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My official 1936 D2 sedan resurrection thread


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It's great to hear from you, Jim!  I was wondering when you'd notice that I had posted about my car.  I'm pretty bummed out that your tank maker is defunct because I was very impressed by his workmanship and ready to go that route.  I will now follow Jack M's advice about searching the web for a tank.  Hopefully it'll turn out to be a nice part.

Get back on that touring sedan project!  The popularity of these cars isn't increasing and I suspect that supplier after supplier will fade away.  I'm not too worried about running boards or upholstery for my car because what's there is serviceable, at least for awhile.  When I'm sorted mechanically (by the time I'm 80, probably) I can move on to cosmetics. <wink, wink>

 

I stopped by The Dodge Garage this morning to return the battery cover to the car and see how it fit.  Beautifully, of course.  Then I dug through my boxes of loose parts and found what may be the battery cover center plate.  It seems to be the correct dimensions and does have a screw hole in the right place.  What's weird, though, is that it's domed slightly.  The curvature must be intentional because there's a shallow "X" embossed on the plate.  I guess I can imagine that it should be very slightly domed so it won't rattle but this seems too extreme for that.  I can't get it to slip into place easily and don't want to bend it.

Any chance this is the missing piece?

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It's flat now, that's for sure.  On to the next challenge.

I uncoiled my Rhode Island wiring harness yesterday and tried to match up the connections in the steering column area on my car to those on the new harness.  Not as obvious as I expected.  Seems like there are a lot of connections down low at the frame and forward.  I need to take another look today.  I expect to find a fuel tank fairly soon and want to be able to fire up the engine soon after that.  Should be interesting!

Trying to decide if I should go ahead and order an exhaust system now and be done with it.  Anyone have recommendations in that department?  The "exhaust system" that was on my car was a cobbled together mess of flex pipe and JC Whitney bits dating from the late 50s.

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It just shows the difference in market size. I would never even think about "ordering an exhaust pipe". There are none here to be had. I just show up at an exhaust shop and they make up an exhaust. Of course, you have to make sure they are sympathetic to the old car and not butchers....

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There are a few companies that sell specific exhaust systems for older cars. It's hard to find a local shop that will take the time to correctly bend the pipes for a vehicle like that. Are your hangers in good shape as they are hard to find. Also, originally, they use  steel 2 bolt wrap around sleeve type clamps that usually show up on Ebay but at outlandish prices. The muffler inlet used a larger diameter than the exhaust pipe, but of course, that's if you wish to keep it original. If you need it, I can send you a copy of the wiring diagram from my manual. That should help you figure the wiring out. can be a little hard to get up behind the dash though!

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I think the hangers are in good condition.  They're not rusted away but my have been bent a bit by the PO to accommodate the JC Whitney flex pipe installation.  I'm just thankful they're there!

I think I'd have no luck at all having stock pipe bent to spec by a local shop.  They're all chain stores like Midas.  If I can get a model specific pre-bent pipes and a muffler sent to my house I'll go that route.  I don't care so much about having correct clamps as long as they seal the joints.  the muffler that was on the car has a 1958 manufacture date.  I didn't check to see if inlet and out diameters are the same but I will see what a new system spec is.

I'll figure out the wiring.  I do have a service manual and Rhode Island included a drawing with all connections labeled.  I'm was just surprised at how non-obvious the match up was between teh existing wiring and the new harness.

I think I'll head to the Dodge Garage this morning before it gets stinkin' hot here.  I want to drop the oil pan and see how nasty it is in there before I try to start the engine for the first time.  I think things will move along quickly in that department now that I can get teh car off jack stands/ramps, roll it out of the garage for better lighting, and access.

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Also, I was perusing the 1936-1942 master parts book this morning while having my coffee.  Looking at the battery box info I see that the rectangular plate on top is shown as being flat with two holes and having a rubber insulator gasket.  This is as 36 D2 Coupe describes in a post on page 5.  Any idea when that coupe was built?  My car is an early 36 (November of 1935 build) and has a different battery box cover and plate arrangement as shown in my pics.  Jpage says his D2 has a battery box cover/plate arrangement like the one I found on my car.  I think he once said that his car is a December 1935 build.  I guess there was a running change in production.

I'm bugged by the master parts book model year coverage.  I bet that my 36 has more in common with 1935 models but that book covers 36-42.  I need to do a web search for 1935 parts book availability.

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I don`t have a build date for my D2 Coupe as the records for Chrysler Canada no longer exist. Body number is 76 but I have no idea what assembly date that would represent. I think your battery box lid is correct for your car.  it may be that the earlier units used a style that was a carry-over from1935 as you suggest. Just iron it out a bit and it will be fine.

