AACA Museum & AACA, What is Going On

[Dynaflash8]

On 12/21/2016 at 6:06 PM, hursst said:

How was it that these two entities started out separately to begin with?  The museum should have always been under the AACA's control from day 1.  Obviously there's a lot that I don't understand about the relationship, but it seems strange to me that they would ever be separate.  Once again, egos and hubris are ruining a good time for all.  We're all on the same team!

It was because of the IRS tax laws.  In the beginning the AACA was not a 501(C3) tax exempt organization.  They needed to start the Museum as a 501(c3) so they could accept tax deductible donations.  Since that time, AACA has finally qualified for a 501(c3).  Back in the 1940s or early 1950s the Club was incorporated as a 501(c5) tax exmept organization.  That is defined as a "tax exempt social organization."  The 501(c5) did not allow for tax deductible contributions or donations.  So that is why things were done as they were.  It was very difficult to qualify the Club for 501(c3) but this was finally accomplished early in the new century.  All of the old-timers who started the museum expected if that ever happened, the two would willingly wish to consolidate into the "AACA family", as eventually did the AACA Library.  Something went awry with that when the museum apparently realized they did not want to pursue that arrangement.  I'm no longer involved, so I don't know all of the details, and I'm certainly not a lawyer either.  This same plan was used some number of years before when the Library was formed, and it is now part of the "AACA family".  Sometimes things are not always as they seem or are expected to turn out.

Edited December 23, 2016 by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)

[Steve Moskowitz]

I don't want to beat this to death but technically the museum did start out under AACA as evidenced by some of the documents I posted.  However, when it was officially incorporated as a charitable non profit that is when the legal separation occurred.  Still, officers and staff from AACA were the ones doing yeoman's work from marketing, fund raising, accounting, etc.  The club's executive director was involved day to day with getting the museum up and running.

 

John, I answered the issue about Tom earlier.  Sometimes people just want to shoot the messenger!  Tom, is no shrinking violet and stood up for our members and our club to attempt to get us a deal we could live with. 

[MCHinson]

8 hours ago, Tinindian said:

 

I only belonged to the AACA for two years.  I am too far away to use the museum and the magazine was not what I was expecting. 

 

Just curious, How long ago were you a member? If you would be willing to give it a try again, I think you might find today's magazine alone worth the cost of the annual dues. Send me your address by PM and I would be happy to mail you some copies of recent magazines to let you see if you agree.

[Dynaflash8]

14 hours ago, trimacar said:

Seriously, it doesn't affect me, personally, one way or the other.  But, if the Museum fails, that reflects on the Club.  You can tell me all you want that they're "separate", but when the headline states "The AACA Museum is Closing",  you think it won't affect membership?

I wonder if the Club is not really better off.  This way, if the museum goes down as many of them do, they won't bankrupt the Club and the Club will go on.  I can remember, many of the original leaders and founders in Club leadership who were behind the founding of a museum often expressed worry that this could happen.  So, I wonder, is the Club maybe not better off without the saddle of the museum around its neck?  Saddles can become millstones. Just thinking.  Just saying.

 

For those interested in how this all began, I posted at the bottom of page 13 of this thread.

Edited December 23, 2016 by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)

[Doug Novak]

1 hour ago, Dynaflash8 said:

I wonder if the Club is not really better off.  This way, if the museum goes down as many of them do, they won't bankrupt the Club and the Club will go on.  I can remember, many of the original leaders and founders in Club leadership who were behind the founding of a museum often expressed worry that this could happen.  So, I wonder, is the Club maybe not better off without the saddle of the museum around its neck?  Saddles can become millstones. Just thinking.  Just saying.

 

For those interested in how this all began, I posted at the bottom of page 13 of this thread.

 

Technically the Club is not now in danger of being dragged down with the Museum if it should fail. Realistically, I seriously doubt that the continued success of both the Club and Museum are in any kind of danger. The worst thing that the Museum could suffer from would be if "Hershey Attractions" went belly up, and that's not going to happen. Millions of people and families come to the Hershey Amusement Park , Chocolate World,  Giant Stadium, and many other venues for vacation driven entertainment and the Museum attracts visitors looking for other things to do. Events such as The Fall East Coast Nation Meet, The Elegance, The Porsche Club Swap Meet, and many other Car Clubs, use the Museum for Shows and as a  place to gather for the start of Touring events.  Hershey is a perfect location for the AACA Museum. 

 

I do agree with what I think you're feeling,  and think I'd interpret it as meaning the Clubs desire to a Merger has become counter productive in our moving on in the direction we need to go right now.

[Dynaflash8]

1 hour ago, Doug Novak said:

 

Technically the Club is not now in danger of being dragged down with the Museum if it should fail. Realistically, I seriously doubt that the continued success of both the Club and Museum are in any kind of danger. The worst thing that the Museum could suffer from would be if "Hershey Attractions" went belly up, and that's not going to happen. Millions of people and families come to the Hershey Amusement Park , Chocolate World,  Giant Stadium, and many other venues for vacation driven entertainment and the Museum attracts visitors looking for other things to do. Events such as The Fall East Coast Nation Meet, The Elegance, The Porsche Club Swap Meet, and many other Car Clubs, use the Museum for Shows and as a  place to gather for the start of Touring events.  Hershey is a perfect location for the AACA Museum. 

