Classic car as first car

[Rusty_OToole]

My mind keeps coming back to the 79 Tbird. For $100 what can you lose? Worst case there are liens on it in Texas or you can't get an ownership for some reason.

It should be possible to run the serial number thru the DMV or ask the police if it is stolen. And find out whether you can get a title or not.

By next summer you could have the title, clean it up, fix it up and be ready to go for a very low investment.

This is another case where the neighborhood makes a difference. If it is a good neighborhood I would expect it to be a rich guy who just wants rid of it. If it is a dodgy neighborhood I would think there must be something serious wrong, like a stolen car, big mortgage on it, dead body in the trunk etc.

[PONTIAC1953]

here's the 1967 ford ltd

[cahartley]

If you're going after that Fairlane you'll love the sport steering wheel if you are on the tall side.

It makes getting in and out of the car a lot easier.

If my '65 Mustang wouldn't have had a wheel JUST like that it WOULD have.......

[mercer09]

Cougars dont have the following or value of a Mustang, but were actually a higher end car new. Rusty has it right with the slant sixes and 318's

they run forever and are great on gas. The old valiants had a push button auto trans on the dash that is way cool and fun to show off!

[Guest TheAtlasMan]

Eh, I think I would rather just have the Fairlane inspected by an expert. Will things like hood scoops, color, and fastbacks influence my insurance?

[PONTIAC1953]

a sporty car like the fairlane, mustang, plus your young age will increase your insurance rate, the insurance company won't consider a four door LTD a sporty car, lol.

[Guest TheAtlasMan]

My thing is, if I got the Fairlane, it's just such a good car in my opinion that I wouldn't "upgrade" until I had to. So I'd probably drive this car into the ground.

[cahartley]

Rusty has it right with the slant sixes and 318's

they run forever and are great on gas. The old valiants had a push button auto trans on the dash that is way cool and fun to show off!

I'm a total fan of straight 6's.

I don't know if there is such a thing as a bad one but I think the slant 6 is right up there with the gold standard GM "stove bolt" sixes and they are easy to get at to service.

It's an odd thing these days to open a hood and be able to see the ground....... :eek:

[Guest TheAtlasMan]

I just realized that I didn't really look into the craigslist post at the location. I saw Cleveland east side, and I assumed it just meant east Cleveland (which is notorious for frequent crime). The actual location is Mayfield Heights, which is actually a nice area.

[cahartley]

62 Falcon $3500 could be a good deal

http://cleveland.craigslist.org/cto/4607356360.html

Body looks straight as a pin. The seat is not a big deal, if there is an upholstery kit available you can do it yourself.

Better quit now, scanning ads can be an addictive hobby. The point is, there are some decent old cars out there at good prices. Something is sure to come along that will catch your eye, and not need you to spend a fortune.

That's a HECKUVA deal! Early Falcons are hot at the moment and that is a pretty car.

I took my driver's test in a '62 Falcon with 3 on the tree. I think the guy with the DMV took it a little easier on those of us who dared take their road tests in cars with standard transmissions.

I passed the first time.......

Falcons aren't heavy..........the 170 is more than adequate for city driving too........and you wouldn't go broke buying gas.

[Durant Mike]

Check out the body panels and trim on the car very closely. Take someone with you that knows cars a bit. Maybe contact your local AACA club and see if someone will go with you to look at it. Body panels are hard to come by for that model. Mechanicals are easy to find, but body and trim is not. The 1964 to 1966 Thunderbird is a real eye catcher, I'd like to have one myself, but finding one in your budget means lots of restoration. The good news on that car is that most everything is available from Thunderbird parts suppliers the down side like someone has said is if the electrics are bad it could take a bit of time to trace and replace the issues. You want to find a car that is the best for your money and easy to work on. If you purchase a car that takes quite a bit of work, you might loose interest and it turn out to be a carport Queen until you or your parents decide to get rid of it. Good luck in your find!

[rocketraider]

On a 40+ year old car I doubt an insurer would worry too much about hood scoops or color. They'll insure it by the VIN and a heavy Fairlane with a 302 would not be considered excessively sporty or high performance. Doubt you'd be able to get much more than liability and medical on it though unless you go thru a classic car insurer- which opens up a whole new can of worms because of your age. Most specialty insurers won't allow anyone under 25 to drive one of their insured cars. Insurance is a racket anyway, designed to maximize profits and dividends for the insurance company, so they use "demographics" to sock it to a young driver.

Atlas- find a car YOU like and the hell with what everyone else thinks you should have. If you're buying it and maintaining it with YOUR money and sweat, get what YOU like. A late 60s Ford (or about anything from that time) will be simple to work on and will be a great learning tool. Plus you will stand out in a sea of jellybean cars in the high school parking lot. Hmm- that could be a double-edged sword...

[tomcarnut]

I do understand the commitment it takes to owning a classic car, and I'm totally willing to make it. I know they're big, gas guzzling money pits, which is ok with me. By next summer, I should have $5000-$7000 to spend on a car. I've helped restore a few classics before (1966 Ford Galaxie and a 1967 Camaro SS), so I already know the basics. I was wondering, what are some good things to keep in mind? Anything I should really know? Thanks!

