Mammy

Help Please! How to get title for '65 Chevy?

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Key is to have someone check by the VIN if the car has been reported stolen or has a lien against it. If so the car may be seized.

 

Living in Florida I would not consider a car without a clean Florida title (and can check the DMV on the web for the title here).

Edited by padgett (see edit history)
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53 minutes ago, ArticiferTom said:

In Pa you can do a mechanic's type lien and claim title . Just is a lot of trouble to get title . You have to be a business in Pa to do .

As crazy as it sounds a " mechanic's lien" does not apply to cars or work performed on cars in Pennsylvania. A builder can get a machanic's lien, an auto repair shop cannot. The law is seldom like folks think it is.

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1 hour ago, Mammy said:

Thank you, Cheezestaak.  I don't even know if my son HAS a bill of sale. :unsure:

 

And Terry:  YES! Good idea!

 I do have a family connection to a police office.  I think he would be willing to look up the VIN.

 

Your first move, if you can make it happen legally, is to run the VIN to see of it's reported stolen.  You may not be able to find someone to do this.  It's a gray area.

 

Then if that can be done and it's not stolen, proceed with the Vermont deal, or do your own deal.   Let's say your brother lived in a non-title State.  You sell him the car, he spends X$ to get it registered/insured/taxes paid, legally, then sells it back as a currently registered legal car.  Look up NJ Statutes first.  In my state, we don't need titles on older cars.  If you buy a titled car from another State and bring that title to CT-DMV to get plates...they confiscate/destroy that title and you cannot ever get a replacement title from CT-DMV.

 

I said check NJ Statutes first.:  Here in CT, IF I buy a non-stolen, non titled, non currently registered car:  To get plates and be legal, I need a genuine honest bill of sale, not faked.  Then I fill out the special form and you write your story on "why" there is no current registration, and/or why there is no title, if it came from a titled state.   They look it over, then run the VIN, and issue plates.  Most States honor a non-titled car IF it came from a non-title State, BUT having current registration in the sellers name is mandatory, and the Reg paper must be the original, and not a copy.

47 minutes ago, 60FlatTop said:

Everything can be fixed.

Yes, Don't panic.  Take time to do this the correct way without lying.   The Vermont thing, and out of State "sell to brother" is legal.  It would not be legal if the car was stolen, or if you are not sure if the seller really owned it, or if VIN plates are switched or whatever.

 

Just me, but I would never buy a old Ebay registration paper or title, that went to another car.  That IS illegal

 

.

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Title situations are nasty but do vary by state.   Not that it helps in this situation but if it were Mass you would be 100% out of luck.   Does Broadway in Alabama still do business?

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17 minutes ago, F&J said:

 

Your first move, if you can make it happen legally, is to run the VIN to see of it's reported stolen.  You may not be able to find someone to do this.  It's a gray area.

 

Then if that can be done and it's not stolen, proceed with the Vermont deal, or do your own deal.   Let's say your brother lived in a non-title State.  You sell him the car, he spends X$ to get it registered/insured/taxes paid, legally, then sells it back as a currently registered legal car.  Look up NJ Statutes first.  In my state, we don't need titles on older cars.  If you buy a titled car from another State and bring that title to CT-DMV to get plates...they confiscate/destroy that title and you cannot ever get a replacement title from CT-DMV.

 

I said check NJ Statutes first.:  Here in CT, IF I buy a non-stolen, non titled, non currently registered car:  To get plates and be legal, I need a genuine honest bill of sale, not faked.  Then I fill out the special form and you write your story on "why" there is no current registration, and/or why there is no title, if it came from a titled state.   They look it over, then run the VIN, and issue plates.  Most States honor a non-titled car IF it came from a non-title State, BUT having current registration in the sellers name is mandatory, and the Reg paper must be the original, and not a copy.

Yes, Don't panic.  Take time to do this the correct way without lying.   The Vermont thing, and out of State "sell to brother" is legal.  It would not be legal if the car was stolen, or if you are not sure if the seller really owned it, or if VIN plates are switched or whatever.