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My March '36 parts book shows the battery cover up to car no. 4058050 being no. 635615 and after that no. 7312270. No idea what the difference is. They show the same number for all models except the conv. coupe and the conv. sedan.There is no listing for a cover for them. The box in your photo looks like mine, they may have changed the lid a little for easier access. There is no listing for a separate lid as it must have been sold as an assy.

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Thanks everyone for their input.  And, yes, Happy 4th of July as well.

My son and I had an AWESOME day at The Dodge Garage.  We cleared away everything from the front of the car and got under there to unfasten the oil pan.  No big deal with teh car already on ramps and jack stands.  When knocking the pan loose turned out to be harder than I expected we removed the RH splash pan for better access.  Not a big deal but at that time I did notice that the RH Frt leaf spring assy is probably a replacement.  The 3 other leaf spring assys still have their covers but not the RH frt.  And the attaching bolts look different.  Something happened at some point decades ago.  I'll never know what...

Oh, I forgot to say that we first drained the oil in the pan.  It had been in there at least 35 years.  At first a kinda clear fluid gushed out, then an amber fluid, then chunks of thick "snot" started to show up.  When things slowed to a drip I put the drain plug back in and started going around the pan flan go with a putty knife.  In short order the pan dropped into my hands.

The inside was startlingly clean for an 86 YO car (at least as far as I'm concerned) but at the bottom of the sump was a 3/4" layer of goo that looked like Vaseline.  My son and I scraped it out into a coffee cup and we filled that 16 oz cup to the brim with a bit more still in the pan.  I poured some fresh gas into the pan and sloshed it around to get the worst of the filth.  I have to say that everything in that crankcase looks quite good to my eye for such an old car.

Coming up: oil pan reinstallation, filling with oil, and attempts to start.  Junior is *SO* excited about this project. He wanted to keep going and going and going, long after I wanted to go home and clean up/have a beer!

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Scratch my previous comment on the cover as I found another section . Not knowing exactly what Dodge called these parts, it can be hard to pick them out. The above numbers were for the "Battery support hold down cover assy.". Now I've found the battery cover assy. listing. The cover number is 713812 for all models except the conv. cpe and the conv. sedan. However the lid changes. The lid no. for all models except the con. cpe, con. sdn. and the 4 door sedan up to car no. 4094293 is 71514. It only has one thumbscrew. The lid number for cars after no. 4094293 is part no. 732377 which fits all models except the 2 converts and includes the 4 door sedan.  Both of my cars were built after no. 4094293 but have the cover with one screw. Of course they may have been changed over the years or they used up old stock as best they could even after the change . Many mysteries with these old cars, no one will ever know how they were really built. Either box will fit. 

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Another fruitful morning at The Dodge Garage:  First I slid under the car to check out the exhaust hangers.  The mid-car hanger looks great and probably original.  The one for the tailpipe also seems to be original but has been twisted to accommodate that lovely flexible pipe that has been removed and put in the scrap pile.  Here are a couple pics.

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While I was at the back of the car I again examined the fuel tank area.  For the first time I noticed the remains of a piece of paper sandwiched between teh frame and the body.  This reminded me of the Chrysler Corp "Broadcast Sheet" that was taped to a body or frame as it went down the assembly line and used by assembly line workers to select components for installation on the car.  I wonder if the remains could be  the same thing that I received as a microfilm document from Chrysler last year.  Hmmmm  Anyone else ever see anything like this?

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I also discovered a few boxes of parts that the PO had stripped from a 36 P1 back in the late 70s/early 80s.  As I heard the story this car was in NE PA and had been sitting in a field for decades.  The PO of my car heard about it and drove up there to strip everything he could.  A lot of the stuff I can identify.  A lot of it is a mystery.  An area of particular interest is the throttle linkage cross shaft.  When I visited jpage he cautioned me about some small parts that are a part of that linkage and that they are often lost/omitted which causes sloppy actuation.  Well my D2 has a lot of slop in that cross shaft, mostly at the passenger side, and I'm trying to remember what Jim said.

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It appears to me that the bracket in the firewall photo might be bent a little. There should not be as much space between the 2 brackets. They should be closer as in the next pic. Also, there should be some thin steel shims that fit between the brackets and the rod to take up slack but allow for movement. One part that gets worn badly is the swivel joint at the end of the throttle rod. The originals are no longer available new but can be replaced with a modern type if not too concerned with authenticity. If you check with some of the suppliers, you mag be able to snag a good used one if needed. I might have some extra shims and brackets and rods if you need any. feel free to contact me if you have any needs or questions

Edited by jpage (see edit history)
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Thanks Jim, I'll take a look at the rest of the throttle linkage soon.  I think that today Karl and I will remove the incorrect generator and cobbled on regulator and clean that general area so we can install the new wiring harness without immediately getting it filthy with old grease/oil.  There was definitely some "innovating" going on under that hood regarding the electrical system.