 

I do agree with what I think you're feeling,  and think I'd interpret it as meaning the Clubs desire to a Merger has become counter productive in our moving on in the direction we need to go right now.

Doug: I think you misread me.  I should have said "I sometimes think".....     I feel like club members "basically" bought and paid for the place.  Since club members made it all possible. This should have been cut and dried.  But it isn't. I guess I was just musing and think out load that if you look at it all in a different light, one I think more differently than you do; that maybe we should be careful about what we wish for.  With our young population, and the blandness and computerization of newer cars, antique cars may become only an oddity these coming young folks have never been associated with and therefore care nothing about.  At this point, I don't think I can add anymore to the discussion.

[Guest JimJones]

This is my first foray into the Forum, but since the Hemmings article I have been looking at a few things, including the Museums own website where I found this . Apparently this was done before all the latest denials by the Museum of substantial AACA support....the latest Museum President which seems to be a Mr. Hallowel took over a few months ago. He obviously needs to read this.

 

Judging from the Museums own website the club is correct. Notice the first sentence below... particularly this part  "originated as s complement to its Research Center and Library" IF that doesn't tell the story of intent nothing does...and straight from the Museums own web page...for now anyway...check it now before it mysteriously disappears.

 

Its pretty obvious that the Museum Board has co-opted a significant part of the AACA legacy....by their own admission...

 

It looks like a ruse alright,...and they have legally just taken what was given in the name of AACA

 

Found on:  http://www.aacamuseum.org/about/

 

History of the Antique Automobile Club of America (AACA) Museum

The Antique Automobile Club of America (AACA) originated the concept of a collector-oriented automotive museum as a complement to its Research Center and Library. A decision to move forward on implementing the project led to the incorporation of the AACA Museum in 1993. Like the Library, the AACA Museum was established as a nonprofit educational institution under section 501(c)(3) of the Revised IRS code. This status made donations to these entities tax deductible. The Museum’s offices and small storage and display area were housed at the Club’s headquarters on Governor Road in Hershey, PA.

In 1993, following feasibility and planning studies, the Museum launched a $12 million Capital Campaign to build a dedicated museum facility. By the time of the ground-breaking for the 71,000 square foot building in October, 2001, seven million dollars had been received or pledged. The initial concept of a collector’s museum had also expanded to encompass a broader interpretive charge that focused on presenting America’s automotive heritage to a general audience. The new Museum opened to the public on June 26, 2003.

Today’s AACA Museum is professionally staffed, collecting institution presenting semi-permanent and temporary exhibitions. Exhibitions are supported by educational programs for school and community audiences. It sponsors workshops and other activities designed to raise public awareness and appreciation of the role that the automobile has played in shaping 20th century America. The AACA museum celebrates the role of the collector in preserving and making accessible a material record of this phenomenon. It is also unique in that virtually all the cars on display have been opened or donated by AACA members.

In addition, the AACA Museum houses the Museum of Bus Transportation Collection. A floor full of buses and more than 30 motorcycles, motorbikes and Cushman complement the 100 cars on display. The museum have over 20,000 sq. ft. in additional storage so vehicles can be rotated on a regular basis. Several times a year the displays change with loaned vehicles that fit special displays that range from horseless carriages to the muscle car era. The AACA Museum has been recognized by the Smithsonian as an Affiliate Museum which is an extremely rare honor. The AACA Museum has also been recognized as one of the Top 16 Automotive Museums in the world which is a great honor for this fledging organization.

---

Museum operations are supported in part by a general operating support grant from the Pennsylvania Historical and Museum Commission.

Edited December 23, 2016 by JimJones (see edit history)

[MCHinson]

54 minutes ago, Steve Moskowitz said:

CAWLEY2.docCAWLEY2.doc  Read this interesting letter about a great donation by a huge benefactor to the AACA, Mr. Charles Cawley and yes he was an AACA Life member.  Note the words from Al Edmond in the second paragraph.  Further proof, and there is plenty more we are uncovering of the intent of AACA in the very beginning.  In the end it is moot but letters from Mr. Stringer and Mr. Edmond and the words of former Past President Earl Beauchamp give validity to how we all feel (members, staff and the board). 

In case anyone is having troubles with the Microsoft Word document, here it is in a pdf format:

 

CAWLEY2.pdf

[Dynaflash8]

29 minutes ago, MCHinson said:

In case anyone is having troubles with the Microsoft Word document, here it is in a pdf format:

 

CAWLEY2.pdf

All said really well by my Pal Matt Hinson....er.....except I'm still living (I think...hmm, let me pinch this old body) so I'm a Past President, not a "former" Past President

And too, kudos to Mr. Jim Jones.....Pal, you can be my researcher any day!!

