"Best" daily driver?

[padgett]

Back then GM had a thang called a TBI (more of a PBI) or "Throttle Body Injection". Basically it was a 1 bbl carb with the float/jets/gutz replaced by an injector. It still had a butterfly hence the throttle part. Idle was handled by an Idle Air Controller (IAC)The Crossfire Injection had two of these on a neat looking crossram manifold. For a crude FI (and GM had built a real FI from 1957 to 1965 but was expensive) it was OK, a 2.5l Iron Duke used one so two on a 5 liter seemed adequate for a ded cam (pushing those engines past 4,000 rpm just went slower. Today my Jeep is redlined at 6400 and am looking at a S2000 AC1 with a 9,000 rpm limit). Thought the Crossfire was a Corvette exclusive but apparently on 82-84 F bodies also.. 

 

Major problem was that like the Rochester FI, no one knew how to tune them and like a stock Roch it only flowed about 500 cfm for both. (Mine flowed over 900 cfm but was not stock. Handy thing was that no-one knew what stock was. SCCA rules just said "or Rochester FI).

 

Problem is that it takes a tuner who understands how to program a GM Computer Command Control (Predecessor to a P4 and everything was on a 2Kb PROM with a 2 MHz 6809) & most people are scared of them. Not Fiero people though.

 

ps making those headlamps work properly is easy, Again Fieros used the same motors and parts are available.

[60FlatTop]

This week I bought a 1998 Chevy Tahoe from the owner who bought it when it was a year old. It was his wife's primary transportation, well maintained, and pretty much "show ready".

 

The real key to finding an older car is to find one that is loved. If it is obvious that the owner loves the car they are selling you have a good buy.

Bernie

[Guest Xeon]

Well between Thanksgiving, and that he still had work, it doesn't look like we'll be seeing it today....

[cahartley]

^ Buddy.......even at age 64 I feel your pain.......maybe even more....... 

I don't have a lot of patience for the stuff I HAVE much less waiting to for a new piece.

This being your first car I bet it feels like time has stopped....... 

[Guest Xeon]

^ Buddy.......even at age 64 I feel your pain.......maybe even more....... 

I don't have a lot of patience for the stuff I HAVE much less waiting to for a new piece.

This being your first car I bet it feels like time has stopped....... 

 

Well, I made it through the night and I'm excited again... He should be calling within the next 20 mins to take us up there!!!!

Edited November 27, 2015 by Xeon (see edit history)

[Guest Xeon]

Okay, we went to see it. He said he thinks it's a 1985.

 

It's pretty much trashed, but it looks solid. Paint looks meh but it's covered in mildew. Looks pretty straight, it has a wing in the back that comes all the way around creating a U shape on the back? Looks like it may need replacing, it has a hole in it.

 

All flat tires, to be expected. Doesn't start, but we think that's because the battery box doesn't produce enough power and it has no gas.

 

 

According to our neighbor, who owned it, it had an engine rebuild on the Chevy 305 right before his brother got it and it hasn't been driven a ton. I know I can't really tell if it was rebuilt, but it's not like he's trying to make money so I believe him. I can't see much where it is, so we're picking it up on Sunday and worst case is I throw out $100 on a battery and we get it home and it's all rusted out. Not much on the line.

 

 

Oh, can someone recommend the cheapest battery worth getting for it? It looks like it's a size 75? Not sure if batteries are something you should cheap out on.

Edited November 27, 2015 by Xeon (see edit history)

[Rusty_OToole]

You could borrow a battery out of another car just to fire it up or hit up the local junkyard, mine sells good batteries for $25. Other than that Walmart has cheap batteries. Even a cheap battery will last 2 or 3 years.

 

Do you have a mechanic friend who can help you get it going? There may be more to it than throwing in a battery and turning the key. Before you do anything check the gas, it may have gone stale. If it smells like gas you are ok. If it smells like old stinky varnish OH OH you have to get rid of it, or it will gum up your motor and ruin it. On a fuel injection car you may have to drop the tank and replace it,

 

If the hood was shut and the air filter and spark plugs in place, 99 chances out of 100 the motor is good. I have revived old cars that sat up to 30 years.