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Edited by Pete in PA (see edit history)
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Another thing I found on Friday was a box containing the sealed beam conversion parts from who knows when.  These parts were not on the car when I bought it and I don't know who removed them.  I was able to get the LH side to kinda fit and see how the conversion ring completely covered the original headlamp pod trim ring.  Pretty awful looking if you ask me.  I'll definitely be looking for a pair of unmolested headlamps.

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I'll say someone fooled with the wiring, they have wires coming out of every hole in the firewall! I see that they used some sort of aftermarket dimmer switch too! I have a new aftermarket dimmer that looks almost exactly like the original except that it uses screw terminals instead of the slide terminals.That would entail changing the terminals on the harness so  I decided to use my original instead. I might have one of those lying around too somewhere. Is the original cutout still on the generator and does it still work? That's probably why they put on that replacement. One part that's not included in the kit is the wires for the dashlights and the sockets. That is easily enough made. Also, you will have to make up the horn button wire and i also found that the wire for the electric choke was too short. I called RI and the sent me enough material to make a new one. The headlight wires do not come with the original brass connectors or the bakelight triple spacer plugs. You will either have to reuse the old ones if you have them or change over to modern type bullet connectors. Don Axlerod may have some of those headlamp parts you need. I have a couple of extra reflectors but have to look to make sure they are the same.I also had to rebuild the internal headlamp wire and sockets. I don't think they come in the new kit. Have fun! If you have questions , Pm me and I'll give you my phone number.

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I think the very first time I opened the hood on the Dodge and saw that wiring I shuddered.  Hoo boy, that's take some rectifying!  A new wiring harness was my first purchase for the project and I'm getting very close to installing it.

 

Yesterday was another stinkin' hot and humid day here in SE PA.  I did spend some time at the car, working at the left side of the engine to remove the added on voltage regulator and clear away the butchered wiring.  I wonder if it ever worked.  The generator on the car is not the correct one but fortunately the PO did get the right part when he stripped the 36 P1 decades ago and it has the cutout relay on it.  Lucky me.  No idea if it works though.

 

I guess the Dodge is not done giving up surprises because I discovered a brand new, unopened Fel Pro oil pan gasket set in a box of parts.  I guess the PO intended to do exactly what I'm in the process of doing but never got there.  Unfortunately I can't use the gaskets because the side strips have shrunk about half an inch, lengthwise!  I ordered a replacement Fel Pro set off Amazon this morning.

I spent an hour or so carefully cleaning the louvered inner fender on the driver's side after removing the Auto Lite 6V regulator.  It looks pretty good for 80+ years.  I'll post a couple pics later today.

AS harness installation time approaches I wonder how it was done originally.  There's a hefty branch going to the back of the instrument panel and I can't image that wiring being installed with the dash in the car.  OTOH if that wiring was connected to the cluster off the car I find it hard to imagine threading the majority of the harness through the hole in the firewall.  I hope I don't find any ugly surprises behind that instrument cluster.

In other news I did a web search for some part early this morning and ended up at moparmall.com aka Atlas Obsolete Mopar Parts.  Yikes!  I need to stay away from that website.  Far, far away!

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48 minutes ago, Spinneyhill said:

It is my understanding those shrunk gaskets will expand in steam, or is it water? i.e. re-hydrate them. They are just "wood" anyway, unless they are rubber impregnated modernish ones.

Water will expand the cork gaskets.

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The cork gaskets seem to be fine.  It's the thin, dark, composite material for the side rails that has shrunk.  Double checked it this afternoon - nope.  New gaskets on the way.

Removed the incorrect generator today and did more engine room cleaning.  Found a couple brand new battery cables that the PO bought but they're parts store stuff.  Heavy gauge but vinyl insulation, both red.  I'd rather ebay these and get a few bucks, spending that to get correct stuff from RI Wiring.

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Doing more cleaning under the hood and found this.  Looks like the block in my car was cast on August 12 (1935).  The car was assembled on November 26, 1935 according the Chrysler's microfilm records and the number stamped on the block is the same as that on the microfilm.  Three months seems like a long time between foundry and installation, no?

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I think most manufactures made many more engines than vehicles. The engines were put in stock and  randomly taken when needed. The engine numbers have nothing to do with the vehicle serial numbers.

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I guess what seems odd to me is that the engine block has the August 12th casting date but the cylinder head has a November 19th casting date.  Or so I thought.  Maybe the head was replaced.  Then again, the head has a large "DU" embossed on the top.  So many mysteries...

