new 1956 Super owner

[ddiaz396]

Hi everybody!!! I'm new here.....just purchased a 1956 Buick Super 322 nailhead and I need help!! The car was in a shed for many years, after talking to the owner he agreed to sell the car to me. Took the car home and after long hours working on it, finally I started it!! Did a rebuild fuel pump, rebuild carburetor, clean points and with the help of an auxiliary tank it come alive......lots of smoke,bad idling, etc when it warm out star to sound better except for a rattling noise, I think , coming from the transmission. Also I had to play with the shifter before a could started it. When the car was idling a guess got in gear and almost run over my dog!! With the help of two towers I raised the rear wheels tryed to start it again and notice than the rear right wheel was moving even that the shifter was in N.........try other shitifng position and the wheels will responded but when a put it in N couldn't disengage the wheel.....and still that rattling noise.Something is happening, this car will not start if the shifter is on P or N.......The owner told me that the car was running fine with sometimes having problems with the shifter, Any idea what the noise could be? Was very low in transmission fluid( I put new fluid but I noticed a huge leak under the car. Ready ordered new transmission gasket, oil gasket, differential gasket I will do a total fluid change before drive the car. Sorry about my written english but english is not my first language. Thanks a lot for your help, Daniel

[Ttotired]

Your english is fine, I understand what you wrote

Welcome to buick world

The wheel turning in neutral will not be a problem, provided it is not giving actual drive, it should not be turning in park.

I have a 58 and have not played with a 56, but I think the gear selector will be relatively the same, there should be an inhibitor switch under the dash, mounted on the steering column that controls the allowed start positions, have a look and see if its loose, but it might be broken.

As for the rattle, I dont know without being there to hear it, but make sure it is not the starter staying engaged in the flywheel and maybe take the inspection cover off the bell housing and check all the torque converter bolts.

Good luck

 

 

[ddiaz396]

thanks Ttotired, I will check it tomorrow I did suspect about the starter, actually did go under the car and hit it with the hammer...tomorrow I will take the starter down and check and clean it. Thanks again!!! Daniel

[JohnD1956]

There are so many things that could be ratteling. One thing may be the gear in the trans for park.  If your shift linkage is out of alignment then it may be the trans is not going into park all the way and the gear ( the Park Pawl)  is spinning on the lever that should catch the pawl. That will make a very fast clicking sound.

 

If that may be what the noise sounds like, then one common reason the linkage gets out of adjustment is due to the transmission mount deteriorating.  The fix is to replace the two piece mount.  Some also say to change the engine mounts at the same time.  Then you can try adjusting the linkage as per the manual.

[ddiaz396]

8 hours ago, JohnD1956 said:

There are so many things that could be ratteling. One thing may be the gear in the trans for park.  If your shift linkage is out of alignment then it may be the trans is not going into park all the way and the gear ( the Park Pawl)  is spinning on the lever that should catch the pawl. That will make a very fast clicking sound.

 

If that may be what the noise sounds like, then one common reason the linkage gets out of adjustment is due to the transmission mount deteriorating.  The fix is to replace the two piece mount.  Some also say to change the engine mounts at the same time.  Then you can try adjusting the linkage as per the manual.

thanks Ttotired, I will check it tomorrow I did suspect about the starter, actually did go under the car and hit it with the hammer...tomorrow I will take the starter down and check and clean it. Thanks again!!! Daniel

 

 

Yes!! JohnD1956, that sounds right.......I checked the driver side engine mount  (about 1 year ago he replaced one of the engine mounts) and didn't look very good.... I will follow your advise and replace the engine mount and  transmission mount to see if this fixes the problem.....Can I see the pawl from under the car?.how can I tell if the shift linkage is out of alignment? I have the manual but it is very confusing.......any way to test it? yesterday I visually followed the shift linkage but I don't know what I have to look for,Thanks, Daniel.

[JohnD1956]

Glad you have the manual but I agree, the pictures on that topic are not very clear.  I don't have any pictures of simple way to explain what you need to look for.  The parking  pawl is inside the transmission, and not visible from the outside.  What you are looking for is a short adjustable rod but I would need a few days to review the section of the manual to see if I could help explain it better.  The main thing is not to make any adjustments until after the engine mounts and transmission mounts are replaced.  Once the drive train is back in alignment you may not have to make any adjustment at all.  Till then make sure to use the parking brake, or use wheel chocks to prevent the car from getting away from you.  One of the members on this board was run over by his 57 Buick and it took a long time to mend the broken bones.