 

[R W Burgess]

3 hours ago, Dynaflash8 said:

Doug: I think you misread me.  I should have said "I sometimes think".....     I feel like club members "basically" bought and paid for the place.  Since club members made it all possible. This should have been cut and dried............... 

 

Mr. Beauchamp's post reminds me of a very famous AACA Past President who always said what was on his mind. He related to me years ago that he was not happy about the way the money and start-up financing had gone with the AACA Museum back in the beginning. He was so upset with some of of those folks that he demanded that his name be posted VERY PROMINENTLY in the building so that all would know that he had made a substantial donation to the AACA Museum. I have seen that sign many times in the past and laugh inside my head every time. He was a character and I miss him dearly!!! 

 

Wayne

[Durant Mike]

I've read this post since the beginning and as a long time member of the AACA see their side of the argument.  I also understand the initial structure of the museum and how it came about kind of prior to the AACA getting their IRS non-profit status. This could have been avoided if the structure of the museum had the BOD of the AACA the same as the BOD of the museum and had members of the AACA BOD specifically elected or appointed to run the museum. It's never good to have a club start a museum effort and then have a museum started under seperate BOD members who do not always have the love of the cars in their hart. Sounds impressive to have bankers, lawyers and other top community executives on your board, but they don't really care about the cars. It also appears that many of you are anti-museum period. Yes museums do cost money to run, but I for one enjoy when I visit an area to seek out local museums both automobile related and otherwise. A chance to see some cars that you might not see around anymore is always a good thing in my book.  It also allows many who love old cars, but are not really in the hobby to visit and view these automobiles. These people probably will never visit and AACA show or even Hershey but still like to look. The museums are also for future generations to see the cars we loved.  This as well as other clubs always complain that the member base is getting old and there is no new blood coming into the hobby. This has been discussed many many times, but if we don't preserve these items then there is nothing for the future generations to view or learn about.  How about the cars I'm interested in, the teens and 20's. How many do you see at the AACA meets with the exception of Hershey of course. The early years are not showing up much anymore, at least at the last several shows I've judged at.  There are some Model T or A's but all the other brands are getting thin.  Hopefully the museum will come to it's senses and be willing to work things out, which I have a feeling they will. Make take some time for ego's to realize that together the museum and the AACA are a better club and stronger than separate. I for one like the museum, and would like to see see it enlarge a bit more to take on more exhibits. Been there a couple of times and enjoy it each and every time.

[Doug Novak]

Fortunately there are learning centers that are bring Youth down to the our old world technologies with Modern Day Tools with great success. Two institutions come to mind. One being the PENNSYLVANIA COLLEGE OF TECHNOLOGY in Williamsport Pa. were the AACA Club's Susquehannock Region hosted the 2016 Grand National.  The other College that I think of is Thaddeus Stevens College of Technology close to Hershey. Imagine living the dream.  

[Dynaflash8]

2 hours ago, Durant Mike said:

I've read this post since the beginning and as a long time member of the AACA see their side of the argument.  I also understand the initial structure of the museum and how it came about kind of prior to the AACA getting their IRS non-profit status. This could have been avoided if the structure of the museum had the BOD of the AACA the same as the BOD of the museum and had members of the AACA BOD specifically elected or appointed to run the museum. It's never good to have a club start a museum effort and then have a museum started under seperate BOD members who do not always have the love of the cars in their hart. Sounds impressive to have bankers, lawyers and other top community executives on your board, but they don't really care about the cars. It also appears that many of you are anti-museum period. Yes museums do cost money to run, but I for one enjoy when I visit an area to seek out local museums both automobile related and otherwise. A chance to see some cars that you might not see around anymore is always a good thing in my book.  It also allows many who love old cars, but are not really in the hobby to visit and view these automobiles. These people probably will never visit and AACA show or even Hershey but still like to look. The museums are also for future generations to see the cars we loved.  This as well as other clubs always complain that the member base is getting old and there is no new blood coming into the hobby. This has been discussed many many times, but if we don't preserve these items then there is nothing for the future generations to view or learn about.  How about the cars I'm interested in, the teens and 20's. How many do you see at the AACA meets with the exception of Hershey of course. The early years are not showing up much anymore, at least at the last several shows I've judged at.  There are some Model T or A's but all the other brands are getting thin.  Hopefully the museum will come to it's senses and be willing to work things out, which I have a feeling they will. Make take some time for ego's to realize that together the museum and the AACA are a better club and stronger than separate. I for one like the museum, and would like to see see it enlarge a bit more to take on more exhibits. Been there a couple of times and enjoy it each and every time.