[Rusty_OToole]

Get an air pig or 12v pump and pump up the tires before you move it. They may hold air, you never know your luck. If you move the car you will separate them from the rims, game over.

[Guest Xeon]

You could borrow a battery out of another car just to fire it up or hit up the local junkyard, mine sells good batteries for $25. Other than that Walmart has cheap batteries. Even a cheap battery will last 2 or 3 years.

 

Do you have a mechanic friend who can help you get it going? There may be more to it than throwing in a battery and turning the key. Before you do anything check the gas, it may have gone stale. If it smells like gas you are ok. If it smells like old stinky varnish OH OH you have to get rid of it, or it will gum up your motor and ruin it. On a fuel injection car you may have to drop the tank and replace it,

 

If the hood was shut and the air filter and spark plugs in place, 99 chances out of 100 the motor is good. I have revived old cars that sat up to 30 years.

 

Well, we may just go with the $75 Walmart battery like you said. Or maybe even the $45 one! I'm 99% sure none of our cars have a 75, and even if they did if the trans am looks good here we'll be buying a battery anyway.

 

Between my neighbor who's giving it to me, and my father, they know quite a fair amount about cars. Especially older ones for my father.

 

I'm not sure how long it would take, but if I'm not mistaken it was driven down the highway less than a month ago so I wouldn't think the gas would have gone stale. Definitely will check though.

Get an air pig or 12v pump and pump up the tires before you move it. They may hold air, you never know your luck. If you move the car you will separate them from the rims, game over.

 

Yeah, we're going to pump up the tires. I really, REALLY hope it doesn't need tires right away. I mean just to get it home.

Edited November 27, 2015 by Xeon (see edit history)

[Rusty_OToole]

If it was driven less than a month ago the gas and tires should be ok.

 

Make sure you get the registration, spare keys, any spare parts or repair books owners manual etc. You have to ask about these things when you get the car, people often have 'extras' they don't think about unless you ask. If you don't get them, they will just be thrown away.

 

Chev 305 is a great engine for your purpose. Easy to keep on the road, easy and cheap to get parts for, has enough power and not too bad on gas.

Edited November 27, 2015 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history)

[cahartley]

 

 

 

Oh, can someone recommend the cheapest battery worth getting for it? It looks like it's a size 75? Not sure if batteries are something you should cheap out on.

 

NEVER cheap out on the battery.

I know it hurts to cough up for a decent battery but it's some of the best money you can spend.

After Delco priced themselves   I switched to Carquest batteries.

Also not "cheap" but I've had extremely good luck with them.

[Guest Xeon]

If it was driven less than a month ago the gas and tires should be ok.

 

Make sure you get the registration, spare keys, any spare parts or repair books owners manual etc. You have to ask about these things when you get the car, people often have 'extras' they don't think about unless you ask. If you don't get them, they will just be thrown away.

 

Chev 305 is a great engine for your purpose. Easy to keep on the road, easy and cheap to get parts for, has enough power and not too bad on gas.

 

I'll be sure to make sure before it gets driven still though.

 

I will. Although I think most of the extras are gone after all of the moves it's made. It's on its 4th owner soon to be 5th.

 

Yeah, It looked almost perfect. If it's the FI it had almost 215HP? That's quite a bit in a lighter(ish) car like the '85.

 

 

 

Now, I don't mean to sound "Power hungry" and I am only 16 so I really don't need it, but can the 305 handle the extra power given by new Headers/Intake/Exhaust/Cam or is it just not worth it? Obviously I wouldn't be doing anything big if it hurts engine life at all. Except maybe a new exhaust/mufflers.

[Rusty_OToole]

The 305 is a close relative to the 350 and is very easy to hop up and practically equal in strength. Suggest you clean the car up first, get it running, go over brakes, tires,steering etc and drive it for a couple of months before you decide  if you need more power or not. If you have the gas pedal on the floor wishing for more HP, and this happens often, it is time to think about souping it up.

[Guest Xeon]

The 305 is a close relative to the 350 and is very easy to hop up and practically equal in strength. Suggest you clean the car up first, get it running, go over brakes, tires,steering etc and drive it for a couple of months before you decide  if you need more power or not. If you have the gas pedal on the floor wishing for more HP, and this happens often, it is time to think about souping it up.

