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Is your PD a coupe or a sedan? Reason I ask is that the sedan windshield is taller than the coupe. . .

Have the measurements for the openings relative to the PD Surround.

PD at mid height 43" wide vertical at centre 10 1/2" surround is 42 3/4" x 10 1/4"

Truck mid height 43" wide vertical at centre 11 5/8"

Will try and get better photos of the firewall, inside cab back panel R/H Door and rear fenders later.

Edited by TomP (see edit history)
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Have the measurements for the openings relative to the PD Surround.

PD at mid height 43" wide vertical at centre 10 1/2" surround is 42 3/4" x 10 1/4"

Truck mid height 43" wide vertical at centre 11 5/8"

Will try and get better photos of the firewall, inside cab back panel R/H Door and rear fenders later.

Are those the dimensions of the opening or of the frame? On my PD two door sedan I get pretty close to 11 3/4" top to bottom on the outside of the windshield frame.

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Are those the dimensions of the opening or of the frame? On my PD two door sedan I get pretty close to 11 3/4" top to bottom on the outside of the windshield frame.

Dims. are for the opening that the frame fits into the other dims. of the frame are where it fits to the body and not the outside of the frame. On my PD it would give a 1/8" gap for the seal

post-72422-143142938221_thumb.jpgcourtesy:- countrytravler

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Edited by TomP (see edit history)
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Tom

I would say that your cab is a 33-34 3/4 ton or larger. The confusing part is that yours is not rounded for the steering column shaft.

All the trucks we have (30) all firewalls have the shaft cut outs.

Where I have it marked hood mounts, they are the brackets that mount the rods to the radiator shell to help to support it.

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Edited by countrytravler (see edit history)
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Think it's safe to say it's not a 1/2 Ton cab, but like you say Dave the cut-out for the column not quite there and I will check that out asap. Would the bracket top centre of the firewall be for the Rad support bars, as there are no brackets either side of the cowl as on my PD and the 1/2 Ton. The fixings for the front Cab/frame are inside the cab forward of the toe board, again no brackets on the firewall side.

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Second photo is of the 34 1 1/2 Ton K39x4 how does that look to you, I have no ides how they compare size wise.

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Edited by TomP (see edit history)
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The front fixings of the cab are further back than I thought, almost level with the A pillar, at the front of the cab the metal has been strengthened with some 1 1/4" x 1/4"flat bent a 90° to make a bracket from the floor to the inside of the firewall. Will have to get on to NC Industries for more info on the screen sizes because a PD Sadan looks pretty close.

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  • 2 weeks later...

While researching the 1934 PE range I was directed to one of JB's Allpar articles which mentioned " An interesting model available to dealers at announcement time was the Flame Cars, so named because of their burnt orange color (the factory called it Carrotee No. 3). The cars were unique." Just wandering if anybody out there has any photos or prints of these cars, https://www.allpar.com/history/plymouth/1934.html Thank you and good fortunes for 2015.

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It would help me if I had some photos of a 34, 1- 1/2 ton cab relating to the cut-out for steering column and the front fixings to the frame. I have found that the cowl vent is exactly the same as a PD Coupe. N C Components are looking at the screen surround as well.

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It would help me if I had some photos of a 34, 1- 1/2 ton cab relating to the cut-out for steering column and the front fixings to the frame. I have found that the cowl vent is exactly the same as a PD Coupe. N C Components are looking at the screen surround as well.

What shots do you need? We have several 1 tons.

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Hi Dave, happy new year, if you look at post #49 photo 3 my front fixing is along side the 'A' post, it has the single bracket in the centre of the cowl for the radiator supports and just a very small cut-out for the steering column. Do you also have any idea how much clearance there should be between the firewall and the block.

Thanks for your help.

Edited by TomP (see edit history)
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  • 2 weeks later...

Found out today that the shape of the cowl is pretty much the same profile as my PD hood, only had one side of the hood and no rad shell. thing that's puzzling me with the PE/PG being the last of that body style? Why would the hood profile have been changed so late in the day. Think I'm right in saying that the PJ was a retooled body design.

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  • 2 months later...

