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I've run out of time, need '42 LZ side hood trim. Help!


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The technology is there, but my head exploded when I got a price of replicating the 1942 Lincoln Zephyr hood trim I need. I know someone that has a NOS trim, but it's the same side as I have. I need the driver's/LH trim that was unique to 1942. They were terrible castings and none exist that I could find that anyone wants to part with. I ordered a replica, but it was cast off a broken spear making it really useless.

The price I got was from a high-end shop, but I need high end work and the first scan I received from my friend at Ford was not clean enough for CNC work, so I'm back to square one. I have one unbroken RH spear that needs to be rechromed. It would have to be stripped and metal finished before scanning, or doctored electronically to get to the true dimensions of the work.

The cost to scan and strip the image and create an inverted file to make the missing side is approximately $4,000 as there's a lot of manual time doing the stripping, so I'm told. I received a price of $4,800 to CNC perfect replicas, metal finish and show chrome a pair. The second part almost seems reasonable, but the first part is quite a hit.

The car is being shown for the first time at Ford's PDC employee show, but has 3 subsequent Concours dates this summer. Does anyone have a pair of spears for sale or would someone rent me a pair to buy me some time to do some further shopping? I'd pledge my first born, if I had one.

Help!

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May sound crazy but could you have a skilled wood worker / artisan duplicate what you have for the other side with appropriate changes to make it side specific, then use that as a 3D pattern? Maybe even someone sculpt it in another medium like clay? That's how they designed the cars the first time anyways.

Just some wild ideas.

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Kinda defeats the purpose of a Concours if the pretty lady is missing teeth.

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So how many years in prison do you get for that?

I know you want it perfect but what is your alternative? If the parts don't turn up you can stay home. Or you could go with the car not complete, and possibly pick up the parts you need or a lead to them.

I don't know how many times I have been to local events and cruise nights, where an entrant was approached by someone who had a car or parts they thought they might be interested in. What's to lose?

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So how many years in prison do you get for that?

I know you want it perfect but what is your alternative? If the parts don't turn up you can stay home. Or you could go with the car not complete, and possibly pick up the parts you need or a lead to them.

That wasn't helpful at all.

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Barry, as talented as you are, can you not think of a way to perhaps cast one in a mold? Maybe solid brass. Of course you would need to find someone willing to loan you their pieces to make the mold. How bout the idea I believe someone else mentioned -- about fashioning one from wood or some other substance for a pattern? Easy to say, huh, but not do?

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If I had a mold I could make a bunch, but a mold is just as costly as CNC and then you have to get a foundry involved. Then there's the failure rate and then there's much more metal finishing and you'd still have to plate it. With a good enough scan the replica is exact. You can't say that for repops. Most everything else required hours of finishing.

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"With a good enough scan the replica is exact". Until you send out for polishing and plating that is. There will always be variability depending on how hard the plater polishes it and how much copper he applies. Even the heat from polishing can slightly change the shape of a long skinny part. Were it our problem we would make a wood pattern, have it cast in silicon bronze, or maybe aluminum if weight is an issue, metal finish it and have it plated or fabricate it from bar stock. After you have a pattern the actual casting would only cost $100 or so, leaving plenty of time for careful metal finishing and fitting to the car before plating.

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I didn't say it was easy. Unfortunately we couldn't work to your schedule. But for the sake of argument figure $1000 for the pattern, $100 or so for the raw casting, another couple days for the metal finishing and drilling and tapping mounting studs into the back, then whatever the plater charges. We've done harder things. The bronze casting might weigh 5 pounds, which could be a problem. The good thing is that once on the car no one can really see both sides at once so minor differences left to right wouldn't be noticeable. I still think you will eventually find a usable original.

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I don't see how scanning gets you any closer to having an actual part in hand unless you are going to go the CNC route. The original pattern work was done without a scanner. Why not cast in aluminum if weight is an issue? What was the poor reproduction you found cast from? Couldn't it be repaired and plated?