 

 

Oh, definitely. If it's running, I plan on getting it all straightened out and looking nice before even thinking about performance upgrades. Brakes and tires come first when I do actually start buying anything in that realm.

 

I just heard somewhere it's not the strongest block, so with a new cam/headers/intake/exhaust it could be pushed passed its limits. Then people say it's identical to a 350 in strength and can really handle upwards of 500HP without doing any damage.

[NTX5467]

(Coming into this "late", having read the first page or two)

 

Every so often, I do a "What if . . ." mental exercise when I see an interesting car on the road, even a Chrysler K-car station wagon, as almost EVERYTHING is capable of being upgraded to more modern technology and not really hurting the "goodness" of the original design (however great or less-than-great it can be, but that's what the upgrades are for).

 

In general, many good recommendations have been made, whether the 1965-72 GM intermediate-size cars (some like the Chevys and Pontiacs, but I lean more toward the Olds and Buick models as they are nicer cars and "not a Chevy"), similar year range Fords/Mercurys, and almost any 1966-79 Chrysler A,B,E, and C-body cars.

 

The Olds Cutlasses are very popular and still command higher prices than similar Buick Skylarks, each with their own unique engines and rear axles.  Many nicer non-hot rods are still around in good condition. 

 

Ford built some nice cars back then.  The Torino and Montegos were nice cars with good space and style.  Powertrains were reliable and adequate, but changing spark plugs on some of the "big block" cars can be problems.  My personal favorite, when they were new, was the 1966 Fairlane GT 390 4bbl or the Galaxie 7-Litre (428) . . . both 2-drs or convertibles and with the C-6 SelectShift automatic.

 

For the Mopar camp, the (as mentioned) Dodge Darts and Plymouth Valiants were very solid and durable cars.  Performance with the Slant 6 was good, for back then, but the earlier V-8s (318s) can have good power and performance (plus performance upgrades!) without much trouble.  The Dodges of that era were especially well-trimmed-out in the interior designs and materials . . . nicer than almost any other similar vehicles!  For the 1974 model year, they got "velour-ized" for a more luxury orientation.  Plus by that time, front power disc brakes.  In general, these cars tend to still be around, where many of the similar GM cars have vanished.

 

The Mopar B-body intermediate cars are also good cars, many with the 318 2bbl V-8 and TorqueFlite.  Of course, the larger 360 V-8 can replace it nicely.  As with the A-body cars, the Dodges were a good deal nicer inside.  Reliability and durability was good, too.  PLUS a huge amount of replacement sheet metal and interior items are available from good vendors (who supply OEM-level items).  A regular Satellite or Coronet will be less expensive than the Road Runner/Super Bee-style cars while having the capabilities for performance upgrades, even the 4-doors.

 

The re-design in 1971 brought some neat-styled cars, more of a wedge shape than a "box".  Might be harder to find as most of the emphasis is on the <1971 cars.  This basic platform existed all the way to 1979.

 

The Mopar E-body cars are similar, but only available in 2-doors and convertibles.  "COOL" is there, for a price.   

 

For your stated "requirements", I believe the mentioned GM A-cars and Mopar B-body cars would be appropriate.  Everything you'll need to do a good "refurbishment" can be had without much problem, especially for the Mopar vehicles.  Performance upgrades are there, too, if desired later on.  PLUS replacement sheet metal, in case that might be needed later on!

 

Mopar Perf has an excellent electronic ignition upgrade kit for those earlier engines, OEM-level, in fact.  Easy to install and make work.  For the GMs, some sort of HEI ignition can be adapted without much trouble.  That takes care of the ignition system.

 

The ultimate upgrade for the fuel system would be a self-learning electronic fuel injection system, which will have some requirements regarding the electronic ignition system.  Some are easier to install than others and one vendor allows the adaptation of the GM TBI system using "replacement parts" (rather than non-OEM parts from the aftermarket).  Some of the systems might have some other side issues, so diligent shopping/research can be necessary.

 

Chassis?  All of the GM A-cars and Chrysler B-cars ended up with front power disc brakes, so parts can exist for that upgrade (using salvage yard items, check the Scarebird website) or there is the later Wilwood conversion kits.  Even complete 4-wheel disc brakes can be had.  Add some good HD shocks for good measure, plus replacing all of the rubber bushings in the front and rear suspensions.  Maybe rear sway bars as applicable.