I think I have confused myself with the correct wheel rims for a PE can you please confirm which is correct, I only ask because in a recent post on the Dodge forum oval hole artilleries were offered for sale.

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Appreciate your comments, I will be needing 5x at some time, thanks

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I think I have confused myself with the correct wheel rims for a PE can you please confirm which is correct, I only ask because in a recent post on the Dodge forum oval hole artilleries were offered for sale.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]300343[/ATTACH]16" x 4" hub 5 holes 4 1/2" PCD [ATTACH=CONFIG]300344[/ATTACH]

Appreciate your comments, I will be needing 5x at some time, thanks

Wheel on the left is a 35-36 Plymouth. Wheel on the right is a 35 Dodge. The Plymouth wheel you have a photo of is missing the clips to hold the 35-36 style hubcaps on. The 34 artillery wheel center is actually two pieces sandwiched together, whereas the 35-36 is a single piece. My experience with the 34 rims is that they are prone to bend and also often crack around the lug holes. You could run 35-36 rims and with the caps on you cannot tell the difference except that the stripe on the 35 caps is closer to the center than on the 34. Attached photo is a 34 wheel without the cap on it. As you can see, the 34 hubcap snaps into a hole in the outer piece of the wheel center, via clips on the hubcap. As above, the 35-36 wheels have the clips on the wheel itself. Also attached is an original factory blueprint of a 34 hubcap so you can see how the clips are on the cap itself.

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Wheel on the left is a 35-36 Plymouth. Wheel on the right is a 35 Dodge. The Plymouth wheel you have a photo of is missing the clips to hold the 35-36 style hubcaps on. The 34 artillery wheel center is actually two pieces sandwiched together, whereas the 35-36 is a single piece. My experience with the 34 rims is that they are prone to bend and also often crack around the lug holes. You could run 35-36 rims and with the caps on you cannot tell the difference except that the stripe on the 35 caps is closer to the center than on the 34. Attached photo is a 34 wheel without the cap on it. As you can see, the 34 hubcap snaps into a hole in the outer piece of the wheel center, via clips on the hubcap. As above, the 35-36 wheels have the clips on the wheel itself. Also attached is an original factory blueprint of a 34 hubcap so you can see how the clips are on the cap itself.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]300714[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]300715[/ATTACH]

Wheel on the right also 1936 Dodge Car.

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Thanks for your replies, Scott your entry higher up the thread makes much more sense now, do you feel that it might be easier to find 35/36 rims and hub caps as I have neither. I do have a surplus of 33's but they are wrong for the 34 project, think there could be 3 spare once I've sorted the 6 I need for the PD. Thanks again.

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Thanks for your replies, Scott your entry higher up the thread makes much more sense now, do you feel that it might be easier to find 35/36 rims and hub caps as I have neither. I do have a surplus of 33's but they are wrong for the 34 project, think there could be 3 spare once I've sorted the 6 I need for the PD. Thanks again.
I think it would be easier to find 35-36 rims, which are also 16". The center recessed area on the 34's doesn't easily drain water as does the 35-6 rims so when you do find 34 rims, they are more frequently rusted out than the 35-6. My experience is that the 35-6 wheels and caps are easier to find, no question about that. I think the rims may have been marketed to other commercial uses as well, for example I remember in the 1970s all of the local commercial skylight companies had them on their light trucks/trailers. As I indicated in my other posts, with the exception of the stripe on the cap being closer to the center on the 35-6 than on the 34, they look basically the same. I will shoot you later today a photo of my 34 convertible, which I have 35-6 rims on with 35-6 caps, simply because of my experience with 34 rims cracking and bending. If you really wanted to sneak up on people, run 35-6 rims, 35-6 caps and re-skin the caps with 34 skins. Haven't tried it (yet) but I bet it would work. You would have to look REALLY close to tell they are 35-6 rims (there is a VERY small indented recess visible on the 35-6 with the caps on that is there to allow one to insert a screwdriver or other tool into to pry off the cap that is not on the 34s).
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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks for your comments Scott you have made it all very clear.

Another question for you, on my PD there are 2 timber bearers between the body and the frame but nothing on the PE, if there should be bearers on the PE any idea of what type of timber they would have used?