[smithbrother]

WHEN are you going to post pictures of the 1856 Buick? 

 

That will be quite a site to see, hehe

 

Dale in Indy

[ddiaz396]

Thanks JohnD1956 , I will not make any adjustment. Today I used penetrating oil all over the shift linkage, transmission mounts screws, engine mount.....clean under the transmission pan (leak bad, already order new gasket). Got the motor mount today to replace the old one. I will no adjust the shift linkage yet. Also removed the starter to service it. Remove the gas tank and cleaned, put a chain inside and rotated and shake it, then poured apple vinegar (let it soak for one week) finally I will rinse with a solution of baking soda first and Pinesol.There is so many things to do with this car!!  and yes smithbrother..... I wrote 1856.....my mistake ,it's a 1956 Buick Super. Daniel

[JohnD1956]

Adjusting the Dynaflow shift linkage, as per the factory service manual, sounds complicated. That is not helped by the scarcity of pictures to explain which parts the manual is referencing.  That is why I would not endorse making any shift linkage adjustments until you know both engine mounts and the transmission mount ( 2 pieces) are in good condition.  Note, the transmission mount may look good but if it’s never been changed, chances are the pads have become detached from the steel plates of the mounts.  This will impact the shift linkage adjustment.

If your mounts are good, and you need to adjust the shift linkage,  there are two sections of the Service Manual which you need to study.  Section 5-12 on page 181, and section 5-21(d) on page 203. The adjustment mentioned in section 5-21(d) is generally performed whenever the rear bearing retainer is removed.  That usually only happens when the transmission is first built, or subsequently rebuilt.  So you should be aware of that section, but follow the previous section (5-12) for in service adjustment.

The first thing you need to do is identify the parts of the linkage the manual talks about, but does not show pictures of.  Keep in mind that from the steering column to the transmission, all the linkages are on the left ( drivers) side of the transmission.  Also keep in mind that there are two separate linkages.  One is the stator control, which is moved by the gas pedal linkage.  The other is the shift control which is the one you want to pay attention to.

On page 182 there is a picture.  That picture represents the end of the steering column, next to the steering box.  This particular adjustment refers to the spring which you feel when you pull on the shift lever in the car.  There is almost a 99% chance that you do not have to adjust that spring.  I would recommend you check the condition of this part of the steering column.  If it looks like it was never disassembled, and you have some spring action when you pull the shift lever towards the steering column, then I would leave that adjustment alone.  You would then concentrate on steps 6 and 7 of this section.

At this point it helps to understand that the shift linkages on the left ( drivers) side of the transmission operate a cross shaft that goes through the rear bearing retainer and  controls the shift detent mechanism, which is inside the rear bearing retainer on the right ( passengers) side of the transmission.  The adjustment lever is on the right side of the rear bearing retainer as shown in figure 5-81 on page 203. What is not shown in any picture (to the best of my knowledge ) is the parking pawl gear.  That gear is on the output shaft and the pawl (hook) that you see in the pictures contacts that gear, to lock the car in park.  There are no internal adjustments to the gear and pawl mechanism.  The actual adjustment to this entire system is a change in the roller ball that contacts the detent, which is ultimately reflected in the PNDLR gauge on your steering column.  That roller ball adjustment will allow the linkages to operate at their full range within the limits of the shift lever in the steering column. 

This goes back to those engine and transmission mounts.  When they deteriorate, that affects the position of the transmission and engine.  The trans can drop down, pulling on the linkages to the steering column, and then the shift lever cannot move to the new place it has to be for the Park position,  because it can only move so far within the limits of the openings in steering column itself.

I hope this explains things a little bit clearer.  Chances are when the service manual was written the authors expected the mechanics of the day to have already had some experience with these parts and did not forsee the day when  inexperienced folks like us would try to interpret and apply this information.

 

 

 Hopefully this explanation will help

[JamesBulldogMiller55Buick]

congratulations on the acquisition of  your '56 Super Buick !!

