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AC46 SPARK PLUG ALTERNATIVES


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  • 3 weeks later...

I went back to the parts store today for the R46 plugs

 

I was correct that they were a longer electrode tip as the guy was not giving me R46s I had asked for

 

he was giving me R46S _ _

 

So I asked him for R45 plugs and he had 8 of them in stock and they looked correct

 

so I purchased them instead

 

 

 

PS a quick question

 

the metal gasket was not on the plug and was loose in the box

 

which side of the metal gasket faces the bottom of the plug?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, Dynaflash8 said:

I found the AC-45 was not quite hot enough.  I've been buying 46s off of the Internet up until now.  Recently I tried AC-47 but I'm not that satisfied with them, at least not as yet.  But, the 47 may also be discontinued, I'm not sure.

 

 

 

does anyone else have problems with the r45 plug  not preforming well?

 

should I return them and get the r46 plugs off the web instead?

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2 hours ago, buick special said:

 

 

does anyone else have problems with the r45 plug  not preforming well?

 

should I return them and get the r46 plugs off the web instead?

Very simple: Buy all of the NOS AC-46 spark plugs off the net that you can find and stock them on your shelf to cover the period you expect to keep the car.  They are still out there.  And there are other "off-brand" plug out there NOS that were produced specifically to replace them.  The AC book tells us that lower numbers are cooler plugs.  If a straight 8 plug is too cool it will foul over time.  They did foul over time in my car, and my car is not an oil burner...............but, it's not run everyday.

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Albert Champion came to the USA in the 1890's as a motorcycle racer.  there was no supply of plugs for his European cycle, so he began to make his own plugs. other people wanted his plugs so he began selling Champion spark plugs.  When he decided to return to Europe, he sold his Champion business ,  included the name.

 

Durant did not like buying components from competitors.  He  hired Albert Champion to start a business of producing spark plugs.   The name Champion could not be used in the new business so it was  Called AC.  Durant eventually bought out Albert's interest in the business.  Durant also bought Delco (Detroit electric Company) and eventually merged the two  ignition businesses.  So Albert Champion started up two of the big 3 plug  companies in the USA.

 

Bob Engle

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3 hours ago, buick special said:

 

 

does anyone else have problems with the r45 plug  not preforming well?

 

should I return them and get the r46 plugs off the web instead?

They work wonderfully in my 1937 Century. I have no idea why Earl has problems with them in his 1939 Buick, but they work good in my car. If they gave lots of people trouble, I doubt Bob's would be selling them. I have not heard anybody else complaining about them. 

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The need for 45 or 46 spark plugs depend on the overall condition of your engine.  If the engine is "new" and tight and does not burn any oil, the 45 heat range plugs should work fine. (provided the carb is set up properly and not rich). 

 

If the engine is getting tired and burning / using oil then the 46 plugs would be needed.  If it is really bad for oil consumption then might need to go to 47's.

 

Going to a higher heat range was the fix in "the old days" to keep a tired engine on the road.   That was when a ring and valve job was needed every 50,000 miles +-.

 

Sometimes a hotter heat range plug was put into a single cylinder if it was fouling out the spark plug.  Not an unusual temporary fix for an engine that needed more extensive work but the owner did not want or had the ability to spend the money for the fix.

Edited by Larry Schramm (see edit history)
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On 8/26/2017 at 8:35 AM, Larry Schramm said:

The need for 45 or 46 spark plugs depend on the overall condition of your engine.  If the engine is "new" and tight and does not burn any oil, the 45 heat range plugs should work fine. (provided the carb is set up properly and not rich). 

 

If the engine is getting tired and burning / using oil then the 46 plugs would be needed.  If it is really bad for oil consumption then might need to go to 47's.

 

Going to a higher heat range was the fix in "the old days" to keep a tired engine on the road.   That was when a ring and valve job was needed every 50,000 miles +-.

 

Sometimes a hotter heat range plug was put into a single cylinder if it was fouling out the spark plug.  Not an unusual temporary fix for an engine that needed more extensive work but the owner did not want or had the ability to spend the money for the fix.

     My car doesn't burn oil and the engine has been totally rebuilt.  For awhile, because of lack of use, I think I had one or more stuck rings.  I was advised to use some Rislone and I did.  The car no longer had the stuck rings.  I will say, it was during that period of time that I had a AC-45 plug or two foul and I stopped using them.  The car calls for AC-46 so as long as I can find them, I'm going to use them and then I'll do something different. 

     The car runs great on AC-47, but it doesn't want to start hot until it cools, like vapor lock.  So, it's possible the 47's are too hot.  But, I think its the electronic ignition.  The deal is, I've had one problem or another ever since I installed an electronic ignition kit and one of their coils.... not one single day or time has there not been some sort of problem.  I may be timing, but when I get back home in Florida I'm going to install a completely rebuilt distributor I have (purchased from Doug Seybold) and go back to points and condenser and AC-46 plugs.  A guy told me he used AC-47 with that kit and it was wonderful.  Well, the car ran perfect with the old points & condenser for years and I'm going back to it.  It has never run right with the electronic ignition kit.....not for one day or time.  I solved the ignition breaking down problem only to acquire hard starting when hot.  I only ever installed that kit because I couldn't find a mechanic on a trip who knew how to install points & condenser...I decided to learn how myself, but took the easier way out with the electronic ignition kit.  Easy is never the best way to go on anything I've found in my 79 years.

