CCCA Judging is Perfect!?

[Guest Chuck Conrad]

It's hard to imagine that everyone is so happy with our current CCCA judging rules that nobody has any comments. Maybe my judging friends haven't discovered this discussion forum yet!

[Guest]

ChuckHave finally discoved this venue..why not judge cigarette lighters?The new owner in taking delivery would not accept his car not working .If the restorer overlooks this item,he should be penalized in my view.In judging high -point cars it may be the deciding factor.Thanks.

[edinmass]

I guess I can answer this question as I am the one who requested they not be checked in the new rules adopted in Colorado back a few years ago. In the early 90's I was Judging a Lincoln with a wire reel type lighter. The reel brok while the lighter was on, and we could not get it to shut off. We ended up pulling out the wire to prevent a fire. If it were a regular lighter and a judge dropped it on your wool seat you would not be a happy camper. Ed Minnie II

[Shawn Miller]

Actually I think it is pretty close to being perfect. I have been in several other car clubs and if only I could get them to adopt our system. Some of the things that go on in other clubs mystifies me.

Shawn Miller

[Guest]

Ed,I realize "things" can happen,but it does not negate the fact of a non-working(and unchecked)item.In a 200pt. system,it gives the Judge room to manuever.In my estimation,high-point cars in today's world lose points on non-working items,NOT cosmetics.Thanks.

[edinmass]

It actually went in the same area as safety rules, fire extinguisher, car insurance, safety glass, and not checking lighters. I have 100 point cars as well as old barn finds just cleaned up, I disconnect all lighters. Thanks, Ed

[Guest Chuck Conrad]

It is quite true that most high dollar restorations lose most of their points due to small items that don?t work. It is amazing how many cars that look great, don?t run very well. I saw a beautifully restored car refuse to start because the battery was almost dead. Another really great looking car finally started (just before the battery was about to die), but it only ran on a few cylinders, filling the area with the foul smell of bad (old) gasoline.

In both cases, the owners had lavished huge amounts of cash on cosmetics, but neglected to charge the battery, or put in fresh gas. Of course, if they had actually driven their cars a little bit, this wouldn?t have been an issue.

If you look at a CCCA Judging form, the entire left hand side of the page deals with operation and appearance, with a heavy emphasis on ?operation.? I think that?s good.

For reasons Ed has explained, we don?t judge the lighter, but we do a fairly good job of giving the car a ?state inspection.? Essential items are checked, which is a lot more than many car clubs do in their judging.

[Shawn Miller]

In one club I am in they just have peoples choice balloting! what a laugh! and they therefore never check anything on the car. it could be locked up, but if it looks good, and the owner is popular, hey he gets a trophy. This is really unfortunate because in this club lots of guys work very very hard to restore their cars correctly. they also only give 1st 2nd 3rd, so since so many of the cars are nearly perfect you just don't have a chance unless you have a cosmetically perfect car. last year in one class I counted 5 cars that were above 98 points in my opinion, but only 3 of them got anything.

If you dont like our system go to some other clubs events, you will come back loving it.

shawn

[Guest]

I would not be opposed to have a year of Grand Classics with no judging at all. Just bill it as a "come as you are" event.

I know the Franklin Club has no judging each year at Cazenovia. They just have peoples choice and one other award I don't remember. A majority of the cars at their annual event are drivers, not trailor queens. They get about 80 cars a year.

[Guest Chuck Conrad]

It might be interesting to try a "no judging" Grand Clasic just to see what happens. If there was a good social program, it could be a lot of fun. The idea might even catch on. There is no reason that I know of that a sponsoring region couldn't try it. They'd have to get permission from the National Board, but I think that wouldn't be a really big problem.

Any volunteers?

[Guest]

I agree with Shawn and Chuck on this one. As I have noted in other sections, our CCCA judging evolved out of a whole different set of priorities from the "public car shows". Our judging was fully developed long before the car buff public, such as it was, would even be bothered going to our events. Our judging criteria focused on PRESERVING the big old monsters that most people felt were blights on the land-scape. We were interested in historical accuracy, and, hopefully, our focus within the context of THIS club, will remain directed to what a classic car was like when delivered to its original owner.

Of course we make a few compromises for safety reasons. I have no quarrel with that. Some years ago, a fellow brought a pretty..oh..was it ever pretty...car to a Grand Classic I was running. We were at a place where the general public wandered in, some of whom loudly told us this "pretty yellow car" should have first prize ( if memory serves..it was the first time I'd seen the spectacular "shine" possible with the "new type" paints. The door window glass channels were rusted out, so of course the cracked and broken glass in the doors couldn't be raised. Needless to say, we had a lot of angry people amongst our judges trying to decide how to take off for this "pretty" thing that was useless as a motor car. I was so "hot" about this issue, I jumped on a plane, went back to New Jersey, and raised hell until we got into our judging rules specific instructions that things have to WORK, and work PROPERLY in a classic, if you want that magic "100" points.

Now...given the potential fire hazard of smoking in cars, I have mixed feelings about allowing a guy to get away with non-functioning lighters.....hmmmmm..that's a "special case" I will have to leave to the younger fellows currently active in the CCCA. Personally, I've disconnected mine.

PFH

[V.Milke]

Not being a car expert of any type, but a car user, I decided to leave the lighter on my 1928 Stutz discontected the day I tried to restore the cord unit and got two short circuits just by twingling around the cord... these old cables are not trustworthy sometimes.

[Guest imported_41Kaddy]

I think the CCCA rules on judging and point averaging our beautiful classics is an intelligent and well thought out and fair process performed by well trained judges. I had my 41 Cadillac 60 Special judged at the Upper Midwest Region's Grand Classic in June 2003, and I was most impressed with their thoroughness and the quality of their inspection, and respect that they had shown me, as this was my first try having one of my classics judged at a national event. Also, my cigar lighters work, but for reasons of saftey, I think they should be disconnected.

Bill Podany

Green Bay, WI