 

Just me, but I would never buy a old Ebay registration paper or title, that went to another car.  That IS illegal

 

.

Not illegal to buy a title or registration paper but it is illegal to use it to register a car fraudulently.

 

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19 minutes ago, alsancle said:

  Does Broadway in Alabama still do business?

 

Can we trust some info posted on the net from car guys?  

 

Somewhere in the last couple of years, I read more than one person say that "some select few" States are roadblocking any Alabama title fixes. as well as "looking out for" New York State "very ancient registration cards".  I have no idea if this is true in all cases.

 

Both of these tactics were used for a long time,  The older NY cards had a blank ! "I hereby sell this car to.....;" on the back.  That seemed risky to me, as the car owner back then, received a new one each year, it was said.  So, you could have several people trying to use the same VIN identification on several yearly cards at the same time, if someone found a stack of these in Grandpaw's files, and sold them one at a time online.

 

.

 

 

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Broadway is still in business as I looked into them as a possible solution to my title issue, but I decided not to go with them.  Their own website has the disclaimer that they are no longer able to do titles for Alaska, Alabama, Georgia, Hawaii, Idaho, North Carolina, and Wisconsin.  Implies to me that some states think there's something fishy, and I also noticed that their website now lists them as having a Maine address.  In any case, their fee was in the neighborhood of $1000, which I thought was just obscene.

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If you want to drop me a line- I will help you and it wont cost much at all....................

 

rdz69@aol.com

 

Im in NJ

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There are a couple of guys on this site that sell titles ( historical documents) . 

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6 hours ago, Mammy said:

Hello,

 

 My son bought a '65 Chevy from a guy in PA with the "promise" of a title, but it's been a year and no title has been produced.

 

 Meantime, the car is in my garage in NJ and my son has been working on it.      (We live on the Jersey side of Delaware Water Gap, my son lives on the Pennsylvania side.)

 

The guy he bought the car from has practically fallen off the face of the earth.  I would like the car out of my garage and my son would like to put the car on the road.  But how and where/which state to get a title has been the dilemma.

 

Is anyone here familiar with the procedures one would have to go through to get a title in either PA or NJ?   (We could go with whichever state is easier.)

 

Thank you very much in advance for your feedback.

 

Regards,

M.A.M.

You have not said how old your son is, you have not said why you did not assist your son, when he was making the purchase.

Bottom line is this ..... at the time of purchase, the first thing that should have been done was to compare the VIN on the title, to the VIN on the car.

If the numbers don't match (title to vehicle), you walk away from the deal.

If there is no title, you walk away from the deal.

Some of the replies here have "some" merit, but you better clearly understand that screwing around with titles is a felony offense.

Your son has not only paid for a car he cannot prove to be his own, he's also invested bucks into the car, after the purchase, as you observed.

If you run the VIN, through your cop buddy ....... and the car turns out to be stolen, your legal complications and fees have just begun.

There's much more on the table here, than getting your parking place back.

Edited by bobg1951chevy (see edit history)
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Heads up.  If you go through Vermont, and then try to title in PA, they will check and see if that VIN has ever been registered in PA.  They will not issue another title.  

Matt

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This may seem odd to some of you but I would suggest you simply go to your New Jersey DMV and tell them the truth about what happened. They would be the best people to tell you what you can legally do to resolve the issue. Honesty really is the best policy. When you attempt to figure out a way to work around the law, it usually does not work out well. Worst case scenario, you may find that the person who sold the car did not legally own it and he might lose the car, or your son might have to report to the police that he was the victim of fraud. Either of those are better than getting arrested for possession of a stolen vehicle (which is a very remote possibility).   

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5 minutes ago, MCHinson said:

This may seem odd to some of you but I would suggest you simply go to your New Jersey DMV and tell them the truth about what happened.

Yes, Odd..

