on DB and GB truck data.

Also needing any commercial car, rail car, buses, exports etc..  please help, and remember, no detail is to small because we never know what the data will reveal.

 

Some of you have already input your truck data over the past 2-4 years and thank you for helping.

For those of us that have not, now is the time to help other truck owners understand the data.

 

Needed:

1.) Frame or Serial number from any pre 1933 trucks of any size or model

2.) Wheelbase

3.) Toe plate or Build card data

4.) Engine #

 

Please reply to me by PM or post your info here on this thread.

 

Thank you for ALL help and ALL input

Regards,
David

Edited September 6, 2017 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[Guest 1927JTJ]

Hi,

Here is the serial number of our, what we think is a 1927 GB truck:  A248188

Engine number JJ987

 

Also attached is a picture.

 

 

[30DodgePanel]

JTJ, thank you for sharing. Please include your first name and last initial so we can keep our records straight. Feel free to PM me your name if your not comfortable sharing it publically we understand.

 

Again, thank you, thank you, thank you and welcome to the forum !

 

Regards
Dave

Edited September 6, 2017 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[30DodgePanel]

JTJ,

 

The wheel base is very important. Could you please provide that when you get a chance ? Thanks again !

Edited September 6, 2017 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[stakeside]

Great idea Dave.

[30DodgePanel]

10 hours ago, stakeside said:

Great idea Dave.

 

Thank you Sherman, and thank you for all your help and input with your frame #'s and data you've sent me.

 

Getting a good response by PM so far. Thank you all who are providing your truck data via PM and/or email.

Keep them coming guys,  we have a long way to go...

[30DodgePanel]

Does anyone have the 135" wb parts list book that you would be willing to share info out of ? Need the cover and the first 3 pages showing publish date and correct insert page dates.

The 135" was often referred to the road builder.

 

Other items needed:

Need the same info from the School Buses, Parlor and Street Car Buses.

Model 880 - 886 for school buses

And:

2 Tons DB 150 & 165" wb

3 Tons DB 135, 165 & 185" wb's

 

 

 

[stakeside]

Here is the  1 1/2 ton book. I found it interesting there is no listing for Stockton plant.

[30DodgePanel]

Ewwww..... great info..  thank you for posting that. Wish we had more input....

[stakeside]

Check this out. I found on e-bay.

Some "D" series GB information.

[Guest 1927JTJ]

Hi Dave,

 

First name is Jay 

Initial of last name is J

 

I'll see if I can track down the wheel base.

 

Thanks

Jay

[Guest 1927JTJ]

Dave,

 

Finally have the WB for our GB truck. 

 

Does 138 inches sound reaonable?

I don't currently have access to the truck, the person that measured it said "138 inches give or take an inch". 

 

Thanks

Jay

[stakeside]

The closet is 137”. Check the frame number to determine which model you have. It should be written on your registration slip or it is stamped on the frame.

Both the IC and the ID models have the 137” wheelbase.

I suspect yours is the IC model since it does not have the raised belt line accents on the cab.

 

 

.

Edited October 13, 2017 by stakeside
Er (see edit history)

[30DodgePanel]

Good info gents.

 

Jay, I doubt it's the OC because that is a dual wheel truck. Notice how this reads in the first two paragraphs and see if you can locate the frame number that should be stamped into the frame.

 

Also, on the second page notice the wording to the right for the tires/wheels next to all the trucks with 137" wb. This should get us closer to finding out what exact model your truck is. For now, lets look at the C series. Not ruling out the ID model but I have a hunch based on the numbers you've provided so far that your truck is a C series truck as Stakeside has pointed out.

 

So your truck is either a CC, IC, MC, ID or MD model. If it's a 1 ton it's either  a IC or ID as the charts show. If 1 1/2 ton then it's one of the other three models mentioned. The serial number from the frame will help pinpoint the year/model even further.

 

Keep us posted what you find out. Very interesting truck

 

 

 

Edited October 14, 2017 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[1917businesscar]

Was wondering if you were going to sell the information you collected on the early Dodge Brothers business cars. Would be very interested, like to know what the earliest frame number you have on the DB business cars are. Have been told mine is not a real business car frame number is to old. Thanks  Jim       jgdb1919@hotmail.com

[30DodgePanel]

Hi Jim,

I don't sell any information I collect, are you looking for literature to purchase ?