Part of the Museum Board was also part of the National Board for many years from the beginning.  I served one year as a member of the Museum Board as my job as a National Board member.  At that time there were also a number of AACA past National Directors and/or Presidents as part of the Museum Board.  Also around those times a number of AACA past present and board members or future National Presidents and Board members served as the President of the Museum.  I've been off the Board for a number of years now, and I don't know how this has progressed, but I believe that AACA does still have one National Board member assigned to the Museum Board, and possibly or probably another one or two Past Presidents of AACA may still be part of the Museum Board.  However, these people are obviously in the minority.  That's as much as I know about it.  Somebody said in this thread that Museums seldom fail or something like that.  May I bring to everyone's attention the closing of the Chrysler Museum on Dec 18th.  So, it does happen.

[Dynaflash8]

26 minutes ago, Doug Novak said:

Fortunately there are learning centers that are bring Youth down to the our old world technologies with Modern Day Tools with great success.

Somewhat off of the subject, but I heard on TV this morning that some university has stopped teaching American History to history majors. Ha, this at a time when school are no longer teaching longhand.  I can remember those long hours in second grade learning to craft longhand (what's that other word? Kersiff or something like that?).  I got that down pretty pat though and can write my name legibly along with anything else I want to write.

[Marty Roth]

2 minutes ago, Dynaflash8 said:

Somewhat off of the subject, but I heard on TV this morning that some university has stopped teaching American History to history majors. Ha, this at a time when school are no longer teaching longhand.  I can remember those long hours in second grade learning to craft longhand (what's that other word? Kersiff or something like that?).  I got that down pretty pat though and can write my name legibly along with anything else I want to write.

 

Cursive?

Thanks for your comments Earl. History, our club, as well as national, is so important. Remember the old saw

"Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it"?

[R W Burgess]

18 minutes ago, Marty Roth said:

Remember the old saw

"Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it"?

.....and they are still doing it Marty, repeating it. 

[Guest Mark McAlpine]

The quote is from George Santayana:  "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."  (I only know this because I had to look it up recently for a paper I was editing.)

 

Marion & I hope the club and museum can work out the differences, but we definitely support the club on this--we need to have more say in the museum's future for what the club and it's members have contributed to it, and more role in preserving (and protecting) its assets.  We have personally contributed modest sums to the museum since becoming AACA members and participated in the last few "Nights at the Museum, but will not be doing either again until this issue is resolved.  Similarly our region has contributed significantly to the museum every year, but based on the initial reactions of our Board of Directors and members I doubt that we will do so this year. 

 

Because we live too far away to visit more frequently, we only get to visit the AACA Museum during the Fall Meet in Hershey.  However, unlike one comment earlier in this thread, we always look forward to visiting it--it's not something you only need to visit once.  There's always something more to read, new exhibits, and vehicles and history we never tire of looking at.  Similarly, even though the vehicles don't change (they just get moved around), we visit the ACD Museum every year (during the Spring Meet in Auburn).  If we lived in the area, we'd happily volunteer to be docents.

 

For those who haven't visited the AACA Library & Research Center, if you had you'd know why they need a new facility. 

 

Merry Christmas everyone!  Here's to happy & peaceful 2017 (and an acceptable resolution to the museum issue).

 

 

[Marty Roth]

Quote of Mark McAlpine

The quote is from George Santayana:  "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."  (I only know this because I had to look it up recently for a paper I was editing.) ...

For those who haven't visited the AACA Library & Research Center, if you had you'd know why they need a new facility. 

 

Merry Christmas everyone!  Here's to happy & peaceful 2017 (and an acceptable resolution to the museum issue).

 

Thank you Mark, I guess we've heard this misquoted. The lesson is well-received, or should be.

[Joe in Canada]

Thanks to all the AACA National Director taking time from your families at this festive time of year answering questions with great patience. You are the people that make this club.

                   Thanks and Merry Christmas to all

                                     Joe Konarowski  AACA member

[midman]

On 12/22/2016 at 7:18 AM, midman said:

OK, I get that there are two sides to every story, the club board has our best interests at heart, and that negotiations were completely stalled and time has run out for the club to make a decision on moving forward with its building expansion plans.

 

So my question is, what is the rationale of the club board deciding to "cut all ties" with the museum? Even if the club decided to stop the $80,000 payment I could sort of understand, but deciding to stop joint fund raising and joint programs that would benefit both and promote both seems like a win win to me.

It looks like the names of the club and museum are not going to change and each has assets that complement one another so why the total break (unless the club is considering building another museum).

 

Can anyone from the AACA board answer this?

I know the club and its members did and do the majority of work and contributions to the museum but all agree they are staring at an impasse as far as the merger, but why not continue helping each other in fund raising and collective events like the elegance and swap meet.

If these adverserail positions continue I can see these great events mired in conflict and bad blood for years to come to the detriment of all with competing fund raising events, volunteers being asked to help during the same times, outside celebrities and major collectors feeling pulled in different directions when asked to appear, etc, etc.

 

[MCHinson]

I am not a director so I can't speak for them but I would guess from all that I have read that the decision was made to focus all fundraising efforts on the club's immediate needs for the club's headquarters/library.