[ddiaz396]

.JamesBulldogMiller55Buick I love your car!!!! Did you restored it? Hope my look like this someday!! Update in my Buick: Found source of rattling noise!!!! After removing the starter (my God!!! how do you remove the top screw????I worked for hours........finally I used a "crowfoot" socket and little by little , managed to get the screw out) found the solenoid was rust frozen and not working........cleaned and oiled and now is working fine, started motor was ok. Is there an easy way to put the top screw back????? Also started the car (just for a little be) and I was happy to hear it running after such a long time!!! I got new points, distributor cap, spark plugs and condenser.......will do a oil and filter change.....started working in the body rust (no mayor issues here, only superficial) hopping have the car running this weekend. I will appreciate any advise for somebody that restore a 1956 Buick o similar model. Ones again....sorry about my written english , but Im from Argentina and english is my second language!! Thanks again, Daniel            

[JohnD1956]

Thanks for the update Ddiaz396, and thanks for the update on your 56 Buick. Looking forward to seeing some pictures.  It is one of my favorites.

[ddiaz396]

cars

[ddiaz396]

this is the 1956 super for restoration next.1956 Special parts car1956 Super

[JohnD1956]

Now I understand, you have three different cars.  Will you be restoring both Supers?  Also, are you aware of the differences between your parts car and the Supers?

 

[ddiaz396]

Yes, my idea is restore the two Supers.Both of them run,but the white one the floor is really bad and I will need a lot of time to restore it The one I'm working now it's in very good shape. Today I put the starter back and the car idle for about 10 minutes,..... very happy!! First time in three years......tomorrow I will put the gas tank back, it's cleaned and painted, replace the ignition parts(tuneup)and rebuild the fuel lines to connect it to the rebuild fuel pump and I hope the car will be running next week!! Also I need to replace the engine and transmission mounts, replace oil and transmission gasket pans( I will clean both pump filters at the same time). I'm very happy with the progress.....this was my first car in USA......Daniel.

[buick man]

Just curious, Did you drop the oil pan, clean it out, remove the oil pump & cleaned it out as well as it's psi spring and ball valve; Flushed the engine oil routes throughout the block with clean oil as well as removing the engine oil filter and filter mounting boss and cleaning it out along with it's psi ball/valve and spring valve inside of it  before attempting to start this hibernating engine ?  Good luck for what follows on your project.

[ddiaz396]

Not yet buick man, but before I started the car, I checked the oil( very clean!!) and removed spark plugs and sprayed some Mystery Oil in each cylinder the day before . Already ordered the oil pan gasket and I'm planning to drop the oil pan (also transmission pan ) this weekend......I didn't know about the filter mounting boss( I will now) How do I clean the psi ball and spring valve ?? will be visible when I remove the filter mounting? can i put it in my parts washer? or it's in the car? Thanks for your advice!! any help it's welcome.......this is my first restoration, so I appreciate any help or suggestions!! Thanks again Daniel. 

[JohnD1956]

The oil filter housing has a stamped steel mounting gasket.  I do not think it is re usable.  I do not know what others have used if they could not get the original gasket.  I would leave that housing on there.  Note, I am not talking about the filter canister.  That uses a regular gasket that comes with your filter.  Many times the old canister gasket gets stuck in it's seat, and unsuspecting folks put the new gasket on top of the old one inadvertently. This will usually result in a bad leak at the filter canister.  Make sure the old gasket comes out.

[Beemon]

21 minutes ago, JohnD1956 said:

I do not know what others have used if they could not get the original gasket. 

 

The complete engine gasket sets from FEL-PRO or BestGasket or whoever supplies a felt/paper gasket for the oil filter housing. I do not think you can buy them individually, but I do believe you can get the check ball out just be undoing the nut on the back side of the housing - without removing the housing itself.

[ddiaz396]

Today update: replaced engine mounts and added Mystery Oil in the engine and make it run for 15 minutes in order to warm it and flush internally. I will be doing an oil and filter change this weekend. Also flushed and open the power steering pump, replaced a hose and removed the second one to replace ( have to make the second one in a special hydraulic hoses place because the  7/8 end fittings). An old timer mechanic recommend to me to use IXL (this is an metal anti-friction oil) this staff is great!! he used in everything that move, engine, transmission, brakes, power steering.....Google it....been around 20 years and a little goes a long way......NO cheap!! I was going to replace the spark plugs but, for now, until reconnect the fuel tank, I removed and clean the old ones. Tomorrow I will remove the transmission pan to replace the gasket and clean the filter in the transmission pump. Any special tips for it ? Easy to do? Thanks Daniel  

[ddiaz396]

 I will replace the carburetor for an original Carter WFBC. Starting to take it apart for cleaning. Will post pictures of the carburetor rebuild.