 

 

 

 

[1917businesscar]

Hello again, my business car has a true touring frame just one flat  bar on the bottom of the driver side of the frame, no reinforcing that people tell me the business cars frames are to have. No rear fuel tank lower straps fuel tank under seat. My production date is around June 2, 1917 frame number 159389 the title is dated 1917. The 1918 series started July 1, 1917 so I've been told the title should read 1918. Their is no literature that I can find on the early business cars but date of production. I've been told that  dealers made  business cars out of  touring cars, but Gil Belcher said that dealers just bought cabs and sometimes beds customers finished the rest with wood and mine has the c cab sides and original wood top with side screens and curtains that it was a assembly line production. Gil also said that there is a possibly that this was a promotional vehicle to go to events to help sell the new business cars (todays world we truck them) this could explain the 1917 title,  but Dodge was behind on production so this is a far fetched idea. Military truck maybe but original paint is black not green. I was thinking with the information you have received someone has a early business car I could communicate with. Now do you know of literature I could buy not just frame number production I already have that. I know the history to 1922 just wish I knew the first 5 years.         Thank you for your time    Thanks again  Jim

[30DodgePanel]

Have you contacted Doug W ? He goes by nearchoclatetown here on this board. He has a early repair truck from that era, he may be able to assist a bit better than me. Sorry, my study is in the 1928-32 area that has expanded into earlier years but not that far back. I don't have any other early trucks logged in the data besides Dougs WW1 truck and another repair truck. Nothing commercial for that early, yours is the only one that has come forward at this point..... sorry, wish I could help.

I will check through some old rosters to see if I'm missing anything. If I find something you'll be the first to know.

[1917businesscar]

Thank you I will contact Doug. Information on the early business cars just isn't around anymore. Again thank you  Jim  

[nearchoclatetown]

Jim, you will find the more you think you've found out about DBs the more confused you get. 

[30DodgePanel]

On ‎10‎/‎17‎/‎2017 at 6:22 AM, 1917businesscar said:

Hello again, my business car has a true touring frame just one flat  bar on the bottom of the driver side of the frame, no reinforcing that people tell me the business cars frames are to have. No rear fuel tank lower straps fuel tank under seat. My production date is around June 2, 1917 frame number 159389 the title is dated 1917. The 1918 series started July 1, 1917 so I've been told the title should read 1918. Their is no literature that I can find on the early business cars but date of production. I've been told that  dealers made  business cars out of  touring cars, but Gil Belcher said that dealers just bought cabs and sometimes beds customers finished the rest with wood and mine has the c cab sides and original wood top with side screens and curtains that it was a assembly line production. Gil also said that there is a possibly that this was a promotional vehicle to go to events to help sell the new business cars (todays world we truck them) this could explain the 1917 title,  but Dodge was behind on production so this is a far fetched idea. Military truck maybe but original paint is black not green. I was thinking with the information you have received someone has a early business car I could communicate with. Now do you know of literature I could buy not just frame number production I already have that. I know the history to 1922 just wish I knew the first 5 years.         Thank you for your time    Thanks again  Jim

 

Been a while since we touched on this and sorry it took so long Jim but I wanted to give you something I came across from the Standard Catalog of Light Duty Dodge Trucks 1917-2002 by John Gunnell. I had to scan the page in two sections because it came out blurry with the scanner door open. 

 

 

 

[30DodgePanel]

On ‎9‎/‎5‎/‎2017 at 1:52 PM, 1927JTJ said:

Hi,

Here is the serial number of our, what we think is a 1927 GB truck:  A248188

Engine number JJ987

 

Also attached is a picture.

 

 

 

Can you post photos of both sides of your engine please Jay ?

[30DodgePanel]

On 10/13/2017 at 6:18 AM, 1927JTJ said:

Dave,

 

Finally have the WB for our GB truck. 

 

Does 138 inches sound reaonable?

I don't currently have access to the truck, the person that measured it said "138 inches give or take an inch". 

 

Thanks

Jay

 

 

Hi Jay.

 

Did we lose ya ? Would really like to see more of the trucks engine both sides so we can document for it's existence. Please feel free to PM me the information if you would like or I can send you my email or phone # so we can discuss further.

 

To all other DB/GB truck owners:

In a year and a half we've had only two truck owners come forth with information as a direct response to this thread. I'm still hopeful many more will come forward that we currently have not heard from. Those of you who have emailed me or responded to other requests, thank you. 

 

Regards

Dave

Edited May 1, 2019 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[The Sterling Guy]

I just recovered a very rusty DB truck from the weeds. Not quite sure what model it is just yet. I know it is a 2 ton because that plate still exists. Toe plate is long gone and can't for the life of me find a frame number on the 4 described frame locations. I'm thinking it is a 1925 or 1926 because of a couple of observations.   2 ton with original hydraulic dump bed.  WB is 137" Single wheels in rear,  mechanical brakes , 4 cylinder engine with carb on opposite side of manifolds. Separate starter & generator. 3 speed transmission. No air vent door on top of boot cowl. Only engine markings I've found so far is X15 stamped in the  block on the pad above the carb. 

 

Engine surprisingly is free so hope to have it running for an upcoming show in April. Will need to locate some usable demountable rims and 32x6 tires as those are all shot. 

 

Am located in the Baltimore area if anyone has any laying in their parts pile. This truck is too far gone to ever be on the road again, but I'd love to put some usable wheels & tires on it to putter around a show or two .

[ArticiferTom]

Some  pics would be great .