 

I would also guess that another benefit to that position would be that the absence of the previous fund raising efforts by AACA for the AACA Museum might very well work to let the museum see what they are missing. It might very well work to convince the museum board that their position was wrong and that a merger with the club would be in their best interest. Perhaps the museum might want to come back to the table and discuss a merger on more equitable terms in a year or so.

[MCHinson]

Imperial62,

 

While I can understand your feelings. I know that there are lots of people who have supported both organizations in the past. I think that your scenario is one of several possible long term results. I think it is also possible that the museum will still be successful, although it will have to make some changes in how it finances things. The fact that the Hershey area is still a tourist destination will help it continue to have enough visitors to have enough cash flow to survive. Some of the past supporters will still support both AACA and the AACA Museum. I don't know what the percentage will turn out to be. It is also possible that the reduction in AACA member donations will bring about a significant change in the behavior of the Museum Board. While I am not sure that I think that a merger will happen, or if it is even a good idea for the club, it may be possible for the two organizations to again work together in the future. Time will tell.

[AJFord54]

6 hours ago, midman said:

 

Can anyone from the AACA board answer this?

I know the club and its members did and do the majority of work and contributions to the museum but all agree they are staring at an impasse as far as the merger, but why not continue helping each other in fund raising and collective events like the elegance and swap meet.

If these adverserail positions continue I can see these great events mired in conflict and bad blood for years to come to the detriment of all with competing fund raising events, volunteers being asked to help during the same times, outside celebrities and major collectors feeling pulled in different directions when asked to appear, etc, etc.

 

If you take the time to read everything, you'll find that the AACA went above and beyond to work with the museum.  I wouldn't give them a dime and as I previously stated, I would prefer that the "free" admission to the museum for club members be rescinded  and anything paid by the National for that option be redirected towards a building fund for the AACA Library/Executive offices.  Additionally, I'd like to see a fund-raiser for those offices - perhaps $10 - $25 - $100 options.  It would get the job done quickly.  I'd also like to see the museum named something like "Antique Transportation Museum at Hershey" to get the AACA name off of it.  Here's hoping they're listening.  Doubt it - they still want to piggy-back off of our AACA initials.

 

"Holy Wheat" - I just did some math - I previously read that we pay $3.00 per member for the right to have "free admission" to the museum.  Could someone verify that number?  If it is true, with 60,000 members, the club is paying $180,000 a year for that "privilege".  What am I missing here?  For the number of members who actually take advantage of that offer, I'd rather see that $3.00 of our $35.00 go directly back into the coffers of our treasury to build the new facility.  Board Members - those in the know - please provide correct information.  

Edited December 25, 2016 by AJFord54 (see edit history)

[paul455]

Food for thought

The Museum gets around 70,000 visitors per year

Hershey Park gets 3 million plus per year (per Wikopedia)

You do the math

Paul Gawel

[Guest jwsamuel]

1 hour ago, MCHinson said:

Some of the past supporters will still support both AACA and the AACA Museum. 

 

Or, you will have people like me who joined AACA thinking it was the best way to support the museum. Given the way this has been handled, I am not feeling good about either board and know that when my 2017 AACA membership expires, I will take one of two options:

1) Not renew my AACA membership for 2018 but instead get a museum membership, or

2) (Most likely) Support neither one.

 

Jim Samuel

Langhorne. Pa.

[Guest jwsamuel]

1 hour ago, paul455 said:

Food for thought

The Museum gets around 70,000 visitors per year

Hershey Park gets 3 million plus per year (per Wikopedia)

You do the math

Paul Gawel

 

I don't understand the point of that comparison.

 

All that matters is whether or not the museum gets the number of visitors it need to keep operating.

 

Jim Samuel

Langhorne, Pa.

[MCHinson]

3 hours ago, AJFord54 said:

I previously read that we pay $3.00 per member for the right to have "free admission" to the museum.  Could someone verify that number?  If it is true, with 60,000 members, the club is paying $180,000 a year for that "privilege".  What am I missing here?  For the number of members who actually take advantage of that offer, I'd rather see that $3.00 of our $35.00 go directly back into the coffers of our treasury to build the new facility.  Board Members - those in the know - please provide correct information.  

 

As I recall what from my recent reading, the club was donating $80,000 per year to the museum. The museum did (and has indicated that they will continue to) offer free admission to AACA Members. I don't think that there was a specific amount paid by the club for the "free" admission of club members. With as much as AACA Members have done for the museum, I would be surprised if they stop offering free admission. AACA members have been responsible for almost all of the contributions to the museum. I would expect that, in spite of recent issues, the museum will realize that it is in their best interest to try to keep those members interested in the museum.

[W_Higgins]

22 hours ago, AJFord54 said:

"Holy Wheat" - I just did some math - I previously read that we pay $3.00 per member for the right to have "free admission" to the museum.  Could someone verify that number?  If it is true, with 60,000 members, the club is paying $180,000 a year for that "privilege".  What am I missing here?  For the number of members who actually take advantage of that offer, I'd rather see that $3.00 of our $35.00 go directly back into the coffers of our treasury to build the new facility.  Board Members - those in the know - please provide correct information.  