Atlas,

I will throw out another idea here. I grew up in the car hobby in Ohio going to local tours in the 1970's as a teenager going to AACA Canton Chapter tours in that area and Ohio Region Weekend tours all over Ohio. It was there I learned to love brass, Classic along with 50's and 60's cars kids my age liked. It was a great experience as I made great contacts with members and as a result through a member got several jobs including working on the Delta Queen for summer during college and internship with Nationwide Insurance. While my main interest then and now is the prewar cars, my first car was a future collector car a 66 Chevy Impala converible with 25000 miles, original paint, interior and spare tire in trunk. That was in 1980 and was purchased from long time member that had sold his older cars a few year before and used this for tours as it was easier to drive as his health declined. I still have my first car that was used in our Wedding, bringing my kids home from the hospital but mostly AACA tours for last 35 years. It now has 50000 miles. There lots of nice 15-20 year old convertible cars with low miles out there including Mustangs, K Cars, Chevy Chavlier/Pontiac Sunbird, Mitubishi Ecilpse Spyder(Had one of those for my daughters till it got totaled last year but fun car) These low mile types can be bought for $5000-$10000 and cost little to maintain. Since my Impala had only 25000 miles in 1980 and 50000 now, I have done only batteries, tires and brakes. The key is finding a clean well maintain car of this era. While you might now see the 600% increase in value, I have seen, nice convt from the 80 and 90's are at their bottom and may go up. By the way, I am still involved with AACA and local president with the Southern Chapter, Ohio Region. I travel on my job all over Ohio and have old car friends in just about all parts especially Northern Ohio. Let me know if you are interested in meeting some club members in your area. The side benefit is the help in your future career as car hobbist are from all walks of life.

Tom Muth

Cincinnati, Ohio

[CarNucopia]

I've have a different take on this which I imagine won't be popular. My advice is not to buy a classic as your first car. I say this as a guy who taught two nephews how to drive and shopped for their first car with them. Here's my reasoning:

1) Newer cars are much safer. As a new driver, you should surround yourself with as many safety features as possible. A classic will not stop as fast as the newer cars you are following. It will not have ABS. No airbags. It'll be horrible in the winter.

2) It's a bad idea to spend your worldly savings on one thing. It's an even worse idea to spend the money on something that will continue to spend your money. Old cars do that and they have no sympathy for the fact you can't afford the expense.

Sorry if this is preachy. You strike me as a smart guy. Seeking opinions on this forum shows you are resourceful and that you're being deliberate in you decision. I suggest you take that one step further and consider the practical aspects of buying your first car. You'll have plenty of time in the future to buy classic cars. Find other ways to get involved in this hobby and gain some knowledge for when you are ready for the big purchase.

[40phil41]

My son's first car was a 1965 Corvair Monza 2 dr. that he purchased in 1994 at Hershey. It was a low cost and very interesting car. We worked on it over the first winter and had it painted and on the road in the spring. He drove it summers only for about 5 years until he needed an all year driver. Sold it to me and I still have it :-). He'll have his first car back when he is ready for it.

Phil

[tomcarnut]

I've have a different take on this which I imagine won't be popular. My advice is not to buy a classic as your first car. I say this as a guy who taught two nephews how to drive and shopped for their first car with them. Here's my reasoning:

1) Newer cars are much safer. As a new driver, you should surround yourself with as many safety features as possible. A classic will not stop as fast as the newer cars you are following. It will not have ABS. No airbags. It'll be horrible in the winter.

2) It's a bad idea to spend your worldly savings on one thing. It's an even worse idea to spend the money on something that will continue to spend your money. Old cars do that and they have no sympathy for the fact you can't afford the expense.

Sorry if this is preachy. You strike me as a smart guy. Seeking opinions on this forum shows you are resourceful and that you're being deliberate in you decision. I suggest you take that one step further and consider the practical aspects of buying your first car. You'll have plenty of time in the future to buy classic cars. Find other ways to get involved in this hobby and gain some knowledge for when you are ready for the big purchase.

Atlas,

While, new cars are safer then old cars, old cars are safer and better in the winter than a bicycle or a motorcycle and most with four wheel brakes stop better than most large trucks of today. You just have to learn to be careful and know the differences. A young friend in the neighborhood was given by his grandfather at your age about three years ago a 70 Torino two door they had purchased new and was rust free from the south. He got it running and learned a lot about mechanics. He also decided to take the nice running engine out last fall and rebuild it. That resulted in four in and outs to solve some mistakes he made putting it back together.(Sidebar, on a Snappers Brass and Gas Tour last summer we saw Steam Engine that was used at MIT in the 1890's for students to take apart in put back together to graduate.) He drove it last week from Cincinnati to Table Rock Lake, Missouri for a car show near his Grandfathers Lake house. Ran great all the way down on route 66 and freeways and is on his way back this week. He is starting college in a few weeks at the University of Cincinnati hope to major in Mechanical Engineering. The Education he got over the last few years working on the Torino should put him in much better position than his classmates and it cost a lot less than semester of college. Two of my best friends I meet in the Canton Chapter AACA in the 1970's worked on old cars with their Dad's in high school, drove them in college at the University of Akron College of Enginneering. One is now President of a division of Michelin Tire and the other is high up on the food chain at the engineering firm Flour Daniel. I could go on with other stories of kids I grew up with in the hobby and continue to see on tours and Hershey including our AACA Magazine editor West Peterson who helped his now OSU student son with a rotary engined Mazda. They drove it on a tour last summer and hope to see them on our August 17th on our AACA Southern Chapter tour to Yellow Springs, Oh hosted by a recent Miami University Grad who also grew up in the hobby and got his first job in part because of it.