 

Repro wheels for those cars are also easily had, even new repro, but some good swap meets can also provide used items, just needing a little paint to be "as new".  Generally, they also came with 70 or 60 series tires when new, on 15" wheels, with some Radial T/A tires can complete the suspension package and look great too.  I have used them on my '77 Camaro (factory Z-28 steel wheels and P225/70R-15 tires) with good results . . . performance AND durability.

 

As for the "right now" car, seek out a 2000-2005 Chevy Impala rather than the Honda.  Good ones are still around for really decent prices.  Look for the ones with the split bench front seat as those interiors had better fabrics for much better durability.  Buick Regal GS cars are also in that mix, as are the Regal LS cars.  Plus Grand Prix and Olds Intrigue.  There were some interesting Grand Prix variants . . . The GTP, with Comp G package, the later GXP V-8, and others starting in the 2004 model year. 

 

"Choices", whether for the older car or the more recent one, too!

 

NTX5467

Edited November 28, 2015 by NTX5467 (see edit history)

[Rusty_OToole]

Not so sure about hopping up the fuel injection models. If it had a carburetor I would say sure, no problem. But I would hate to give up the advantages of FI.

[padgett]

Few dollars more but for $104 at Sam's you can buy a Duracell AGM 34/78 78DTAGM that could outlast the car. About 1" longer than a 75, has both side and top terminals. They fit my 88 Reatta.

AFAIR the biggest limitation to the 305 is small valve heads and a ded cam. Might also need bigger injectors but it is basically a 350 with a smaller bore.

Low point of the 305 was 135hp in 1979 so 215 hp (net) is considerably more lively.

ps get the VIN and we can tell you exactly what it is.

pps I suspect it has the 1226870 & 160 baud ALDL (late production may have a more common 1227165 P4) computer, same as 350 with a different PROM. Lots of tuner info available or GMTuners (plug) can provide a custom PROM.

ppps 85 is first year for TPI (tuned port injection) whch is a lot better than a TBI (throttle body injrvtion)

[mrspeedyt]

the money. what are you willing to spend? if the monies available...an old 65, 66 Mustang or even perhaps a 55, 56, 57 Chevy is something to consider . millions of these cars were built and still so many available.

Edited November 28, 2015 by mrspeedyt (see edit history)

[Guest Xeon]

Few dollars more but for $104 at Sam's you can buy a Duracell AGM 34/78 78DTAGM that could outlast the car. About 1" longer than a 75, has both side and top terminals. They fit my 88 Reatta.

AFAIR the biggest limitation to the 305 is small valve heads and a ded cam. Might also need bigger injectors but it is basically a 350 with a smaller bore.

Low point of the 305 was 135hp in 1979 so 215 hp (net) is considerably more lively.

ps get the VIN and we can tell you exactly what it is.

pps I suspect it has the 1226870 & 160 baud ALDL (late production may have a more common 1227165 P4) computer, same as 350 with a different PROM. Lots of tuner info available or GMTuners (plug) can provide a custom PROM.

ppps 85 is first year for TPI (tuned port injection) whch is a lot better than a TBI (throttle body injrvtion)

 

Wrote down that battery, will get it if it's in-stock, and if not I'll just get there medium grade 75. I won't go with the least.

 

So, for power, first things should be a better cam and bigger valve heads? Probably sounds stupid, but I know nothing about heads. Why I still think of myself as a beginner in all things engine.

 

 

Well, I forgot about getting the VIN, so it'll be tomorrow that I get it. I will get it tomorrow though. Even if I can't get the car home.

[60FlatTop]

On the battery, if you are actually in Alabama, try this link to the Interstate battery distributor:  https://www.google.com/#q=alabama+interstate+battery+distributors

 

Ask if they have any blems. I have been buying them for the last 20 years or so and very happy with them. They are a little harder to get in the last few years but when a pallet comes in they are usually $30-35 with an exchange. The local distributor is the place to go. A retailer can't afford to pass the deal on.

 

Where I go the guys are always friendly and interested in what you are doing (must be a good company to work for). My '60 Buick and the Riviera have Group 27 $30 blems in them. I had to go something like $80 for the long 6V in the Packard.