 

AJ, it's because the membership number for accounting purposes is closer to 33,000 than the often cited 60,000.  Attached are two docs.  One is Part VIII of the Club's 990 filed with the IRS in 2014 which puts line "1b Membership dues" at $1,027,664.  If you divide that by $35.00 you get about 29,362 paid memberships.  Add in fully paid Life Memberships from prior years and that probably brings the actual number closer to 33,000.  Also attached is the USPS circulation record published on P. 99 of your Nov./Dec. Antique Automobile and it puts the Paid Distribution right about 33,000, so those numbers are in sync. 

 

Additionally, quoting the Club's executive director from his post no. 11 in the much loved Nationwide thread, he verifies the same:

 

Quote

The records sent to Nationwide were only to be active members (a mistake or two with 33,000 plus records could have been made.   

 

 

 

I believe the 60,000 number is most likely an educated guess when factoring in member's spouses, but in terms of dollars it will do little to aid you in your calculations.

 

 

[MCHinson]

The 60,000+ figure often cited is the number of individual people who are members. I am sure that the majority of the club's memberships are joint memberships so the number of memberships is much less than that figure, as shown in the published documents. As far as I have read, I don't think there was any specific amount per member calculation involved in arriving at the club's donation amount to the museum in the past. 

[R W Burgess]

15 minutes ago, MCHinson said:

The 60,000+ figure often cited is the number of individual people who are members. I am sure that the majority of the club's memberships are joint memberships so the number of memberships is much less than that figure, as shown in the published documents. As far as I have read, I don't think there was any specific amount per member calculation involved in arriving at the club's donation amount to the museum in the past. 

 

You are correct Matt, dual memberships. I do not understand what the point is of this user even bringing this up. The donation amount will not matter by this time next week, as it will cease.

[John348]

Last night while having our family Christmas dinner the Library/AACA Relationship became a rather hot topic at the table. My three sons who are all fine young men with families of their own decided to purchase a brick at the museum as a Christmas present for me. The brick was honoring what I felt was my greatest accomplishment in the hobby was being awarded a Bomgardner Award for my 1962 Chevrolet Biscayne at the 2008 Annual Meeting. I have had a pretty good life and have been pretty successful, and if I ever need something I just get it, but this would be something I would never get for myself so I guess I am a rather hard person to get a gift for. (although I would not mind a box of Nat Sherman Hamilton cigars under the tree, but my wife won't allow my sons to "destroy my health") I am also lucky to have three sons who think that much of me and knew that that brick would mean so much to me over the years

 

This thought was inspired this past year at Hershey as part of our annual Hershey tradition when my older son and i look for the bricks that were purchased for my Father after he passed away, by us and a few of the region's he had belonged to. At that time I had made a comment to my son that it is a shame that we wait until someone passes away before we honor them with such a gift and they never get to see it or appreciate it. I guess that comment struck a chord and the wheels started turning and they came up with this idea, which is was really great.

 

So the question was asked of me last night over dessert, "dad because of what is going on do you still want us to proceed with this brick purchase?"  Other then wishing they had spent their hard earned money on something they needed for themselves, what could I say...... They expressed that they were a little upset that they wanted something to present to me at Christmas from the Museum that the gift was ordered but they were given nothing, even though they requested it and felt there adequate time for the museum to do so. The only suggestion I could make other then writing a letter to the Museum BOD pointing out the purchase of the brick, the reasons why, and urging them that in the long run it is in everyone's best interest that this gets resolved and everything is as one. I really did not have an answer, as wife reminded me that I was going to make a donation to the museum as of two days ago I just was not sure of the amount we were going to donate this year because of all this mess, but I was still going to write a check regardless. Part of my delay on making my annual donation this year is on the back of the donation envelope it clearly says in bold print:

"Thank you or your support of the Antique Automobile Club of America Museum"

To be very honest this really ticks me off! It might be an oversight, but I feel this comment is very misleading and dishonest, and I am going to presume that this was an oversight, and a letter with my donation will be included informing them of how I feel about how they are representing themselves. Over the past 15 pages of posts I had mentioned this three times but it got lost in the shuffle of emotions this topic has generated'

 

I would also like to thank ALL of the BOD Members of the AACA for their efforts and energy trying to look out for the club not for just now but for the future so we can survive. Not just for this matter but all matters that the club is involved. Some of the comments posted here by members I felt were pretty disrespectful, and it seems like some have forgotten that thee members decided to donate their time and own money because they feel very passionate about our organization. Having served on the Board of Directors for the Vintage Chevrolet Club of America (and returning again now) I realize that the all clubs are a non profit business and for a club to be successful it has to be a club for the members and the business has to go on int the background for members to enjoy the club as just that a CLUB  once the business gets out on the floor it can become an argument. I am not saying things should not be more transparent, but it does not have to be out in front all of the time.  While negotiations are involved with all parties involving legal advise throwing stuff all over the internet might not be in the clubs best interest 

I also suggest that those who feel they want too, and need too contribute their ideas and opinions about the management of our club should contact the BOD and ask to be involved on a committee where these skills can be used. From time to time I have seen this request printed in our magazine

 

To be very honest I had always felt that the museum was "ours."  The fact that it the AACA's name is attached to it, the success of the Museum is even more important because any failure would be considered the AACA's failure, considering it wears our name and we don't have any control over it is scary.

