47windsor Posted August 15, 2015 Share Posted August 15, 2015 What is the RPM setting for the best operation of the fluid drive? Does the RPM have a bearing on the changing of the gears? Appreciate the help Bruce Watson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted August 15, 2015 Share Posted August 15, 2015 Yes it does. 450RPM with trans in gear and brake applied. This seems very slow compared to today's cars but is quite normal if the engine is in good shape, warmed up, and choke off. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
47windsor Posted August 16, 2015 Author Share Posted August 16, 2015 Thanks rusty, I will set the idle at 450 RPM. I noticed in the high gear it does not always shift down to 3rd when I come to a stop. I checked to make sure the transmission fluid was right up & there didn't appear to be any problem with the level. Could this be some kind of adjustment? Thanks for your info on the RPM. Bruce 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 (edited) The trans will not shift down until the engine slows down. There is a governor on the trans to control the shift. The throttle must be completely closed. There is a switch on the carburetor for this. Occasionally, oil finds its way into the governor and the points need to be cleaned. If you do this be careful, the points are soft silver. Just spray with contact cleaner or brake kleen spray, and drag a piece of white paper between the points. You only need to do this if the governor stops working. Edited August 16, 2015 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
47windsor Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 Rusty, Thanks for the information on the transmission. I had the car out today for about a 10 mile return trip. On the way out it worked as it should( I would start off in high gear) & I made sure the car had stopped and within a few seconds it would change back to third. On the way back home it worked OK for about half the trip & then even at a long light it wouldn't change back to third & it happened at two more stop signs so it does appear to be intermittent. Bruce Watson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 No 6V feed power going to and through the fender well mounted transmission relay fuse and holder, or the transmission governer points being contaminated with oil mist after years of not being cleaned as Rusty mentioned... both these issues will cause no automatic downshifts to 3rd gear below 13MPH. 2nd gear below 5-7MPH. You also need to check all of the transmission wiring harness for shorts to ground (bare wires) and loose or disconnected wiring. If you were to disconnect all wiring from the transmission the car and trans will act exactly like you describe... very slow to pull out of high and back into 3rd at a complete stop with the clutch in too. You need the 6V power and other items relay, governer, solenoid ect to be able to control the downshifts and upshifts at the correct engineered times MPH ect. Check all the above items and it will operate correctly. You should have a factory 1946-8 chrysler shop manual if you want to be able to fix it or have a shop be able to. Some pics .... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
47windsor Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 Bob, I appreciate your input as I am new to the vintage Chryslers & especially the fluid drive, when it does work as it should its great. So iam on a learning curve & thru your help & Rusty's help it has given me a starting point. Is there any particular supplier of parts for the fluid drive transmissions ?Many thanks Bruce 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Internal wear parts for the M-5 transmissions are extremely hard to come by and not often needed. .Only if the trans is banging in and out of high.Solenoids ,governers and interupter switches some times show up on ebay but also not often needed. 1946 and later Fluid Drive bellows and graphite rings are getting very hard to come by now too. But if the FD does not leak these parts last a long time. A new transmission wiring harness for the transmission is available thru Y&Z or Rhode Island Wiring. A critical component to the M-5 trans working properly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
47windsor Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 (edited) Hi Bob & Rusty, I spent yesterday with my test light & followed the instructions--testing the relay connections--solenoid connections -- the governor. I also checked all wires for any shorts or breaks. Other than a faulty wire between the coil & the relay(which I replaced) every thing else appeared positive. I took the car out for a long test drive & it is not downshifting.The only thing left is the possibility that the solenoid is faulty even thought the test light shows power is going to the solenoid? My information says "to check it take it out, rest it on the transmission case to provide a ground & with the wire connected to the terminal turn the ignition switch on & off to check the plunger movement.I understand all that but how do I get it out? I don't want to screw any thing up on the solenoid by not knowing what I am doing. any comments will be appreciated. + I just saw a large picture on line of the solenoid valve & recognized it was threaded on the bottom & with a few taps with hammer & & blunt screw driver it came out easy. I tested it & appeared to stick to begin with but after a few more times it seems to be moving out with every turn of the ignition key. This could have been the problem. would it hurt to lubricate the plunger ? IShould the plunger go back in when the ignition is turned off? Sorry for what may appears to be dumb questions but !! Bruce Watson Edited August 18, 2015 by 47windsor (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 The plunger will not self retract.. when assembled back in the trans it will be pushed back up by a spring.The plunger should snap out very quickly and with strong force... you should not be able to push it back in while energized. So with the solenoid installed in the transmission and the access cover still off... turn the key to on... do you hear the fender well mounted trans relay click and at the same time do you hear the solenoid on the trans click too? You should. Every time you turn the key on or off you should hear both click..one time for key on.. one time when key is turned off. Also when coming to a slow down stop at 5-7 MPH or 10-13 MPH (Approx) you should hear the relay and solenoid click... this sound means the solenoid is getting 6V power and dumping the transmission oil pressure so the trans can down shift when the car is coming to a stop.Bob 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