 

I'm not being sarcastic, but that sounds like a Shirley Temple movie plot....  In her voice: " Sirs, Mr. Inspector man,  I know you require a Bill of Sale and a Title, but I don't have either...what shall I do? "   :)

 

What's the point of going there in person, wait an hour+, and be so unprepared?  At that point, standing there, you have nothing to show for ownership at all.  They cannot divulge any info to an unrelated person, (which is the person with no proof of ownership).

 

State Statutes are printed and available to the public online and at libraries, so that the public can be prepared, or at least know what the mandatory items are.     Any official or law enforcement person will tell you that "ignorance of any State Statute or Law, is not a defense, nor an excuse"

 

.

 

 

 

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Each state has different statutes and different policies. As a retired Police Lieutenant, I will simply say that walking up to a human being and saying, I did something stupid, is there any way to fix this, usually works better than any other approach. If you have a bill of sale and you know the serial number of the vehicle, you can probably at least find out if it has been reported as stolen. You can probably also find out if there is a way to obtain a title through some of more unusual but legal ways to do so. Some states require you to post a bond to get a title. Some require an application to the courts. I have no idea what NJ law allows, but I know that the DMV personnel there are the best source of information about what will work in that jurisdiction.  

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23 minutes ago, MCHinson said:

Each state has different statutes and different policies. As a retired Police Lieutenant, I will simply say that walking up to a human being and saying, I did something stupid, is there any way to fix this, usually works better than any other approach. If you have a bill of sale and you know the serial number of the vehicle, you can probably at least find out if it has been reported as stolen. You can probably also find out if there is a way to obtain a title through some of more unusual but legal ways to do so. Some states require you to post a bond to get a title. Some require an application to the courts. I have no idea what NJ law allows, but I know that the DMV personnel there are the best source of information about what will work in that jurisdiction.  

 

This is actually excellent advice. I was in a similar situation not long ago with a project car that I bought on a Bill of Sale. The car had been derelict since the '50's. It is pointless to recount the process I went through, because each state IS different. However, you might explore the following: The DMV's have agents who investigate chop shops, inspect vehicles with VIN issues, etc. The DMV is not going to give out their phone numbers, but it is possible to find out who the agent is in your area by talking with some of the smaller car dealers and body shops in your area. One of them will know how to contact him.  Find him. Be courteous and truthful, and as Matt said, ask him "is there any way to fix this?" It is tempting to try some "scheme." Please don't. There is a national system in place now ( I forget the acronym) whereby the various state DMV's are "tied together" much more than in even the recent past. This is why the "title service" businesses have mostly disappeared. You can easily put yourself in a situation where not having a title is the least of your worries. Good luck.

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1 hour ago, jackofalltrades70 said:

Heads up.  If you go through Vermont, and then try to title in PA, they will check and see if that VIN has ever been registered in PA.  They will not issue another title.  

Matt

So, nobody from Vermont can move to Pennsylvania and bring their vehicles with them????

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The very best advice that has been given in regard to this situation has been by Matt Hinson.  I cannot and will not feel sorry for anyone who will hand over money for a vehicle and not get a legal title or a legal bill of sale at the time they load the vehicle on a trailer or drive away in it.  I simply cannot understand a parent knowingly let their kid get involved in some sort of three-legged deal like this.  If the vehicle in question is stolen, this guy could be on a one way trip to the penitentiary by trying to get a fraudulent title and/or registration by the means that have been discussed here.  I have been playing with cars and motorcycles for 55 years now and I have hauled vehicles from VERMONT and as far as the Canadian border and I ALWAYS had a signed title or legal bill of sale whenever I crossed a state line.  It's just the easiest and right thing to do.  I was headed home from about 10 miles from the Canadian border in Minnesota with a rolling chassis for a 1916 Buick.  I was about 25 miles into Iowa when an Iowa Highway Patrolman pulled me over.  The remains of the car on the trailer looked like the Beverly Hillbillies truck.  The officer walked up to my truck and before he could even say anything I handed him my driver's license, my insurance information, and the bill of sale for the old Buick.  He laughed and told me that he had already checked me out from my trailer tag.  He said he just wanted to know what year the old Buick was.  If I had not had that bill of sale, I would not have been able to show proof of ownership and things could have gone bad right quick like.  I had two more state lines to cross.  I am not trying to be a smart ass here, but, what some of you guys are talking about doing on here is on the criminal side of the law.  All I will say is I hope that works out for ya.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