 

When you go to the Museum, please don't step on my brick! 

Edited December 26, 2016 by John348 (see edit history)

[Guest Mark McAlpine]

To Jim Samuel and others having similar thoughts about not continuing your membership in the AACA (and/or museum), I strongly urge you to reconsider.  Yes, the club and the museum are knocking heads and we don't know yet what the final outcome will be--whether the divide is too large and they go their separate ways, or whether an acceptable resolution can be reached and both organizations come together--but the purpose of the AACA remains the same:  to share our love of antique/classic vehicles, to preserve and enjoy these vehicles and the history or the automobile, and to gather with others who share this passion whether it be to restore old cars, show old cars, drive and go on tours with old cars, or even just to view & enjoy them.  Since you've already renewed for 2017, you have a year to think this over.  I hope during that time your initial displeasure dissipates (and, who know, maybe the issue will be resolved by then) and you renew your membership.  Each member brings something different to the club.  I'd like to have the opportunity to learn from and about you, whether in person or even just through friendly exchanges on different topics in the Forum.

 

Best wishes to all for 2017!

 

 

[Doug Novak]

7 hours ago, Mark McAlpine said:

To Jim Samuel and others having similar thoughts about not continuing your membership in the AACA (and/or museum), I strongly urge you to reconsider.  Yes, the club and the museum are knocking heads and we don't know yet what the final outcome will be--whether the divide is too large and they go their separate ways, or whether an acceptable resolution can be reached and both organizations come together--but the purpose of the AACA remains the same:  to share our love of antique/classic vehicles, to preserve and enjoy these vehicles and the history or the automobile, and to gather with others who share this passion whether it be to restore old cars, show old cars, drive and go on tours with old cars, or even just to view & enjoy them.  Since you've already renewed for 2017, you have a year to think this over.  I hope during that time your initial displeasure dissipates (and, who know, maybe the issue will be resolved by then) and you renew your membership.  Each member brings something different to the club.  I'd like to have the opportunity to learn from and about you, whether in person or even just through friendly exchanges on different topics in the Forum.

 

Best wishes to all for 2017!

 

 

Agree with you Mark and would remind everyone that The AACA Hershey Fall Meet, the biggest Car Show in the World, requires that to enter you must have an AACA Club Membership the year of the Show.  You wouldn't  want to miss this event, ever. 

Edited December 30, 2016 by Doug Novak
correction to reuirements (see edit history)

[Guest jwsamuel]

5 hours ago, Mark McAlpine said:

 To Jim Samuel and others having similar thoughts about not continuing your membership in the AACA (and/or museum), I strongly urge you to reconsider. 

 

Mark,

 

Thanks for the message. I do not have a collector car now, so I have no interest in entering a car in the fall meet. I do enjoy antique and classic cars and still enjoy the hobby by attending shows, reading about cars and going to museums. 

When I first joined AACA in December 2015 for the 2016 calendar year, I did so because I thought the club and museum were one and the same. I saw nothing in any of the membership materials to indicate other wise. When I go the mailing to renew my membership for 2017, there was nothing in those mailings to indicate that the two organizations we not the same, not that there was a rift between the two groups. It was not until I got the letter announcing the split that I was aware that they were separate organizations.

 

I really feel as if I was misled by AACA about the relationship, and wonder if the AACA board deliberately held off on any mention of the split until after most people had already renewed.

 

The bottom line is that I do not trust the board of the AACA or the museum. That's why I regret having renewed my membership for 2017 and that's why I will not renew my membership as long as I do not trust what they say or do.

 

Even though I am only a two-hour drive away from the museum, the best I would be able to do is get there once or twice a year. Given that I joined AACA to support the museum, the reality is that I can do more to support the museum by just paying the admittance fee whenever I want to go.

 

If I see a compelling reason to renew my AACA membership after 2017, and if I believe I can trust what the board says, I will renew. But given my lack of trust I do not see that as being likely.

 

Jim

[MCHinson]

1 hour ago, Doug Novak said:

Agree with you Mark and would remind everyone that The AACA Hershey Fall Meet, the biggest Car Show in the World, requires that to enter you most have an AACA Club Membership the year prior to, and year of, the Show.  

You wouldn't  want to miss this event, ever. 

 

Doug,

While this is a bit off topic (like a lot of this discussion) I feel that I need to correct an error here. To register a car for the Fall Meet you simply have to be a member of AACA . There is no requirement to have been a member of AACA in the prior year. 

