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Bill to repeal ethanol mandate; Senator Pat Toomey


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“The sponsors claim the so-called corn ethanol mandate drives up the price of corn, food, and gas. The fact of the matter is that corn is less expensive today than when the RFS was passed in 2007.”

If people in this country would just take back control of our government from the lobbyist it would solve a lot of our problems.

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[quote The fact of the matter is that corn is less expensive today than when the RFS was passed in 2007.

But if it wasn't being used for fuel it would be even more less expensive. As would the price of meat.......................Bob

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OK guys/gals we all agree ..get rid of the LOUSY ethanol gas. How do we do it? Write/e-mail/text your representatives in D.C. (you know the ones YOU sent to Washington) and tell to vote for this bill!

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It's the last bullet point under "Background" that really says it all. The EPA has been issuing "waivers" to the fuel operatives for not using the specified amount of ethanol as gasoline use had decreased. It was this reason that many started to advocate E15 and higher ethanol blends, so they could then use the full amount of the mandated ethanol in (reduced) gasoline production. As I understand it, the EPA has been issuing these waivers for several years now.

The original amounts of ethanol in the legislation were formulated before gasoline hit $2.00/gallon (the first time). Vehicle production was rising and many of those vehicles were truck-chassis vehicles and SUVs. GM was quietly building a huge amount of "FlexFuel" Suburbans, Tahoes, Yukons, and 4-cyl S-10s which were "FlexFuel", with "a factoring" of the EPA fuel economy ratings of those vehicles making them, on paper, more fuel efficient due to their possible use of "renewable fuels", including E85. It all looked good, back then, but changed greatly several years later. Not to forget about future fuel economy mandated increases, which will mean even less (possibly) gasoline consumption.

Ending the mandates and allowing ethanol use to float with gasoline production is really the best way to let it happen.

Probably a good thing this bill's sponsors are not from the "corn states". Of course, IF they'd become "unstuck" from ethanol and better embrace isobutanol, they could still use corn and we'd have a gasoline that would NOT attack vehicular fuel systems (has had EPA approval for many years, too, as an alternative to ethanol) and do all of the things E10 or E15 was supposed to do.

Regards,

NTX5467

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At this point misunderstanding the point and purposes of ethanol is simply willful. Sorry.

Ah yes. The knee jerks in reaction. ...........Every time.............HAW HAW HAW..................Bob

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Some just won't admit how bad Ethanol really is.

Everybody knows how "bad" ethanol is. It's not an original thought. Some just will never appreciate that there are bigger problems in the world than making it easy and convenient for you to enjoy your Buick or for me to enjoy my Triumph, or the ability to use a vehicle for the lowest possible cost regardless of consequences. Neither are original thoughts as well.

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Everybody knows how bad this is too. Maybe if we pretend we'll never get sick.....:rolleyes:

Edited by Dave@Moon (see edit history)
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Yes, there are bigger problems in the world, and I'm sure there are forums for those problems.

This forum is about enjoying our antique and Classic automobiles, and things that make them less enjoyable are fair topics.

Thus, the issue of ethanol is a fair topic, since there's no upside to having it in the gasoline for our antique vehicles. We don't use enough of it to save the world, if indeed ethanol is saving same. It causes numerous problems, one of the worst of which is being unstable. Storage happens with old cars, and ethanol can't be stored for any significant time period....and so on, we all know the issues.

So, we rant away...and rightfully so...but it's not going away any time soon.....

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Please point out the positives in the real world of ethanol. We know the negatives. Lets see if they balance out. Also keep in mind the amount of energy needed to produce it, the damage to the environment from stripping the land to turn into corn fields(drainage problems and toxins / fertilizers, it's not all cow poop like dairy farming), Storage problems, the amount of product that goes bad and now has to be dealt with as toxic waste, The amount of parts that now become waste that have to be replaced or recycled which also requires energy, Loss of mileage, The subsidies that have to be paid to encourage it's use, I along with most others I think, want to know how it really weighs out.

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Yes, there are bigger problems in the world, and I'm sure there are forums for those problems.

This forum is about enjoying our antique and Classic automobiles, and things that make them less enjoyable are fair topics.

Some of those waivers, NTX5457 mentioned, allow us ro buy non-ethanol gas for our non-ethenol cars, weed eaters, chain saws, lawn mowers, motor cycles. I buy it for everything that may sit a few months. I also use marine stabil. And yes, I've written my congressmen and senators to

re-check the science of ethanol.

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Everybody knows how "bad" ethanol is. It's not an original thought. Some just will never appreciate that there are bigger problems in the world than making it easy and convenient for you to enjoy your Buick or for me to enjoy my Triumph, or the ability to use a vehicle for the lowest possible cost regardless of consequences. Neither are original thoughts as well.

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Everybody knows how bad this is too. Maybe if we pretend we'll never get sick.....:rolleyes:

Depends on how you look at a bigger problem. For a person who has just lost family members because of a car fire that is attributed to fuel that deteriorates fuel hose, cork, some plastic carburetor and fuel injection parts. It's a BIG deal.

The part that gets me the most after working for a major manufacturer for 34 years is that when a manufacturer has a known problem with a car NHSA or EPA or DOT is right down your neck right NOW to get a problem solved. When the government creates a problem there is either no action or no sense of urgency.

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Yes, there are bigger problems in the world, and I'm sure there are forums for those problems.

This forum is about enjoying our antique and Classic automobiles, and things that make them less enjoyable are fair topics.

Some of those waivers, NTX5457 mentioned, allow us ro buy non-ethanol gas for our non-ethenol cars...

I've been saying exactly that on this forum for 15 years now. It would be easy, a simple waiver for registered antiques allowing them to use marine or aviation gas, the demand for which would allow for a reasonable degree of outlets in most areas. Maybe in another 10 years it will be mainstream in the hobby, if it isn't too late by then.

Edited by MCHinson
Removed political comment (see edit history)
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This past week I proved once again that NE fuel is more efficient. 93 F150 that reliably delivered 16 mpg on gasoline for years. After this area went completely 10% ethanol at the pumps, the best that poor truck could do was 13.5 in normal 60 mile a day commute no matter what grade or brand of fuel went in it. Last Saturday I found a reasonably local NE pump and filled up the rear tank with 87 octane NE.

End result? 237 miles on 14.2 gallons for an average fuel economy of 16.7 mpg. 21% better fuel mileage. Not bad for a 5.0 engine in a 4WD truck with 200k miles. Since I'm in the vicinity of that NE pump about every Saturday afternoon, I know where I'll be getting its gas.

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