47windsor Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 Bob, Thank you once again for your reply. I will follow up on your info in the AM & let you know how it went. You don't know how much I appreciate getting this info , I am not new to vintage cars but certainly new the the Fluid Drive transmission & hope I can get it working properly. Regards Bruce 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 There is a huge amount of info on driving and servicing these transmissions if you do a search for Fluid Drive in the Chrysler and Dodge sections. There were a couple of long threads in 2008 that cover everything you need to know but the same info has been repeated piecemeal about 100 times. Do a search and chances are all your questions will be answered plus a lot of info you didn't even know about. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
47windsor Posted August 20, 2015 Author Share Posted August 20, 2015 Bob & Rusty After getting some time to work on the car yesterday, I went over all the electrical once again and all seemed fine. I followed your instructions & had the solenoid valve lying on the transmission for ground-- and turned on the key and as hard as I could push on the plunger you could not push it back in. I installed the solenoid valve & turned the ignition of & on & could certainly hear the loud click. I also could hear the relay clicking on the fender well ,in & out.. This Am I took the car for a test drive and it was functioning very well. Having the gear in high & slowing down below 8 MPH it was dropping into 3rd. Of course coming to a full stop it would do the same. At about 25 MPH I tested the kick down & it worked fine. So I guess you & Rusty have made me a happy camper guiding me along. Rusty I did look for that info you had mentioned about the Fluid Drive in the Chrysler Dodge section but with no luck.One last question??? The electric light test on the Governor was positive which shows there is power to the governor but does that also indicate the points are opening and closing properly? Many Many thanks for all your support & information Bruce Watson 47 Chrysler Club Coupe 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 The points have to electrically open and close to make the solenoid work.....But if oil or other contamination is on them they will operate erractically.Best to check them in that there governer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 I just tried to search something myself and found out the search function now is nearly useless. It will only search for one word. If you type in "fluid drive" it will only search for "fluid" which of course is practically useless. This seems to be one of the things loused up by the latest revamping of the site. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmiller Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 I think if you use quotations, you will only get threads that have those two words in that same order. If you leave out quotations, you will get all threads that include the word fluid and the word drive. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 Nope, just got the first word. Didn't try quotes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest markrush Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 I wanted to print out those posts on fluid drive in order to create my own resource, because I think I read through them several years ago. I wanted to file them as a personal resource. but I could not find anything with the advanced search. Very frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 That's progress for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest desotocustom48 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Can you guys tell me how to replace wire the control box on the inner fender as the previous owner unhooked everything to remove motor. I got 2 wires coming from carb and 3 coming from transmission. The box has 5 terminals. Thanks in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmiller Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 This may help. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Here is a simpler diagram showing just the transmission wiring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 The resistor and circuit breaker in the diagram, are in the box on the air cleaner support strut. On earlier models they may be elsewhere, even on the starter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest desotocustom48 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I have that drawing except it don't include the transmission relay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) The above wiring diagram is for the later 1949-53 cars with the M-6 transmission.Here is the 1946-48 Chrysler M-5 wiring....... Edited November 9, 2015 by c49er (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steelbreeze Posted June 9, 2017 Share Posted June 9, 2017 This is s very helpful topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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