[The Sterling Guy]

Unfortunately, I neglected to take any pics of the extraction from the woods or start of teardown. Here are a couple as it sits. 

[ArticiferTom]

Wow , Nice truck . Looks pretty complete , but a formidable rebuild . The engine may have been change at one time . Other will know what is correct . Best of luck .  And ask away on here for help . The DB and AACA  community are the best .

[stakeside]

Do you have a good set of rims. I found they were very hard to find and had to fabricate mine using Ford AA truck 20” rims.

[The Sterling Guy]

I will need a set of rims and tires good enough to make it roll.  This thing has been sitting for many years along the edge of a friends field covered with vines. Had to pull the head and unstick a few of  the valves & lifters then pull the starter to unfreeze it. It now spins over great with good oil pressure. Dump bed raised right up with the starter cranking the engine. Next is to clean the carburetor and see if it starts. I'm hoping to locate some tires and wheels that are good enough to just fill with foam and hold their shape. This thing is too far gone to restore, but will be fine to ride around the local steam show. 

 

It looks all original. Looking at the charts above i'm guessing it must be a model OC, The OCR is a dual wheel truck so I'm guessing the OC is single wheel. It seems to be the only 2 ton truck with the 4 cylinder and 137" wheelbase.

Edited February 28, 2020 by The Sterling Guy (see edit history)

[carbking]

I don't own one, but perhaps this may help:

 

Graham Brothers Serial Numbers

 

Jon.

[The Sterling Guy]

Some pics of my engine. According to what I read, it could either be a late 'B'  (air cleaner added) or a 'C' model. Any way to tell without pulling the oil pan and counting the crank bearings? And does anyone know what X15 indicates on the Engine Serial # pad with no other numbers stamped?

[30DodgePanel]

Some helpful info. …

The X was indicating what the bore size was. This bulletin is showing the Senior model trucks as X20 but it gives you an example of what the meaning behind the X15 prefix is. I do not have a bulletin with X15 but am currently looking through all my files to see if I can find any matches. 

Regards and welcome to the forums...

Dave

 

 

[30DodgePanel]

You're correct BTW, it is an OC model built between these dates and in these serial number ranges. Not sure if you know but the prefix before the frame number indicates where it was built. OC if single wheel, OCR if dual wheel as you pointed out...

Example

E-Evansville

S-Stockton
D-Detroit

 

 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[30DodgePanel]

For the frame number try looking here:

 

 

Sorry, I haven't studied the pre 1928 trucks all that much...

Will keep looking for more possibilities for the frame location or maybe someone that knows those years better will chime in.

[30DodgePanel]

"IF" your truck was built after July 1st (at any of the plants) it may be considered a 1928 model and therefore your frame # could be listed on the drivers side of the frame.

 

 

**** Keep in mind, a lot of times the frame numbers were very lightly stamped and hard to see. Sometimes a flash light and magnifying glass are the only way to see them.****

 

 

Thanks to Jon for posting this above. It shows that your toeboard plate would have had a stamp after A-694137. Therefore finding the frame number may be the only way to finalize it's identity and/or approximate date of build. 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[The Sterling Guy]

I had seen an ad for an engine that included the X15 info but lost track of it and didn't know what they meant at the time. According to the info shown further up in this thread, they put the 6 cylinder engines in the 1928 2 ton trucks, so it must be a 1926-1927 OC.  The Dodge Brothers cars had the new 'C' 5 main engines in them in 1927. I'm wondering it that applied to the trucks as well?  I've looked closely at  the area of all four front spring hangers as well as the rear step brackets as shown on the Graham brothers info. No number is visible. at any location.  Since I'm not planning on titling or registering the truck, it isn't a big deal. I'm happy to know what it is within a 2 year period.

 

Does anyone know who manufactured the wheel rims? I'd like to know what to ask for when I start looking for some.

 

 

[nearchoclatetown]

As neglected as that looks it looks to be fairly complete and solid. I think that your truck will turn out pretty good. 

[30DodgePanel]

Thought you might enjoy or need something off this:

 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

[30DodgePanel]

1 hour ago, The Sterling Guy said:

I've looked closely at  the area of all four front spring hangers as well as the rear step brackets as shown on the Graham brothers info. No number is visible. at any location.  Since I'm not planning on titling or registering the truck, it isn't a big deal. I'm happy to know what it is within a 2 year period.

 

Sad to see that someone must of ground them off for some reason. Appears to be grind marks on the pad where the engine number should be. What a shame... 

Glad to see you'll be getting it to the point where others will enjoy it someday. Kudos to you 

[The Sterling Guy]

Great stuff, The top picture on the first page is my truck. Not sure if it is the 518 or 519 dump yet but it is exactly as pictured. I unbolted the sides  to clean it up and am missing the tailgate, but thats it! Made by the Wood Hydraulic Hoist Company (Gar Wood)

 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by The Sterling Guy (see edit history)