1931 Chrysler CM6 Schebler Carb Questions

[1931Chry]

Having issues with my late series '31 Chrysler CM6, seems to be running rich, and the engine "bogs down" under load/acceleration and at high RPM while in neutral.  I believe I need to clean out the carb, and potentially rebuild it?  The problem, the carburetor (original) is a Schebler T37/TX37 updraft, and information is limited.  Can anyone help provide some information or other items to query in regards to my Carburetor and engine bogging problem?  All documentation I can find points to the '31 Chrysler line having a Stromberg U2 Carb, but my original owners manual clearly states it's a "Wheeler-Schebler", and that's what is original and what I have in my late series '31!  Any idea as to why this is different?  Was this a late series '31 Chrysler change?  Any information/thoughts are appreciated!  See the pictures of the original owners manual stating the Wheeler-Schebler as the original carb, and a pictures of what I have.  

 

Thanks for everyones help in advance!  

 

1931Chry

 

[frank29u]

Unfortunately I can't help with your carb problem, but let me offer this.

 

The manual says to use Wheeler-Schebler for service, not necessarily that carb.  They could have been an authorized service for Stromberg.

 

United Motors Service did not manufacture items listed, but "provid[ed] convenient and economical maintenance and warranty service in the field for ....Delco-Remy, Klaxon, North East, Delco-Lovejoy, AC.

 

frank

[1931Chry]

Frank,

Thank you so much for your information!  Every little bit helps!  As I'm in my late 20's, and trying to carry on my grandfathers legacy with this car, I appreciate the community, and everyone's willingness to help and provide suggestions!  As I'm sure you know, Frank, information for this era of car is hard to find!  However, this has been a pleasure learning about and driving a classic!  I'm trying my best to keep everything as original as possible, especially since the car has been in the family since 1950!

 

Although the Stromberg U2 Carb looks very similar (which makes sense, since they are both an updraft type carburetor), the only other item in my original service manual that leads me to believe that the Schebler carb is in fact the original is the few diagrams that were provided, which identically match my Schebler carb, specifically the linkage is what matches exactly.  The linkage on the Stromberg, although similar, isn't exactly what is shown in the diagrams (see attached page 60 diagram for the diagram in my owners manual).  But I'll do some further research and see if the Schebler brand was authorized to service Stromberg.  Still, any information as to why a Schebler Carb was in my '31 would be appreciated!  

 

I dislike having my car sit covered, in my garage, with only the ability to start her up, and exercise the engine, without actually moving!  Hopefully someone can help me with my engine bogging problem!  It's a weird problem, where I know i'm running rich (the spark plugs are covered with a dry black "carbon"), and i believe my compression is fine (although information as to the compression PSI would also be appreciated!).  I have no problem starting the car, but when I shift into first gear, and start to let off the clutch, the engine begins to bog down, almost to the point where it wants to choke itself out (even with feathering/applying acceleration as is normal).  However, when sitting (i.e. in neutral), I can rev it to a higher RPM than what would be required of the motor for the initial movement in 1st gear.  The other caveat is there is a certain RPM, where when high enough (again in neutral), the engine starts to choke itself out, in the same way when applying "load" in first gear.  Such a weird problem, and I would love to have her running in tip top shape again!  As someone may ask, the last 2 things I did to the car was clean out the air filter, and put an additional 5 gallons of gas with the appropriate amount of lead substitute in the tank.  In addition, I replaced the fuel diaphragm, screening and seals in the fuel pump a year ago, and it is functioning appropriately.  

 

I'm thinking I need to open up my carb, clean it out, and reassemble and see if that resolves my problem?  Anyone know of a good carburetor tuner for carbs of this age in the Denver, CO area (as they will be much better with the process than I will be!)?

 

Thanks again Frank!  And thanks to all those who will provide future help!

 

1931Chry

Edited September 8, 2015 by 1931Chry (see edit history)

[carbking]

According to the factory Schebler literature:

 

Schebler TX-37 was used on the 1929 and 1930 Chrysler 196 CID 6 cylinder.

 

And

 

The 1931 CM-6 was a 218 CID 6 cylinder using Schebler TX-56 (early), and TX-65 (late).

 

The CM-6 also came with a Stromberg UR-2 carburetor (Stromberg 4-20, Chrysler 320914).

 

(Opinion) - The Schebler T-series is not the most "user-friendly" (to use current terminology) carburetor in existance. The Stromberg UR-2 (the "R" means revised), while not common; is much more common, with more available parts, and much easier to adjust than the Schebler (even if you had the correct Schebler).

 

Jon.

[carbking]

A bit more information (concerning your question about compression):

 

According to "Motors Factory Shop Manual", the CM-6 of 1931 should have 100 psi at 1000 RPM.

 

Other references talk about a "high-compression" red cylinder head and a standard head. Motors makes no differentiation in the two heads.

 

In 1932, Motors does reference the CI-6 with the "red head" as having compression of 110 psi, while the standard head had 100 psi.

 

Chrysler engines are not my area of expertise, I am simply "parroting" the printed word. Perhaps a Chrysler guru can offer more information on compression ratings on these engines.

 

Jon.

[1931Chry]

Jon/CarbKing,

Thank you so much for your help!  I would tend to agree with your comment about the Stromberg UR-2's being a little more "Available", and will look into these!  

 

I'm curious as to your information regarding the TX-37 vs. the TX-56 and TX-65.  My carburetor does have "65A" stamped on the upper flange (I'll upload a picture later when I can get home and get a good picture), could this potentially be the TX-65 you are referring to?  Odd that it would have this stamped into the upper flange, and then T37 cast into the body, even though they are all connected (and cannot be separated).  

 

Thank you for the information on the compression.  I'm planning on testing this before the weekend!  I don't expect to find much, but i'm taking the precaution anyway!

 

Thanks so much!

1931Chry

[carbking]

The STAMPED number is the identication number. As I stated earlier, the 1931 used the TX-56, which was changed to TX-65, and that one modified to TX-65A. You have the latest one.

 

The T-37 is a casting number, and meaningless. Coincidental that the TX-37 was used on an earlier Chrysler.

 

Schebler would include the letter "X" in the part number, which basically stood for "assembly number".

 

So the TX-65A would be referred to as a Schebler model T assembly number 65 modification A.

 

If you really plan on enjoying driving the car, I would highly suggest watching for a Stromberg UR-2. There are more than one UR-2, so do your homework BEFORE you buy, but I believe you would have a much more satisfactory experience and still be "correct" although not original (both Stromberg and Schebler were correct).

 

Jon.

[1931Chry]

Thank you Jon!  I've sent you a PM.  As promised (even though it is a day late), i'm posting the picture of the "65A" stamped on the upper flange of the carburetor.  This is to hopefully help someone out in the future.
 
Thanks everyone for your help!  Hopefully I can get her up and running soon!

 

1931Chry

 

[carbking]

Thank you Jon!  I've sent you a PM.  As promised (even though it is a day late), i'm posting the picture of the "65A" stamped on the upper flange of the carburetor.  This is to hopefully help someone out in the future.

 

Thanks everyone for your help!  Hopefully I can get her up and running soon!

 

1931Chry

 

Sorry, don't do PM's. Give me a call. Hours and number are in my signature.

 

Jon.