Follow your dream,

Tom Muth

Cincinnati, Ohio

[Guest TheAtlasMan]

According to everything everybody has added, I guess a good way to sum it up would be to each his own. I'm very grateful for everybody's input, and it seems that many different scenarios would work out. I really love the Fairlane, and as stubborn as I am, I don't think anybody could talk me out of it.

[Rusty_OToole]

Knock yourself out. We all had to learn the hard way, why should you be any different. Good luck with your Fairlane.

[dan at larescorp]

To give you another view of things my first daily driver was a 1979 Dodge Aspen Slant 6 with a 727 tranny. I didn't take a lot of advice on weather it was reliable or what else I could get. I just bought it. In two years I went through 5 transmissions (I'm sure it had a lot to do with driving like a 16 year old boy), 3 starters, broke the flexplate, calipers / mounting brackets, and a rear end.

All that being said if I wouldn't have bought that old piece of junk and been dead set on keeping it on the road I would have never had the drive to fix vehicles. That was the first transmission I had ever replaced. It is always worth the learning experience to work on an old car. On the other hand if your job depends on you or vice-versa you have to be prepared that things are going to need to be fixed the more you drive it. If this is going to be your daily driver you have to make sure you can get parts for it and fast. You can't wait 3 weeks for a part to ship and still keep your job.

Just some food for thought.

[tomcarnut]

According to everything everybody has added, I guess a good way to sum it up would be to each his own. I'm very grateful for everybody's input, and it seems that many different scenarios would work out. I really love the Fairlane, and as stubborn as I am, I don't think anybody could talk me out of it.

Atlas,

Please contact me at Tomcarnut@yahoo.com and let me know where in Ohio you live. I know some Fairlane owners and would to see if you are near some Ohio AACA chapters or VMCCA groups that are strong in Northwest Ohio. I know old car owners all over Ohio and travel the state on business.

Tom Muth

Cincinnati, Ohio

[Guest TheAtlasMan]

I thought it would be important to note, I only live 3 miles away from my school, and 1 mile away from work. So I don't necessarily need dependable transportation

[MikeC5]

That's good. So if you do need to do some major repair you won't be rushed. Be sure to take a good look for major (or poorly repaired) rust.

[GLong]

AtlasMan: try to get to Auburn Indiana on Labor Day weekend. August 29, 30, 31st. The big auction/sale/swap meet/ and CAR CORAL is there that weekend. There are almost always some good basic driver's vehicles for sale. You and your grandfather would enjoy a day or two at the event. I've gone for over 25 years.

Usually in the car corral the owners are with their cars. So you can ask questions and get opinions. It's a great learning experience.

As for the first car you mentioned: the 60's TBird: personally I'd stay away from it. I had a '64 TBird for about 10 years. It was a hog for work. It was a low miles car from Georgia, no rust, never wrecked. It was 99% original, but it had one thing after another: exhaust manifold gaskets. A common issue with the 390. And the manifold bolts almost always want to break off in the head. And THAT is a small war to repair.

The electric stuff is a nightmare. Voltage stabilizers in the dash for the gas gauge, took over 5 hours to get to the item, and several brittle plastic part fought me along the way. Electric windows always needed help. one thing always lead to three.

The simpler Fairlane might be an 'OK' car, but if you can get one of the AACA guys who KNOWS the model of car to look it over for you. This could save you a lot of grief.

All the other cars mentioned except for the no title Tbird would be great cars for a first car. That big Boat would be very popular at High School for runs to the DQ, or hang out in,, it will hold 6 people easily ! [and legally]. The little Falcon is a money maker, it would sell for more money with a new seat cushion.

And, If you can save the money, the best deal would be that '70 mouse-tang, with the I-6 Looks great, would be a ball to drive, and not eat you alive for gas or parts. And like Matt said: you'll never lose money on it as long as you don't wreck it, or let it deteriorate.

My first car? a '61 VW beetle rag-sunroof. with a lot of ground showing through the floors and inner fenders. I had to wear knee-high boots when I drove it in the rain: the tires pushed water into the car, then the floor flooded. Stop for a light and a tidal wave of water came forward, soaking my feet up to my calves. Had a ball with the car, it survived about 2 years. the rust eventually got so bad that if both doors were opened at the same time, the dash and cowl would drop about 4". It then took two people, one lifting on each door, or one on a door and the other lifting the dashboard to get the doors closed.

Good luck with your hunt for a car. I think you and your grandfather would enjoy at day at the Auburn Indiana event.

GLong.