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American Rolls Royce (Ghost, PI & PII)


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Sadly, unless your intimately involved in the auction world, it’s hard to understand the game. If you had asked me, I would have never let you send your car to that sale............Venue, car, and economic reality come into play.......your car should have used a high end broker to sell it. Better control, less expense, and a much better outcome. 

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Peter.......it’s not your fault......I have seen how the auctions operate;  promise you everything, but in reality it’s double talk......and you end up with lots of additional expense, and poor results. Good Rolls Royce cars need people to represent them.....who understand them, and live for the brand. 

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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On 9/7/2020 at 4:09 PM, edinmass said:

Peter.......it’s not your fault......I have seen how the auctions operate;  promise you everything, but in reality it’s double talk......and you end up with lots of additional expense, and poor results. Good Rolls Royce cars need people to represent them.....who understand them, and live for the brand. 

Agreed.  I actually like the auction venue(s), but each sale and each company tends to have their "cup of tea" and Shawn screams at my right and left that it is just easier to not do the strategy and avoid, so when we put a car out for auction (which is rare), there are some serious discussions that go along with how it is to be handled.   Also, it turns out that a lot of people prefer not to bid at auction - they would rather deal with a car on their own terms via a dealer or ....  - You see a couple key dealers do very well picking cars up at auction and then reselling. 

 

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On 9/7/2020 at 3:13 PM, Peter Zobian said:

The Venue was awful, totally wrong for the car, and I was too stupid!

 

Too soon we get old, too late we get smart!

Actually, you did fine and no need to beat yourself up over it.  An auction is about as calculated a formula as they come.   Also, very few RR cars have done well value wise and for several years now.  The RR that was run through the Worldwide sale over the weekend also had an incredible amount of money dumped into it and stands a chance of being a looser for the owner in value not exceeding restoration costs.  Also, to get the "extra" you would have had considerable restoration work/pick-me-up-work to do-redo - that puts things more into a risky class as to ROI too.  

 

Back in maybe 2000, I was offered a RR Riviera Town Car for 50K firm and I passed - it traded hands 4 more times in the next 8 months and the last sale was like 220K (everyone owning did nothing to the car - not even wash it).   About the same time I passed on a 1955 Aston Martin 2/4 Coupe that was as nice original on the globe as they come, though leaked out its weep holes when running - 20K then and today ....  All lead to an Auburn - I am very happy with the choice/path.  

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  • 4 weeks later...
1 hour ago, alsancle said:

Back in this thread there was an unrestored PII LHD town car for 100K plus.   This car is  75K more (185K)  but you save 500k on the restoration.

 

https://lbilimited.com/offerings/1931-rolls-royce-phantom-ii-springfield-st-martin-by-brewster/

 

image.thumb.png.507ed403c0dbe4d52ba69ca786568f5a.png

This is basically a "Dover" style, but it a Town Car called a "Saint Martin" or "St. Martin" - it is basically the same body style (excepting town car feature) in sheet metal/aluminum that was on my RR PI (nice body style too). 

 

And AJS Series is nice as it is LHD and ....

 

Sidenote:  My guess is they are loosing money on this at 185K - very few RR cars ever reach this level of restoration.

 

The only fault I really saw is the rear seat clock is missing - hard to find as it is a Brewster/Tiffany part.  

 

And the original trunk probably was separated from the car as they tend to take up the whole depth of the luggage rack and this one leaves 6+ inches of the luggage rack unused space between body.   My car had a set of "quick disconnect" brackets that went on the underside of trunk, leveled everything, and then could be stored in the tool box when not in use (solved the problem of trunk rack being two different heights). 

 

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)
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48 minutes ago, John_Mereness said:

This is basically a "Dover" style, but it a Town Car called a "Saint Martin" or "St. Martin" - it is basically the same body style (excepting town car feature) in sheet metal/aluminum that was on my RR PI (nice body style too). 

 

And AJS Series is nice as it is LHD and ....

 

Sidenote:  My guess is they are loosing money on this at 185K - very few RR cars ever reach this level of restoration.

 

The only fault I really saw is the rear seat clock is missing - hard to find as it is a Brewster/Tiffany part.  

 

And the original trunk probably was separated from the car as they tend to take up the whole depth of the luggage rack and this one leaves 6+ inches of the luggage rack unused space between body.   My car had a set of "quick disconnect" brackets that went on the underside of trunk, leveled everything, and then could be stored in the tool box when not in use (solved the problem of trunk rack being two different heights). 

 

 

I'm still waiting for Ed's compare/contrast on driving a PI vs PII.

 

That car is begging for more integrated sloped trunk.

 

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1 minute ago, alsancle said:

 

I'm still waiting for Ed's compare/contrast on driving a PI vs PII.

 

That car is begging for more integrated sloped trunk.

 

They made the body style with a very close coupled trunk.  The problem with the trunk rack is that it is two different heights and if you did not know that there were adapter brackets (via their being missing) you would wonder what they were trying to do.   The one thing I did not like about my car was how far the trunk sat away from the body.  

 

29572882_10156454165462189_2440925655986479070_n.thumb.jpg.3d781dd1c7e394f5342724a35d7a931a.jpg

 

571216414_unnamed(1).jpg.5535be2bf3f697c89ad7baf7accce799.jpg

 

 

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1 hour ago, alsancle said:

Tires look a bit undersized also.

I had 7:00 x 20's and the Denman's were a larger tire than the Lester's it had in the sidmounts when I bought the car and had they been another 1/8 larger in height I would have had to elongate the mounting hole in the sidemount brackets to accommodate. 

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7 hours ago, alsancle said:

Back in this thread there was an unrestored PII LHD town car for 100K plus.   This car is  75K more (185K)  but you save 500k on the restoration.

 

https://lbilimited.com/offerings/1931-rolls-royce-phantom-ii-springfield-st-martin-by-brewster/

 

image.thumb.png.507ed403c0dbe4d52ba69ca786568f5a.png


 

You save 500k on the restoration????? You mean your only doing a half assed job and not doing the engine? 500k on a PII doesn’t go far...........trust me......not very far at all.

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On 10/5/2020 at 6:14 PM, edinmass said:


 

You save 500k on the restoration????? You mean your only doing a half assed job and not doing the engine? 500k on a PII doesn’t go far...........trust me......not very far at all.

A reproduction aluminum Cylinder head is going to cost over 20K by the time it hits your doorstep, ....  There are a whole bunch of people that have bright ideas of how to work around the issue too - problem is the ideas tend to in reality be pretty dimly lit. 

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