Thanks

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Tom--There is a wood stringer mounted underneath the body that sits on top of the frame, with small rectangular spacers of body webbing at the body bolts. Wood is made of full 1 1/2" thick stock (4 cm to y'all) and has a taper at the front and various cutouts to match with the bottom of the body contour. The three attached photos are of the stringer in place underneath my PE convertible, looking from about mid-body towards the rear of the car (just the one wood stringer, not the plywood you can see, that is on top of my body dolly). The other two photos are of a single stringer out of the car. These are available from a couple of people in the states, I think most easily from an outfit called the House of Tops in our Pacific northwest. SMB

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  • 2 weeks later...

Great reply as always Scott, much appreciated.

Next major problem to resolve is on the rear of the frame where the diagonal cross members join the outer rails either side of the diff, I could do with a photo of each side showing the lightning hole pattern . Most of the holes are 3"Ø others are 2.5"Ø and elongated 3"x 2"? My intention is to plate the holes and come back to near original, ( some butcher fitted a V8 along the way)

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Tom--

OK, keeping in mind that I have my fuel and brake lines run inside of the frame rails for safety, my 34 PE convertible frame is otherwise completely original. Starting from the center of the X-member and running back to the frame rail, each side has 6 holes but they are different from side to side. The 'port' side (driver side here in the states) holes are 3", 3 1/2", 3", 3", 3", 2 1/2", front to back. The 'starboard' (passenger side here in the states) holes are 3", 3", 3", 2", 2", 2 1/2", front to back. As you can see from the attached photos, the 2" holes are where the frame has a notch for the exhaust pipe clearance. I am not sure why there is one hole bigger on the other side, this is actually the first time I have noticed that. Looks like your passenger side does not have the notch for the exhaust pipe. Checked my 34 PE sedan and 34 Dodge DRXX coupe and they both have this notch. Hope this helps. SMB

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Thanks Scott for going to all that trouble, much more info than I had hoped for ideal I can put it back to right now (today). There is a notch in the underside of both the X members on the R/H side it's just the angle that the shot was taken.

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  • 1 year later...
  • 5 months later...

Been a while since I added progress on this one, I am now trying to find paint color I know what I want, back in 1934 showcase demonstrators for an extra $13 could be delivered in a Burnt Orange by Ditlzer Color Company of Detroit MI.  this was a Ditz-Lac Intermix Formulae IM-1384 Carrotte No.3 made up of the following tints

3.5 oz. Tinting White No. 337
2.5 oz. Tinting Black No. 37
14.5 oz. Tinting Orange No. 482
1.5 oz. Tinting Red No. 35
6.5 oz. Tinting Maroon No. 529
2.5 oz. Tinting Deep Yellow No. 42

The Ditz-Lac Tinting system required only 17 different tints to achieve the desired colors offered  Big problem is I have been unable to trace in interchange that has any meaning apart from a reference to Ford Carrotte-Red

The late Jim Carmine's PE pictured below is what I believe the color would be, most of the chips available have faded, also the Dodge but I am unable to find reference of it being a Dodge color. Any help would be great. Thank you

Jim Carmine's PE2.jpg

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Hi Tom

I have the DuPont recipe for Carotte No.3 from a paint chip card for '34 De Soto. I understand that it was used  for the New York Auto Show to debut the new De Soto Airflow. It is listed on the  accompanying DuPont De Soto Color Bulletin  No. 4 as a Show Demonstrator - solid color body and fenders, no stripe and brown wheels. Here you go:

 

246-30698 Carotte, N0. 3

11 3/8 fl. oz. 246-031 Dark Red (Oxide)

10 1/2 fl. oz. 246-063 Orange

3 3/4 fl. oz. 246-030 Light Red

6 1/16 fl. oz. 246-0091 White

_____

31 11/16 fluid oz.

 

Only four tints needed in this recipe put together by DuPont. on the sheet I have from March 1, 1934. Do you have any idea which paint company supplied Chrysler Corp. in 1934? Maybe the DuPont formulation would be easier to recreate!

Your picture of Jim's car shows a color that is much paler and beiger than my color chip. Mine is a lot closer to red oxide primer in tone.

Good luck on your quest.