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2 hours ago, MCHinson said:

Each state has different statutes and different policies. As a retired Police Lieutenant, I will simply say that walking up to a human being and saying, I did something stupid, is there any way to fix this, usually works better than any other approach. If you have a bill of sale and you know the serial number of the vehicle, you can probably at least find out if it has been reported as stolen. You can probably also find out if there is a way to obtain a title through some of more unusual but legal ways to do so. Some states require you to post a bond to get a title. Some require an application to the courts. I have no idea what NJ law allows, but I know that the DMV personnel there are the best source of information about what will work in that jurisdiction.  

I don't understand how your advice could work here.

This transaction occurred one year ago.

The son does not have a title, the father does not believe the son ever received a bill of sale.

With those 2 strikes, I would not walk into any DMV, and expect to walk out with a title.

 

FYI, on a personal note Mr Hinson, if you truly believe that the DMV is the best source of information, I would ask you to review my 3 month case from Hell, with the NC DMV, as I had posted here, on AACA.

My '51 Chevy car was legal, my serial number was legal, my serial number tag was properly affixed and legal, yet the NC DMV continued to harass me with 3 home visits,  by the NC License and Theft Bureau Inspector, stating my serial number tag should have looked like a Chevy pick up serial number tag. They even threatened to revoke my title, which was already issued by the NC DMV.

It took folks from AACA, who sent pics of their 1951 Chevy  serial number tags to me ..... which I forwarded to Raleigh, NC.,  to get the harassment to cease.

So, in my case, the NC DMV was NOT the best source of information.

 

 

 

Edited by bobg1951chevy
rewrite (see edit history)

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Bob,

 

As you learned, DMV will not always be your friend. You ran into a weird situation, but in the end, with the evidence of an error, you got DMV to correct their error. Your story actually sort of illustrates my point. You went through a lot of difficulties because NC DMV incorrectly thought you were trying to perpetrate a fraud. If they try to do anything dishonest in an attempt to get a title they will likely have as much or more trouble than you had.

 

In this case, a car that may or may not be stolen is trying to be registered. If someone attempts to register it by less than truthful means, and it turns out that the car has ever been reported as stolen, the person trying to register it will likely go to jail. A person who walks in with their information and truthfully says I bought this and the guy I bought it from won't deliver the title, will not go to jail even if the car has been stolen previously. It is the safest and cheapest way to deal with all of the possibilities in this particular case.

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The best part about being honest is that you don't have to try to "remember the truth". Nothing raises suspicion more than a change in story. I spent almost 20 years working for the government and believe me - the truth is constant, a lie takes twists and turns.  

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Write to Broadway Title  NLAIII@aol.com or call them at 800-464-3222.  If they are still in business, they may be able to help.  They are familiar with all states rules.  Alabama was/is not a Title state and you sell them the car on paper and they register it in Alabama ans send you the tag and registration to apply for a new title in your state.  It may help to talk to them.

3501 4 Ave, South  Birmingham AL 35222 was he last  address I have for them.

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11 hours ago, CarlLaFong said:

So, nobody from Vermont can move to Pennsylvania and bring their vehicles with them????