[ddiaz396]

Today I removed the transmission pan to replace the gasket(leakage) and noticed that the suction pump screen filter (the fine mesh) was broken . Try to find a replacement in the web, but no luck......nobody is selling it. Any suggestions??? can I diy using a strainer piece?. Also, can I remove my oil pan from the car......today I try to remove but was not enough clearance , will like to replace the oil pan gasket and clean the screen pump filter. How can I do a engine (oil) flush? Read in the internet about using kerosene in the process. Thanks for the help, Daniel

PS : After 20 o more years car is running with original Carter WCFB.

[NC-car-guy]

You are making good progress! Sorry I do not have answers to your questions....

[JohnD1956]

The oil pan will come off if you unbolt the steering idler arm and let the tie rod unit drop down.  Note, you do not have to take the steering apart.  Just remove the two bolts holding the idler arm onto the frame on the passengers side.  Also not, this assumes your car has either no exhaust pipes on it, or is a dual exhaust vehicle.  Otherwise you have to take off the exhaust crossover pipe too. One more thing, I believe there is supposed to be a gasket between the pickup screen housing and the oil pump.

 

No answer on the screen.  Can't say I recall seeing one.  If I was going to make one I'd consider something that was close to what you'll find in the oil pump pickup.

[ddiaz396]

Once again, thanks John!!!! Yeah..... removing the two screws front the passenger side will work! I was thinking about that yesterday.....when I spent two hours under the car trying to remove the $%#@$%!!! pan........I was not sure it will drop low enough to have clearance....also, the noise in the transmission..... you were right again!! The shift linkage is out of alignment .......its the parking position........yesterday I disconnected the linkage and when , under the car, manually pushed the gear, the noise will stop.....but , like you said, before I do any adjustment , I will replace both mounts (why is such difference in the price? rubber quality?) I ordered the mounts in the internet. I hope that will do the job. Thanks , Daniel 

[ddiaz396]

removed fuel/gas tank yesterday.......spent all day working, trying to clean it up....after using vinegar(soaked in it all night and day before,   dish soap and hot water, marine cleaner from Eastwood , then used muriatic acid to etched and finally rinsed with lots of clean water. Tomorrow I will finish it wit EvapoRust from HF. Hope it will work.....also Im waiting for transmission mount to replace existing ones. Already fixed transmission pickup pump(fine filter mesh was gone)using the material from a dryer lint filter......looks good. Transmission pan was cleaned sanded and painted.

[Buicknutty]

Hello, I just found your thread. I have owned a '56 Roadmaster for 40 years (not as long as John has had his Super). I wish you well in the repair and restoration of your cars.

I read through the earlier posts about your trans leak but I do not see a mention of the seals and torque ball. The rear seal and torque ball often leak on these transmissions, and that is something you should consider. The parts are available, but it is a bit of a bear to change, as you have to undo the rear axle and move it back a few inches. If you have a manual, it outlines the procedure. Really not as bad as it sounds, but maybe I've done it too many times.

Keith

[ddiaz396]

Thanks Keith..... the last few days it was hard.....finally I almost finished the transmission mount replacement, only need to figure out in which order I must put the bolts and nuts back ( I removed the transmission cross member in order to work better and when I did it I found that both mounts were bad). Clean and repaint everything....also replace the pickup oil filter fine mesh(use a dryer metal lint filter material), Now, the only what I need to find out is how to replace the bolts and nuts (which one go first , the two transmission bolts and two nuts or the thrust mounts nuts???? will see tomorrow...... start removing some of the parts (heater box, ventilation motor, generator) in the engine bay and started to clean a paint detailing every piece. The rear seal and torque ball are not leaking.....when I replace the transmission pan(new gasket) I will see if still leaking. Will post some pictures.Daniel  

[ddiaz396]

Finally I finished the firewall paint....removed all the components (blower, heater box,etc)sand blasted, prime and paint. Also replace the transmission mounts.....took me some time because the thrust mount goes in one direction( I realized it after tightening  all the nuts and bolts!!!), Removed oil pan(thanks John for the advise!!) and I couldn't believe the sludge and gunk in it!!!Took me an hour to clean the pan!! The pickup pump filter was almost clogged....the engine is black with , I guess, carbon sludge....is totally black...I'm thinking to flush it....but I don't know,,,some time back I did a engine compression test and everything was ok...Should I do a engine flush?? 

