Confused on Definitions

[Guest LunchBox868]

Can someone please clarify something for me? Please and thanks

1. What is the definition of an "Antique" car?

2. What is the definition of a "Vintage" car?

3. What is the definition of a "Classic" car?

I'm confused

[joe_padavano]

Can someone please clarify something for me? Please and thanks

1. What is the definition of an "Antique" car?

2. What is the definition of a "Vintage" car?

3. What is the definition of a "Classic" car?

I'm confused

You're confused because there are no "legal" definitions, and these terms are mis-used by most people. State DMVs do define "antique" based on age, typically 25 model years old, but that too can vary by state. That's a narrow application of "antique", since there are few people who consider a 1989 Cutlass Ciera station wagon to be an "antique" car (this came up recently at an orphan car tour, thus my sensitivity to it). The Classic Car Club of America has a specific definition of "classic" and a specific list of cars that it considers classics. Again, the term is mis-used by most people. "Vintage" has no set definition.

[MCHinson]

Welcome to the AACA Discussion Forum.

Off the top of my head with very little thought...

For AACA purposes an "Antique" car is a car that is 25 years old.

"Vintage" is a term often used to indicate an old car but I am not familiar with an specific age as it is sort of a generic term.

"Classic" (with a Capital C) should refer to a car designated as such by the Classic Car Club of America. Using that term for other cars often results in major arguments.

"classic" is another generic term that lots of people use to refer to all sorts of antique, Classic, Vintage, Collector, and other old cars. Use of this term usually results in major arguments among "Classic" car owners about why the car so described is not a "Classic".

[Guest]

Welcome to the AACA Discussion Forum.

Off the top of my head with very little thought...

For AACA purposes an "Antique" car is a car that is 25 years old.

"Vintage" is a term often used to indicate an old car but I am not familiar with an specific age as it is sort of a generic term.

"Classic" (with a Capital C) should refer to a car designated as such by the Classic Car Club of America. Using that term for other cars often results in major arguments.

"classic" is another generic term that lots of people use to refer to all sorts of antique, Classic, Vintage, Collector, and other old cars. Use of this term usually results in major arguments among "Classic" car owners about why the car so described is not a "Classic".

What is said above is my understanding as well. I would only add that I also use the term "collector" when describing a car that is newer than 25 years. There are some new cars out there that need some recognition as to their rarity or specialness even when they are a relatively a new car.

I should also like to say having a Magazine like Hemmings "Classic Car" only adds to the confusion to the outsider looking into the hobby because Hemmings " Classic Car " magazine rarely features ( I can't even remember if they have at all and I've subscribed for many years ) a classic car.

Edited June 10, 2014 by helfen (see edit history)

[Guest LunchBox868]

Thank you for the responses!

If Vintage doesn't have a set definition, what is the most popular version of it? I.e. what do people tend to use it to describe?

[Guest LunchBox868]

What about "Street Rod" vs "Hot Rod?"

How would you define those?

Please and thanks =)

[Guest]

What about "Street Rod" vs "Hot Rod?"

How would you define those?

Please and thanks =)

They are not antiques, classic, or vintage cars to be sure. They are just what they say they are.

A street rod is a hot rod that is legal to be driven on the street. A resto-mod is a car ( usually from the muscle car era ) is a car modified to the owner or builders taste, like taking a factory stock 64 Olds 442, adding disc brakes, modifying a suspension, adding a 400, 425, or 455 engine, different color or interior than what came with the car when it was new. A resto- mod car to me or my insurance co. means a modified used car.

[60FlatTop]

In 1970 Special Interest Autos were coined by Hemmings Motor News in their sister publication with that name. At the time there were few American periodicals or books that dealt with the general field of collector cars. Hardbound were Motor or McGraw-Hill and most books came from the UK. That is where the "Veteran & Vintage" automobile terms came from. Other than the marque clubs and AACA there wasn't much around. A lot of research was done through letters to other owners.

From 1960 into to early 1970's a car under 25 years old was just a car. And if it was over 25 years old the die hard collectors would strip out anything that wasn't a convertible for parts. So definitions only came to the masses after the ACD Club had a little auction in 1974 and launched a revolution. Then every salesman and huckster had a classic for sale.

Today some cars are recognized as having a hobbyist following. I have a 19 year old Chevy Impala SS that is recognized and insured through J. C. Taylor. It falls under the limitations of collector car insurance and encourages me to save it. In about 5 years it will be an antique.

I remember buying my 1964 Buick Riviera when it was 15 and I was 30. It seemed like eons before that car would be considered an antique. I still have it.

Bernie

[Restorer32]

Sadly big C "Classic" is becoming less and less relevant as time goes by.

[Rusty_OToole]

An "antique" is supposed to be from the early, pioneering days of automobiles. A time when they were the toys of the rich and mechanically inclined, and most people had never rode in a car let alone owned one.

The cutoff date is 1915. By that time cars were a common, everyday thing.

Classics are supposed to be the finest cars of their time, usually hand built luxury cars, distinguished by their quality, performance, or general superiority to run of the mill, mass produced cars.

The time period for these cars, is 1925 to 1941.

Vintage, as a term for cars, comes from England. It seems to refer to interesting or unusual cars of the pre WW2 period.

These terms are widely used and misused, and can mean almost anything to someone. I'm sure someone is about to make a monkey out of me by "proving" that the above definitions are wrong. The laugh is on him, I know they don't hold water, they are not some law graven in stone.