Jim

Edited by 36 D2 Coupe
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Hi Jim, thanks for your input I will take the DuPont formula to my local guy and get him to mix up a sample provided he can interchange with his system and report back, your right about the colour of the chip being oxide but I have been lead to believe that over the years the have deteriorated. 

The chip I have below is a reproduction of a reproduction and we all know there's no better way than having the finished article in front of you. Thanks again for taking the time.

 

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On 2/5/2017 at 4:24 PM, TomP said:

Been a while since I added progress on this one, I am now trying to find paint color I know what I want, back in 1934 showcase demonstrators for an extra $13 could be delivered in a Burnt Orange by Ditlzer Color Company of Detroit MI.  this was a Ditz-Lac Intermix Formulae IM-1384 Carrotte No.3 made up of the following tints

3.5 oz. Tinting White No. 337
2.5 oz. Tinting Black No. 37
14.5 oz. Tinting Orange No. 482
1.5 oz. Tinting Red No. 35
6.5 oz. Tinting Maroon No. 529
2.5 oz. Tinting Deep Yellow No. 42

The Ditz-Lac Tinting system required only 17 different tints to achieve the desired colors offered  Big problem is I have been unable to trace in interchange that has any meaning apart from a reference to Ford Carrotte-Red

The late Jim Carmine's PE pictured below is what I believe the color would be, most of the chips available have faded, also the Dodge but I am unable to find reference of it being a Dodge color. Any help would be great. Thank you

Jim Carmine's PE2.jpg

PE Flame-Colored Demonstrator.jpg

Pe Paint Chip.png

1934dodgedrcoupe.jpg

34 Dodge coupe I have the 4 door model Dr down stairs, exact same color, the name of that color is Golden Beige 

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Thanks knobless plenty of reference to Golden Beige/ Tan but it makes me wonder if I might be pursuing the wrong path, as Jim said up the page a bit his chip shows more red than gold. I am lead to believe from a very knowledgeable source the Carrotte No.3 was a Burnt Orange Inter-mix 1384. where Golden Beige and Golden Tan are Inter-mix 1518 (PPG IM 1267 DuPont 202-31336) Carrotte No.3 doesn't get listed any where else other than Jim's entry for DuPont 246-30698 which I am still waiting for my paint shop to try and make a sample.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Some of you will be aware I have a problem determining the actual colour of the 1934 PE Flame cars IM1384 Carrotte No.3 , also found the DeSoto equivalent again a 1934 colour. Taken a while for my paint man to come up with a sample and here it is. No way of knowing if it's correct but at least it a start.

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Edited by TomP (see edit history)
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Well Tom, that sample looks like a very good beginning. I would say that it's close enough to the chip. And it would make a very handsome colour on your '34 PE. You won't meet that one coming down the street. The nice part is that it's a correct colour for your car. I like it!

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Thanks for your encouragement Jim, it has a little metallic in it for good measure, I think your chip looks closer than mine. The plan is to keep the fenders Black but that could change nearer the time.

I'm pleased, which all that matters.

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Oh dear not over the chip problem yet, needs an expert, 1st photo in daylight, 2nd in shadow, another trip to the paint man.  I wonder if the background colour has anything to do with it. Who said you won't see another one coming down the street.

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Edited by TomP
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Tom,

Looking good.

Black fenders are a personal preference as are side mounts verses rear mounted spares. On my '33 Plymouth I wanted to accent the sweeping new teardrop design. Side mounts seemed to interrupt the visual flow as the eyes move taking in the view. Black fenders can do the same on a car with lighter colors. The rear mounted spare tire covers showing a hint of the rim color and chrome hubcap also support this visual. By 1933 most art and color departments at the big three figured out that engineers shouldn't decide these things but artists and marketers instead. By '33 any dealer would paint fenders to match body color on the lower priced cars like Plymouth and Chevy.

Again this is a personal preference and not intended to start a forum riot.

My 1931 Chevrolet six wheel sedan is a little boxier and supports side mounts and black fenders. The tire covers are sheet metal and painted black.

Pick up trucks have a fender spare and look great with color or black fenders. I like the sweeping lines of your 34 pickup and think it would look great either way.

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