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Edited by Pete in PA (see edit history)
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The DU indicates that it was possibly a left over '35 head, which is probably identical to the later heads. Your car is relatively early so they may have been using up parts. There again, the castings are made in the foundry then shipped with other parts to the assembly plants or stations. I don't think that they were assembled in a sequential order using parts for each individual  engine, parts were probably pulled at time of assy.using what stock they had. A good many of those cast in numbers really don't mean anything except to the manufacturer. You'll probably see a number stamped in the right upper portion of the firewall. I have not found anyone who can tell me what that number refers to so it must be a manufactures ID number.So many mysteries!

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Oil pan gasket set arrived while Karl & I were attending ACN in Carlisle. It was hot in that sunshine!  Only 2 pre-WW2 cars we saw were a 1929 DB rumble seat coupe and a 1940 Dodge business coupe.

Gasket set includes 2 large o-rings described as "cylinder liner seals." ??? Any thoughts on this mystery?

We hope to have sump cleaned, the pan reinstalled and filled with oil today. Then we’ll remove the sparkys, disconnect the line to the oil pressure gauge, crank the engine, and see if we make a mess.

Watch for the video!

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Edited by Pete in PA (see edit history)
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are you sure that's the right set as I have no idea what those O rings are for. You should have the 2 side gaskets and 2 cork square strips about 4 in.long for the front and rear where the pan fits over the crank. They actually come up through the cutouts in the ends of the side gaskets. they have to be trimmed and you should apply some gasket sealer over the seams.

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Jim, I'm sure it's the correct oil pan gasket set.  It did have the side rail pieces and the front/rear pieces as you described but the o-rings were also in the package.  I assume they're for a much later engine, maybe a military application?

Karl and I did complete all the tasks that we wanted to get done today.  The oil pickup screen was removed and cleaned thoroughly, oil gasket material was removed from both the pan and the block, the pan hole areas were flattened, the new gaskets were installed as was the pan, 5 quarts of 5W-40 got dumped in, the spark plugs were removed, I shot some oil into each cylinder, and the engine was cranked via the starting motor until oil started to stream from the disconnected gauge tubing.

The starting motor was noisier than I think it should be.  Something sounds too harsh.

It took a LOT longer for the pump to prime and start pumping than I thought it would.  The engine cranked for at least 30 seconds, maybe 45 seconds before that happened.  I was just about to give up when the oil started to flow.  I'm glad I decided to remove the spark plugs for low load cranking.  At the end of the ordeal the starter was still cranking smartly and it did not feel hot to the touch so I guess it's working okay.

I did shoot a video of the event but it's 330 Mb so I won't be posting it here.  LOL  Guess I need to create an account and upload it to youtube.

Edited by Pete in PA (see edit history)
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Exciting is an understatement!

I'm trying to decide if I want to have an exhaust system on the car when it fires for the first time.  I emailed Roberts Mopar parts about a system and they said $350 plus shipping typically runs another $100. YIkes!  I don't need it FedEx'd to me overnight.  I asked if they would deliver to Carlisle last weekend but they don't attend that meet.  Don't blame them.  Their stand would get little traffic.  To save $100 I'd put off buying a system for a few months if I could have it delivered to Hershey for pickup.

 

In other news I was fantasy tire shopping this morning.  There's Coker if I want to drop almost $225 apiece for 5 tires.  Wow.  Don't know whether the BFG or Firestone would be better.  Any opinions on that?

Then I found Lucas Tires offers a General Cushion-Aire in 6.00 x 16 and it looks great for $169 apiece.  Anyone have any firsthand experience with those Generals?  I kinda like the tread pattern with the wide groove down the middle and would probably go in that direction unless I hear horror stories about them. This'll be later this year at the earliest.

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I would recommend having some kind of exhaust system in place upon first fire up, if for only to hear any unwanted and unexpected sounds that might be drowned out by the exhaust. I'm sure that engine may be pretty loud. Good luck!  Since the Coker's no longer own Coker tire or it's affiliates, I'm not surprised that prices are going up and unfortunately quality will probably go down. I think many of the tires are made off shore. just hope they don't go the way of so many auto hobby related businesses!

Edited by jpage (see edit history)
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I pulled the trigger and bought an exhaust system through Roberts Motor Parts this morning.  I spoke with Gary Roberts and had a nice chat.  They have a supplier that makes their systems and delivery time is typically 2-5 weeks.  I had hoped he could give me a tighter window of delivery once I had placed the order and he talked with his supplier but said he couldn't do that.  Apparently they march to their own drum and it works best if you place your order and wait.  I'll post pics of what I receive when it arrives.

Edited by Pete in PA (see edit history)
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