Organize all the body parts to start working in it. 

[Ttotired]

There is a school of thought when it comes to just cleaning an engine that says to leave it alone.

The only proper way to clean it, especially the oil galleries, is to strip the engine.

The risk of not doing this is dislodging the gunk thats sat there for 50 years and it moving somewhere bad (bit like a blood clot and a heart attack)

So unless your planing on a full strip (I would since you have the front of the car off anyway) I would clean that screen and put it back together.

Personally, as you have the front off, I would pull the engine and check it and at least re seal it, but maybe rings and bearings as well.

You might be getting the idea of why my little projects tend to blow out into full blown resto's now

 

 

[ddiaz396]

done!

[Beemon]

Depending on how original you want to keep the engine looking, I would suggest Dupli-Color Ford Green (I believe is the correct color). I made the mistake of using Detroit Diesel Alpine Green and it came out too light, but I've heard the Ford Green is a pretty close match to the original engine color. You can also order the correct color from some vendors, but the Dupli-Color is right off the shelf.

Edited August 8, 2016 by Beemon (see edit history)

[D Yaros]

Since this thread is about a 1856 Buick mauve would be an appropriate colour:

 

Mauveine, also known as aniline purple and Perkin's mauve, was the first synthetic organic chemical dye,^[1][2] discovered serendipitously in 1856.

[ddiaz396]

Thanks Beemon...I will buy some.Sorry D Yaros, 1856, was a computer typo mistake.....I wish it could be correct. Purchased a new gas tank ...... the original filler neck was welded ,the new one(attached pictures) look like it need a rubber neck ....will make a difference?? or should I weld it?

Also the paint code in the car is C BB....Google it but I can't find the color...Anybody??

[old-tank]

If you don't want a 2-piece filler neck, you or any good radiator shop can swap in your old one.  I usually take one out of an old crusty tank, have it zinc plated and have that installed in the new tank with the original next to it to keep the angles right.

[Buicknutty]

The replacement tanks are somewhat more generic in nature, so that the basic tank can fit serveral different cars. I have not heard of any issues with using the rubber connecting piece, though like was mentioned above, it could be permently attached if you want to.

The paint colour code you refer to is roof, upper body, lower body, as if you wanted you could have your new '56 Buick in three colours from the factory. I cannot find my colour chip chart, but I think it is Dover White, roof, and Castle Grey on the rest. Trusting my memory is not always good thing, but if you google "1956 Buick Colour chart", you should be able to find something.

Keith

[JohnD1956]

The service manual has a picture of how the filler neck should be installed, with measurements.  But the rubber connector would give you a lot more room to make that adjustment as the tank is installed. If you are not going to have your car judged, I would not even think twice about using the rubber connector.  I would just buy 2 of them when making the first purchase, just in case you ever need to replace it in the future.

[old-tank]

3 hours ago, JohnD1956 said:

The service manual has a picture of how the filler neck should be installed, with measurements.  But the rubber connector would give you a lot more room to make that adjustment as the tank is installed. If you are not going to have your car judged, I would not even think twice about using the rubber connector.  I would just buy 2 of them when making the first purchase, just in case you ever need to replace it in the future.

With the rubber collar the filler end is unstable and would need to triangulated to be stable.  Ignoring all that it is just a cheezy installation.  Judges should never see it if they follow the rules.

[ddiaz396]

Purchased a rubber filler neck for the tank for the installation, sanded, primed and paint it with Eastwood Rust encapsulator. also prepared the tank undercarriage(WORST job ever!!!! used a wire wheel.....dirty job)painted also with the Rust encapsulator. Tomorrow I will install it, with new fuel lines. The hood in my car was very bad, was rusted with big holes, but I got a lucky break and found one, 20 minutes from home, for $350.   

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