 

Jim,

Everybody certainly has the right to their own opinion but I really don't quite understand your position. AACA started the AACA Museum. The Club and its members have always supported the Museum to make it what it is today. The Museum has always been considered to be part of the AACA Family, although it was legally a separate organization. The Club's board of directors recently reached a point that it had to discontinue an effort to merge with the museum and advised its members of that fact. I don't understand how you can feel misled by the board. I hope you will read the board's explanation of the process in the January/February Issue of Antique Automobile before you consider your decision final. I look forward to receiving that issue. Also, it is almost a year before you have to make a final decision about renewal or not. Who knows what may transpire in that time frame? I suspect that, depending on how AACA's membership responds to the museum's need for donations in that time frame, the relationship between the club and the museum may change. There is certainly a chance that the museum board's attitude towards the club may change. There is too much uncertainty for any of us to say for certain exactly what the situation will be a year from now. If it turns out at that time that you no longer want to be an AACA Member, then do what is best for you. Certainly you should continue to support the museum since you are passionate about it. I am sure that I will continue to visit the museum when I am in Hershey. At the moment, that is probably the extent of my support of the museum. If things change in the future, then my level of support for the museum may very well change. I will make that decision in the future, based on the circumstances as they area at that time.

[Guest jwsamuel]

1 hour ago, MCHinson said:

Everybody certainly has the right to their own opinion but I really don't quite understand your position.

My position is that in all the membership materials I looked at before I joined, nothing said that the two were separate organizations and that joining the club  was not the same as joining the museum. I care more about the museum than the club. That's why I feel misled.

 

Jim

[MCHinson]

9 minutes ago, jwsamuel said:

My position is that in all the membership materials I looked at before I joined, nothing said that the two were separate organizations and that joining the club  was not the same as joining the museum. I care more about the museum than the club. That's why I feel misled.

 

Jim

I wonder what membership materials you were reading and if you got them from the museum or elsewhere. While I have never inquired about membership in the Museum, I would assume that the museum has AACA Museum membership information available at the museum. I have seen the museum's membership program described on its website and really see no reason an AACA member would want to join the Museum as well.

 

I am looking at the Antique Automobile Club of America Membership Information brochure and a Membership Application. The brochure page that describes the museum clearly lists "AACA Museum, Inc." at the top of the page. It includes the statement, "Unlimited FREE admission to the Museum for AACA members. You must show your current year AACA membership card."  This statement is factual. It is not misleading.

 

The back of the application section titled AACA Museum, indicates "Your current year membership card entitles you to unlimited free admission. The AACA Museum was incorporated in 1993 and was completed in 2003. The facilities encompass over 80,000 squre feet and houses approximately 100 collector vehicles. A gift shop, educational programs and a regular change of exhibits can be found at the museum. Visit www.aacamuseum.org or call 717-466-7100." This is also factual. It clearly directs the reader to the museum's website. 

 

I don't think that any organization typically goes to great extreme to explain all of the details of its business relationships with associated organizations in its membership materials. I personally think that AACA has typically gone further than many organizations in revealing a lot of details that actually meant nothing to the casual observer until the museum board changed their direction from their previous harmonious relationship with the club. It appears to me that you, like apparently many others, glossed over some of the details and now you wish to complain about being "misled".

 

I realize that you are a newcomer to the club and only recently joined the Discussion Forum but I continue to be surprised that people could read the materials presented by AACA from the time that the idea to start the museum was first being discussed until the recent decision by the board to discontinue financial contributions to the museum, and claim that they never realized that the museum was not part of the club.  

 

[MCHinson]

20 minutes ago, mike6024 said:

Who elects the Museum Board of Directors anyway? I see the museum offers annual memberships for $35, but it doesn't say that entitles one to vote on directors, just free admission for the year.

 

Great question. To the best of my understanding, the Museum Board of Directors elects the new board members. I can't seem to find the Museum's Bylaws on their website. I would really love to get a chance to read the Museum's Bylaws.  

[oldcarfudd]

I don't really have a dog in this fight.  But the AACA membership card I just got doesn't mention the museum.  Last year's membership card includes the museum logo "AACA Museum" and, in very small print, 'The Antique Automobile Club Museum".  That would have suggested to me, a year ago, had I cared enough to look, that both the library and the museum were part of the AACA.  By the way, the Model T Ford Club of America owns the Model T museum in Indiana.  Both the club and the museum are 501(c)(3) organizations, club members are museum members, and the two organizations share a common board.  So it's not an unusual arrangement.

 

Gil Fitzhugh the Elder

[MCHinson]

Gil,

While the Library is a part of the club, I would think that the three logos, AACA, AACA Museum, and AACA Library and Research Center, on the back of the membership cards constitute advertising. The big print on the front of the card clearly shows that it denotes membership in the Antique Automobile Club of America. 

 

I wonder what previous AACA Museum membership cards look like? Maybe someone can answer that question.

 

If there is ever any future idea of any type of merger, I think that a common board would be a critical need based on recent history.