PWB

Riviera factory anomalies

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Paul,

Don't even mention the ashtray design. Possibly one of the most irritating flaws on the 66-67. I guess they figured most people would leave them open since so many smoked back then.

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11 hours ago, JZRIV said:

Paul,

Don't even mention the ashtray design. Possibly one of the most irritating flaws on the 66-67. I guess they figured most people would leave them open since so many smoked back then.

You aint lyin'! 

I'm no geometry wiz but jeez. What junk.

Where were the Fisher engineers after the clay passed Mitchell's eyes?

 

And remember when people dumped those overfull trays at stop lights?  Nasty :unsure:

 

What a thread I created?

 

701543_4.jpg

Edited by PWB (see edit history)

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Perhaps a bit off topic, but how about mis-stamping or double stamping? Looks like they may have quadruple (maybe three) hit the number 4 on this one, which is off a 71 GS engine VIN code.

Screen Shot 2017-01-07 at 2.11.03 AM.png

Edited by Chimera (see edit history)

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2 hours ago, Chimera said:

Mouth breather open ash tray and passenger side misaligned lower.

 

 

Love your (Jade?) interior. Rare

Heres another, the hood spears. Seemingly rare with paint. I think is a great detail - gives depth. My car does not have it and I highly doubt it

was polished off. Car just sat in a garage as a dust collector.

AND don't we love how sellers lay out gorgeous pieces on rock filled surfaces? They REALLY care about the product. <_<

 

 

Spear.jpg

Edited by PWB
typo (see edit history)
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1 hour ago, PWB said:

Love your (Jade?) interior. Rare

Heres another, the hood spears. Seemingly rare with paint. I think is a great detail - gives depth. My car does not have it and I highly doubt it

was polished off. Car just sat in a garage as a dust collector.

AND don't we love how sellers lay out gorgeous pieces on rock filled surfaces? They REALLY care about the product. <_<

 

 

Spear.jpg

These hood spears were not painted in 66. I touched on this in one of my frame off series articles. They were chromed then had a process of media blasting or similar on the side inset  to create the dull argent silver look. I asked my plater to recreate this factory effect. He nailed it after 3 tries and you can't tell the finish from the other argent painted surfaces. He told me to never bring him another one for that process. He lost money because he quoted me a price up front but fortunately for me his pride of workmanship took precedent. In 67 the argent finish on the hood spear as well as many argent painted surfaces elsewhere were dropped. 67 hood spear was all chrome. Not hard to understand why. If I had it to do over again I'd just mask it, scuff surface and paint.  

Over-polishing on this special finish would erase it. I've seen many 66 spears with varying degrees of the original finish left

IMG_3670cropped.jpg

Edited by JZRIV (see edit history)

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On 1/6/2017 at 9:00 AM, Seafoam65 said:

                Now this is an interesting topic! One thing I've noticed on all the 60's GM cars I've owned or worked on is that

panel fit between hoods, fenders, doors and quarters and deck lids is always better on the driver's side of the car than the passenger side.

This is true on my 69 GTO and my 65 Riviera as well. My assumption is that the styling engineers spent a lot of time laying

out the driver's side of the car when designing it, then turned over their work to the new underlings to duplicate what they

did for the passenger side, with predictable results due to the expertise of those involved. You will note that the above flaw in the

first post is located on the passenger side of the car......they always are!

 

Wow -- this topic is on fire!  Anyway, late to the party but I wonder whether the explanation for Seafoam's observation has more to do with the factory body assembly process and tolerance stack-up than engineering (though the two are related).  Perhaps the driver's side is assembled before the passenger's side and therefore consumes more of the allowed assembly tolerance.  When it comes time to assemble the passenger's side (e.g., 2nd-gen right rear quarter panel), there's not enough margin left for the assembler to meet all of the seam & gap requirements, so the obvious ones are made as good as possible, while the least conspicuous ones (e.g., the one between the trunk lid above the right tail light) pay the price.

 

Edit: Going back and reading all of Gord's post (#9), it's clear that there are a multitude of issues which individually, or in combination, can result in the sort of anomalies discussed in this thread.  To me, it's all the more amazing that they came out as well as they did with the technology at the time.

 

Where this thread is headed (I'm guessing) is the thorny question of how to address such anomalies when restoring these cars.  It's the inevitable dilemma between restore to 'as-built' or 'as-designed' (i.e., 'as intended').  FWIW, I tend to lean toward the 'as-built' side (at least today)...

Edited by EmTee (see edit history)

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1 hour ago, JZRIV said:

These hood spears were not painted in 66. I touched on this in one of my frame off series articles. They were chromed then had a process of media blasting or similar on the side inset  to create the dull argent silver look. I asked my plater to recreate this factory effect. He nailed it after 3 tries and you can't tell the finish from the other argent painted surfaces. He told me to never bring him another one for that process. He lost money because he quoted me a price up front but fortunately for me his pride of workmanship took precedent. In 67 the argent finish on the hood spear as well as many argent painted surfaces elsewhere were dropped. 67 hood spear was all chrome. Not hard to understand why. If I had it to do over again I'd just mask it, scuff surface and paint.  

Over-polishing on this special finish would erase it. I've seen many 66 spears with varying degrees of the original finish left

 

Absolutely gorgeous. God or Devil in these details!  These make all the difference.

OK heres another one. My last '67 had the "Argent" on the turn signal bezels. My latest one does NOT.

Any more witness this?

Thanks

 

 

s-l300.jpg

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All 67 front parking bezels were painted argent as your pic shows. There is no documentation or factual evidence that indicates otherwise at least to my knowledge. Since the factory painted over bright chrome, some owners stripped the paint off to expose the chrome for more bling.

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14 hours ago, PWB said:

Here's another pesky Monday night factory install throughout the GM line -

crooked remote mirror controls! 