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Your best bet is still a 3D printer, there are some companies that can make large format printing. You should be able to get a copy of the original print from the Ford Archives, this will make the proto-type printing less costly. Try this company for your proto-type.

http://www.quickparts.com/promo/low-volume-prototypes.aspx?gclid=CLzdk_qplMUCFUMV7AodvTUAsQ

The Achives web site is

https://www.thehenryford.org/exhibits/collections/Collections/library.asp

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<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings> <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings> </xml><![endif]--> Barry,

An alternative to create your missing part may be to have the part drawn as a solid model (Solid Modeling). In this case you can use the opposite hand part you have on hand to create the solid model and then it can be mirrored in the computer to create the part you need. Once you have the solid model a wax can be printed directly from a 3D model and that wax can be used to make an investment casting (lost wax). What this does is eliminate the need to make a physical pattern. By using an investment casting you get good detail and minimize cleanup for polishing and/or plating.. That is a lot of information and I will try to explain it in more detail.

The photo I have included shows a spark lever that I needed for a restoration project. The photo shows the 3D printed wax (blue) and the final aluminum casting after polishing. I created the solid model in a 3D cad program with no pattern to work from. All I had to work from were photos and some related dimensions on the quadrant assembly for the steering column. The solid model was created in 3D cad and scaled up to compensate for shrinkage. Once the solid model was created it was converted to an STL file. STL is a Stereolitography file and is a common file format used for 3D printing. The STL file was sent to a 3D printer to create the wax. The printing process for the wax is called Voxeljet. The wax was sent to the foundry to be poured in aluminum. Finishing required minimal cleanup and drilling a couple of holes. The total cost of making the lever was a bit over $500.00. Printing the wax was less than $100. The rest of the costs were for shipping and casting. Not cheap but it gave a good result and saved a good bit of time over conventional pattern making and casting.

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For your project I would suggest finding a CAD draftsman that can create a 3D model of the part you need. The machine shop you used to make Ruxton parts might be able to recommend someone to do CAD work especially if they do CNC machining. The model can be created from a factory drawing or give them the opposite hand part and have them measure and model it. Once they have the solid model it is a simple matter to create the mirror image in the CAD software. I would expect that the solid model could be created by the draftsman in a few hours. The draftsman would need to scale the solid model to compensate for shrinkage of the material used to cast the part. Once the solid model is created and scaled the STL file can be generated. This can be done by the draftsman or the 3D printer will have that capability. After the wax is printed it can be sent to a foundry and the part cast. Once the solid model and STL file are generated the printer and foundry should be able to give you some idea of cost.

Here is a list of steps I would follow to create your part:

1. Create a solid model in CAD using a drawing or scaling from an original part.

2. Scale the solid model to compensate for shrinkage of the casting material.

3. Create an STL model

4. Send the STL model (electronically by email) to a 3D printer to print the wax using the Voxeljet process.

5. The Voxeljet wax is shipped to the foundry and the casting poured.

6. Finish the part. Drill holes and machine as necessary.

7. Send to Plater.

I am sure this will generate some questions so don’t hesitate to ask. If you want to pursue this further I do have the contact information for the foundry that poured my lever casting. I believe they can also do brass investment casting.

Alan

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Have you tried Ray Theriault in CT - he goes thru a lot of these cars with big supply of parts, great guy, reasonable prices, and knows his cars! Always at Hershey and GOF. Has all the manuals and P/N's. Mixture of some like new, & some used you can re-chrome. I know he has many 42 parts, not sure if he would have that, but sure would ask. And other than the SOURCES vendors on the LZOC.org home page (Chris/Earle/Merv/Alan), go to the back of the club Membership Directory where all the 42's are listed, and contact the limited number of 42 owners listed, maybe one of them has a used-spare in his garage you could buy and re-chrome. Great car! Good luck. Paul

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  • 2 weeks later...

Check with your local college either in the art or automotive department they should have 3d scanning machines, I know the colleges around me do and some of the students will work up the 3d printout so you can take it to a CNC machinist and have it made, the program is the most expensive part.

i have a student making some old carb parts for me on a 3D printer and the program is transferable right over to a CNC to have made in aluminum.

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