 

If you are young start developing the life long relation ships now. A small tip always gets you recognized when you come back. And there are times when a regulation might be a little less stringent when you are a know good guy. My son still gets surprised at the service he gets compared to most guys his age.

Bernie

[Rusty_OToole]

There are a million ways to hop up a Chev V8. But there is no one thing you can do that will make a significant improvement. You have to do several things at once. Like headers, dual exhaust, camshaft  and carburetor. At least that is how we used to do it, with FI it may be different.

 

 An old motor may run for years and give good service if you baby it, but blow sky high in a month if you hop it up. I have seen this happen more than once. Before you start your hop up the motor must be in top shape with less than 50000 miles on it, or rebuild it as part of the hop up process.

 

 You MUST drive the car for  a while, and do a compression test or leakdown test and check oil pressure before you think about any hop up.

 

I'm sure if you look around the net or in some hot rod magazines you can find lots of articles on hopping up the Chev V8.

 

Another thing. You may be able to pick up an extra 25 to 50 HP with a few simple mods. If you go farther than that you may be overstressing the transmission, rear axle, brakes etc. and they will require replacement too. What it comes down to is, a major hop up can be so expensive it is actually cheaper just to buy a more powerful car.

Edited November 28, 2015 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history)

[Ed Luddy]

A word of advice about those model year 305's. If it's not running properly, backfiring, lumpy, but low power, have someone check the camshaft. Was a very common problem on those engines.

[Guest Xeon]

On the battery, if you are actually in Alabama, try this link to the Interstate battery distributor:  https://www.google.com/#q=alabama+interstate+battery+distributors

 

Ask if they have any blems. I have been buying them for the last 20 years or so and very happy with them. They are a little harder to get in the last few years but when a pallet comes in they are usually $30-35 with an exchange. The local distributor is the place to go. A retailer can't afford to pass the deal on.

 

Where I go the guys are always friendly and interested in what you are doing (must be a good company to work for). My '60 Buick and the Riviera have Group 27 $30 blems in them. I had to go something like $80 for the long 6V in the Packard.

 

If you are young start developing the life long relation ships now. A small tip always gets you recognized when you come back. And there are times when a regulation might be a little less stringent when you are a know good guy. My son still gets surprised at the service he gets compared to most guys his age.

Bernie

 

I wish I would have read this before I just got my $80 Walmart battery..

 

 

There are a million ways to hop up a Chev V8. But there is no one thing you can do that will make a significant improvement. You have to do several things at once. Like headers, dual exhaust, camshaft  and carburetor. At least that is how we used to do it, with FI it may be different.

 

 An old motor may run for years and give good service if you baby it, but blow sky high in a month if you hop it up. I have seen this happen more than once. Before you start your hop up the motor must be in top shape with less than 50000 miles on it, or rebuild it as part of the hop up process.

 

 You MUST drive the car for  a while, and do a compression test or leakdown test and check oil pressure before you think about any hop up.

 

I'm sure if you look around the net or in some hot rod magazines you can find lots of articles on hopping up the Chev V8.

 

Another thing. You may be able to pick up an extra 25 to 50 HP with a few simple mods. If you go farther than that you may be overstressing the transmission, rear axle, brakes etc. and they will require replacement too. What it comes down to is, a major hop up can be so expensive it is actually cheaper just to buy a more powerful car.

 

Thanks for the info! I know for right now it's probably going to stay stock. Unless I really "Feel the need, the need for speed!" I'll probably just be getting headers and a new exhaust for the rumble. And even something like that will be awhile.

 

A word of advice about those model year 305's. If it's not running properly, backfiring, lumpy, but low power, have someone check the camshaft. Was a very common problem on those engines.

 

Will do!

[Rusty_OToole]

Be aware that headers and duals can mess up your FI settings. Talk to someone who has done a similar mod before you jump in.

[Guest Xeon]

Be aware that headers and duals can mess up your FI settings. Talk to someone who has done a similar mod before you jump in.

 

I know. It's not going to be soon.

 

 

 

Well, of course my neighbor is busy, meaning it's going to be Tuesday at the earliest that we can pick it up. Yay..