Arrrrrrgh! :angry:

 

 

Remote.JPG

 

... that problem likely occurred when the cable control for the remote mirror was too short to go between the front door clip holding the cable and the mirror adjustment housing - it just couldn't stretch anymore, and got stuffed in the door panel access as best it would fit, crooked or otherwise !

 

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This is a topic that will generate lots of interest.  I don't think I have ever owned a GM car without some type of fit and finish issue.  All my Riv's have had some with some more noticeable than others.  The lower vinyl body side molding on my 97 left front fender was a good half inch below the one on the door and the car was never in an accident.  The gap between the rear bumper and the body of the car on my 69 was not consistent from one end to the other.  The picture of the remote mirror base that Paul submitted was a very common problem on many GM cars.  You can straighten it out if you remove the panel but unfortunately, there will be an indentation on the vinyl from being like that for so many years that you have to leave it the way it is.

Back in the day, there weren't many line workers that would sweat the details and depending on the speed of the line, there may have been no opportunity to do so.  Unless it is something that really sticks out or adversely affects the operation of the car or a specific component, I say leave it the way it was built.  It is after all, part of the cars character and history.

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Perhaps those cars in question were built on a Friday or a Monday.  My dad, a long time mechanic in a Buick dealership in Hutchinson, had been told by a Buick district service rep that the line workers were paid on Thursday and lots of them were too hungover to report to work on Friday so there were a great number of subs working the line on Friday.  Poor quality assembly was the result.  Same situation occurred over the weekend so there were a lot of subs working the line on Monday.  Truth or urban myth?  Who really knows? But whenever Dad bought a car he'd somehow try to pinpoint exactly when it was built.  

 

I wonder if the guys who own the cars built in the 30s, 40s, and 50s notice these same anomalies.

 

 

Ed

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I worked at the Buick Plant in Flint from 1964 thru 1999. A common questions a foreman would ask an employee was "Why do you only work four days a week?"

His answer would be "I can't make it on Three"

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4 hours ago, RivNut said:

Truth or urban myth?  Who really knows? But whenever Dad bought a car he'd somehow try to pinpoint exactly when it was built.  

 

Ed

Sounds about right to me, I was told by people I knew that worked in the plants it was best if you could purchase one that was built on Wednesday! Generally speaking the most experienced people were there on most Wednesdays. Could be a myth, but that's what I recall being told.

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3 hours ago, Chasander said:

I worked at the Buick Plant in Flint from 1964 thru 1999. A common questions a foreman would ask an employee was "Why do you only work four days a week?"

His answer would be "I can't make it on Three"

Read this book and you'll wonder how anything came out right:

 

rivethead.jpg

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22 hours ago, EmTee said:

 

EmTee,

 

Got a pic' your passenger side lower front fender alignment?

Thanks

Edited by PWB (see edit history)

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3 hours ago, PWB said:

EmTee,

 

Got a pic' your passenger side lower front fender alignment?

Thanks

 

OK, here's how she looks...

1. Driver's side front fender/door:

IMG_0669.jpg

2. LR Quarter/Trunk Lid:

IMG_0671.jpg

3. Passenger's side front fender/door:

IMG_0672.jpg

4. RR Quarter/Trunk Lid:

IMG_0670.jpg

Comments?  Others care to submit pics of their car?  -Tim

 

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6 minutes ago, EmTee said:

 

Comments?  Others care to submit pics of their car?  -Tim

 

Tough to get good pics - my car is up in the air.

 

DSC02630.JPG

DSC02629.JPG

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Say, RoadShark - what color is your car?  Is it silver, or is your tail light surround painted silver like they did in '66?  P.S. I'm chuckling inside while reading your post because I'm afraid of the same 'while I'm in there' creep occurring as I try to get Goldie ready for Saratoga!  I'm really going to try to restrain myself...  :huh:

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As near as I can tell it's Platinum Mist.  That's what the firewall says anyway.

 

Project creep is dangerous.  I'm trying to be a good boy and not take the thing all apart...B)

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Nice collection of photos here!  On a related subject, I notice that on my car after closing the hood the passenger's side rear corner sits high in relation to the fender and cowl.  I have to walk over and give it a push to get it to settle down.  Is the hinge height adjustable where the hinge flange attaches to the fender?

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EmTee - Your hood hinge question don't want to get too off topic but first lubricate ALL pivot points liberally on hinges. Work it in by moving hood up and down15 or 20 times. Numerous options but I use 90wt gear lube in a squirter. If still no good try shimming under the "FRONT" hinge at bolt location (between hinge and hood). If that doesn't do it remove the hinge and elongate the rear bolt hole so the hinge can be lowered at rear.

 

Now back to anomalies topic: Looking at pic Chimera posted of gas tank. Almost all 66-67 tanks get dented at rear because they stick down below the bumper. I've never owned one that wasn't dented nor could I ever find a used dent free tank.

Edited by JZRIV (see edit history)
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1 hour ago, JZRIV said:

EmTee - Your hood hinge question don't want to get too off topic but first lubricate ALL pivot points liberally on hinges. Work it in by moving hood up and down15 or 20 times. Numerous options but I use 90wt gear lube in a squirter. If still no good try shimming under the "FRONT" hinge at bolt location (between hinge and hood). If that doesn't do it remove the hinge and elongate the rear bolt hole so the hinge can be lowered at rear.

 

Now back to anomalies topic: Looking at pic Chimera posted of gas tank. Almost all 66-67 tanks get dented at rear because they stick down below the bumper. I've never owned one that wasn't dented nor could I ever find a used dent free tank.

You made me investigate her underwear. Think I'm darn lucky. And this car was from the streets of San Francisco. Woooweee

 

P1090449.JPG

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