Edited by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)
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4 hours ago, Dynaflash8 said:

 I think its the electronic ignition.  The deal is, I've had one problem or another ever since I installed an electronic ignition kit and one of their coils.... not one single day or time has there not been some sort of problem.  I may be timing, but when I get back home in Florida I'm going to install a completely rebuilt distributor I have (purchased from Doug Seybold) and go back to points and condenser and AC-46 plugs.  A guy told me he used AC-47 with that kit and it was wonderful.  Well, the car ran perfect with the old points & condenser for years and I'm going back to it.  It has never run right with the electronic ignition kit.....not for one day or time.  I solved the ignition breaking down problem only to acquire hard starting when hot.  I only ever installed that kit because I couldn't find a mechanic on a trip who knew how to install points & condenser...I decided to learn how myself, but took the easier way out with the electronic ignition kit.  Easy is never the best way to go on anything I've found in my 79 years.

 

I understand the electronic ignition, but I do not get the retrofitting of the old cars.  They ran great when properly maintained and with good parts not worn out things like distributor bushings, old wires, wrong plugs, bad points, etc.....

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2 hours ago, Larry Schramm said:

 

I understand the electronic ignition, but I do not get the retrofitting of the old cars.  They ran great when properly maintained and with good parts not worn out things like distributor bushings, old wires, wrong plugs, bad points, etc.....

Larry, it all went back to problems I had on an AACA Founders Tour with my 1971 Riviera.  I couldn't get any condenser that didn't go out in short order.  And then, I couldn't find any mechanic who knew what a Dwell Meter was, had one, or had ever installed points and condenser.....even in Breezwood, PA at the largest garage there.  Somebody told me about the electronic ignition and how great it was, so I had one installed in the Riviera.  It's run great ever since.  So, I decided to do the same thing to the two '39 Buicks and and never worry again about points and condenser.  I only did one (in my picture) and it's never run right since.  But, I'm not home now until after Hershey, so I can't put it back until then.  AC46 all the way.  I will also have to learn how to put in points and condenser myself this winter.  I just kind of didn't want to learn it.....stupid yes.....but, I'm the kind of guy who still prefers a flip cell phone. :)

 

Edited by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)
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If you like a flip phone, you will love points & condensers.

 

I just saw a dwell meter, timing light and something else at a flea market this weekend $20.00 for all.  Did not buy it as I already have a oscilloscope and extra dwell meter. 

 

Trying to keep the amount of stuff that I have at bay or even get rid of some of it.

 

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2 hours ago, Dynaflash8 said:

Larry, it all went back to problems I had on an AACA Founders Tour with my 1971 Riviera.  I couldn't get any condenser that didn't go out in short order.  And then, I couldn't find any mechanic who knew what a Dwell Meter was, had one, or had ever installed points and condenser.....even in Breezwood, PA at the largest garage there.  Somebody told me about the electronic ignition and how great it was, so I had one installed in the Riviera.  It's run great ever since.  So, I decided to do the same thing to the two '39 Buicks and and never worry again about points and condenser.  I only did one (in my picture) and it's never run right since.  But, I'm not home now until after Hershey, so I can't put it back until then.  AC46 all the way.  I will also have to learn how to put in points and condenser myself this winter.  I just kind of didn't want to learn it.....stupid yes.....but, I'm the kind of guy who still prefers a flip cell phone. :)

 

Earl,

 

You need to buy an engine analyzer. Something like this would make adjusting the points easier... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sears-Craftsman-Engine-Analyzer-Model-161-2161-in-Box-with-Manual-/112534937399?hash=item1a339adf37:g:b7YAAOSwJclZmvAN

 

Or you could bring your car to me and I will help you, but I think it would be a bit cheaper to buy your own meter...

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2 hours ago, FLYER15015 said:

Oh, and if you ever need to put your Generator on a "growler" I know where to send you.

 

I did find a set of 6 AC-46's on evilbay for only $69.00

 

Mike in Colorado

There is a generator/starter/alternator shop outside of Sebring, FL that has a growler.  He also has tons of obsolete parts on shelves for old genertors and starters.  One thing he has few of and are hard to find are generator field coils.  Won't you need 8 AC-46's to make a set?

 

Edited by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)
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Yup, you do need 8 for a Buick, but 6 will do for a Chevy or a Plymouth of that era.

 

Heck there is even a guy on evilbay that is selling ONE AC-46 plug for $2.50

 

Now if we could only find #8, we'd be all set.

 

It's the thrill of the hunt, right up until you really need the part. Then it's a pain............

 

Mike in Colorado

Edited by FLYER15015 (see edit history)
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If you want to get a cheap backup to the standard tune-up set capacitor (condenser), go to www.tubesandmore.com and order a few 0.22 uF 630V polypropylene caps. Part number C-LD22-630. Less than a buck each. Nonpolarized so it doesn't matter which way you put it in. Will work fine to get you home...

 

Cheers, Dave

Edited by Daves1940Buick56S (see edit history)
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  • 1 year later...
On ‎8‎/‎26‎/‎2017 at 7:55 AM, Bob Engle said:

Durant also bought Delco (Detroit electric Company) and eventually merged the two  

 

Bob Engle

 

Dayton. But you knew that.

 

Sorry to mention Dayton so soon after the recent news. But yeah, Dayton Electric Company = Delco.

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On ‎8‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 1:45 PM, buick special said:

 

 

PS a quick question

 

the metal gasket was not on the plug and was loose in the box

 

which side of the metal gasket faces the bottom of the plug?

 

Big side of the gasket goes on first. 

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8 minutes ago, Spinneyhill said:

Um, this topic is 2 years old? @buick special hasn't been since Jan 2018.

 

True, true, but now some one looking for all this good information may read all the above, and we may have solved a problem that no longer exists.

 

Ain't the web great ?

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