 

John, the days where someone (maybe  not even a Vermont resident) could obtain Vermont tags and a registration card for an older vehicle and TURN THAT CARD INTO A TITLE from another state (or into even a Vermont title) are over.  I have attached a link to the applicable page from the NEW Vermont DMV web page. Vermont will now issue titles to vehicles older than 25 years old on request. In the case of the post mentioning PA, because of the new nationwide system I previously mentioned, PA ( and every other state for that matter) knows that a bonafide Vermont owner should have no problem producing a Vermont title to present to PA. If  you read the DMV page, it is obvious that there are a number of reasons why the OP will not be able to obtain a Vermont title. They include 1) Being a Vermont resident. 2) ON SITE ( I hear Vermont is cold this time of year)  VIN verification - meaning it will be run through the national system to see if it is stolen, has liens, or someone else is shown as the owner. Several other stipulations.

http://dmv.vermont.gov/tax-title/vehicle-title/exempt-title      I'm not sure why, but your Avatar never fails to crack me up. :D

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I can tell you all that the Ohio DMV would NOT be the place to start. I have years of experience with this. 

 

For SURE, the best place to start is finding out if the car is stolen, OR, if their are any un-cancelled liens against it. Sometimes people sell cars that they still owe money on, or which they were supposed to surrender in a divorce case, or that they may have paid off a loan for, but never got the lien-cancellation recorded. 

 

If you use some of the back-alley methods to get a title for a car with no skeletons in its closet, all is well. And you won't go to jail even if the car is stolen, if you are the one who reported it and asked for it to be investigated. BUT, if you successfully obtain a "legal" title through one of those loopholes and then it later turns up to be stolen or encumbered by a loan and/or lien, you will be guilty of fraud...and probably interstate fraud. 

 

I would hesitate to obtain a title through the process of "selling" my car to an out-of-state buyer, who then sells it back to me with a legit title from his state IF I were absolutely certain that the car was legally and clearly owned by the seller, But only if I were ABSOLUTELY certain. 

 

Anything else is just a parts car, and even then I wouldn't buy it or possess it without a legitimate notarized bill of sale, signed by the person I gave payment to. 

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On ‎1‎/‎16‎/‎2017 at 4:46 PM, superior1980 said:

I am no expert on this subject, but I am currently dealing with my own title situation and can tell you what I've done.  In my case, I bought a car in November where the out of state owner mailed me the title and bill of sale.  What he didn't tell me was that the title was still in the name of the person that he had bought the car from, he signed the back as the new owner, but never put it through for transferring into his name.  The result was there was no place for me to sign the title and my state wouldn't recognize it.  An internet search brought this company to my attention http://www.titlerecovery.com/index.html .  I decided to give it a shot and just this morning in my email inbox, I received notice that my application was approved and my registration and license plates were on their way to me.  In my case, the company charged me $158 for their services, and my registration and plates are coming from Vermont.  I do not live in Vermont, but checking the Vermont DMV website, Vermont doesn't require you to be a resident or have a Vermont drivers license in order to register a car there.  They are also a no title state for cars over 15 years old; your registration is your proof of ownership.  Vermont did charge me $510 in sales tax, but of course that amount is based on either what you paid for the car, or what the current NADA value is, whichever is higher.  I figure I'll keep the car registered in Vermont until the registration gets close to expiring, then as the now-recognized owner of the car, transfer it into my home state.  I think what saved me was at least having a bill of sale, but even if you don't have that, you may want to at least contact them and see what they have to say.  For me, the process lasted about two months and took place entirely via online, the telephone, and the US mail.

You might want to see my previous post and link. A registration card and plates is a long ways from a title ( even a Vermont title) now. In your own words " .....be a resident or have a Vermont drivers license in order to REGISTER a car there." You can drive the car ( unless you drive it so much that the local cops question the out of state tags or you get stopped for something else and you have a local address. Most states give you 30 days to get their tags)  but will need a title to sell it and won't be able to get even a Vermont title, because when they run the VIN the owner before the guy you bought it from is going to come back as the owner. You are not the "now recognized owner" even in Vermont. ( see link for other requirements) He is "letting" you register/drive his car and you are out $668. Vermont collects revenue with this registration scheme, as does title recovery . Again, the problem is that the loophole has been closed for turning that Vermont registration card directly into a title.  Good luck though.

Edited by Guest (see edit history)

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