Now if you want to enter show judging at an antique car show or classic car show I am sure the antique car club and classic car club will have an exact definition.

[Guest AlCapone]

The only time a definition means something is when the insurance company is setting premiums. Google the insurance companies web site. At car local shows the definitions are redundant. If entering a car at a National event it will likely be stated in the entry rules. Wayne

[joe_padavano]

The only time a definition means something is when the insurance company is setting premiums. Google the insurance companies web site. At car local shows the definitions are redundant. If entering a car at a National event it will likely be stated in the entry rules. Wayne

I would argue that there are TWO times when the definition matters. One is the above-mentioned insurance company interaction. The other is with the DMV.

[60FlatTop]

The insurance company and the New York State DMV say my '94 Impala is an antique. I have possession of the document. It gets better. I got the senior citizen discount at lunch today. I plan to live another 40-50 years so I am looking at cars built in the early 2000's with collector potential.

What makes it great is that it is an evolving and adaptable hobby.

The next car may very likely be a 2003-04 Lincoln Town Car in black. Although originality would suffer, a German W-12 begs to go into one of those cars. A Lincoln just needs a 12.

Bernie

[Guest AlCapone]

I would argue that there are TWO times when the definition matters. One is the above-mentioned insurance company interaction. The other is with the DMV.

Amen, Joe !

Wayne

[Binger]

What about "Street Rod" vs "Hot Rod?"

How would you define those?

Please and thanks =)

The Fellas over on the HAMB would define a street rod as a modified old car with modern additions like mustang II IFS, modern fuel injected engines, Air conditioning, disc brakes and lots of fancy billet parts. as for Hot rod they like to use the term "Traditional Hot Rod" as a pre 1965 modified car using "period correct parts." A lot of grey area there. It would be hard to call my '29 A street rod because I am using a warmed up A engine using all pre 1960 parts but I am still using a modern T-5 transmission in it. When it all comes down to it they are all labels and are all relative. By definition a 1985 Honda civic is considered an antique but I have a hard time calling it anything other than a "used car." Call it what you like. Welcome to the forum!

[Guest]

The Fellas over on the HAMB would define a street rod as a modified old car with modern additions like mustang II IFS, modern fuel injected engines, Air conditioning, disc brakes and lots of fancy billet parts. as for Hot rod they like to use the term "Traditional Hot Rod" as a pre 1965 modified car using "period correct parts." A lot of grey area there. It would be hard to call my '29 A street rod because I am using a warmed up A engine using all pre 1960 parts but I am still using a modern T-5 transmission in it. When it all comes down to it they are all labels and are all relative. By definition a 1985 Honda civic is considered an antique but I have a hard time calling it anything other than a "used car." Call it what you like. Welcome to the forum!

Picked this off the HAMB;

Hot Rods and Street Rods- whats' the diff?

On a Hot Rod, the focal point is usually the engine. On a Street Rod, the engine may be detailed to the max, but it's there to be a reliable mode of motivation and nothing else. True, a SBC crate motor has about eight fold of an original Model A four banger's horse power, but it just doesn't have the balls that a home built 283 or 327 has. Sure you can buy those adaptors to screw a set of seven fins on those center bolt heads, and it helps, but it's not the same.

Street Rods encorporate all the creature comforts of a modern passenger car, i.e. A/C, P/W, P/S, PDB and the like. You're considered a high rankin' Oakie in my neighborhood if your Hot Rod has a radio.

Kind of reminds me of people who want to add all the comforts of a new car (stereo,cd, A/C, 12V system plus alternator ) to a genuine antique car. Half the pleasure is driving a vehicle like it was when new!

[Guest Bob Call]

There is no "a" in Okie, thank you.

An Okie

[Guest]

There is no "a" in Okie, thank you.

An Okie

It was lifted and copied from the HAMB I suggest you go to their site and correct them.

[ply33]

Reading this thread reminded me of why, when asked, I call mine an "old car" rather than "antique" or "vintage".

I think the definition that people other than members of the CCCA or AACA go by is roughly:

Antique - Anything built before you were born.

Classic - The car you wanted to own when you were in high school but could not afford

New Car - Anything built after your oldest child was born.

[Guest]

According to local usage definitions up here north of the 49th, in the late 50's and early 60's Rusty_OToole is almost dead on. Antique was pre WWI with 1915 as the cutoff. Vintage was usually considered 1916 to 1928 (usually two wheel brakes), Pre war was of course 29 to 39/40/41 or 42 depending on where the car was made.

[Guest 914Driver]

I can't help with the Vintage, Antique, Classic dilema; but a hot rod has tools in its truck, a Street Rod has lawn chairs. =~)

[60FlatTop]

In my personal little kingdom things are very well defined. We have The White Car, The Black Car, The Convertible, The Truck, and The Riviera. The Wife and The Kids use the same names, pretty easy.

And I REALLY like post #21!!!!!!

Bernie

[JACK M]

I carry tools and lawn chairs.

I search C/L for street, hot, rat, vintage, classic, old school, antique and more.

No wonder I am always confused.

[joe_padavano]

I carry tools and lawn chairs.

I search C/L for street, hot, rat, vintage, classic, old school, antique and more.

No wonder I am always confused.

Just use "rat rod" and "barn find", because apparently those are the search terms they teach sellers to put in their ads these days. Of course, your search will return every single ad on C/L...

[Guest]

I was reading the May 2014 #116 issue of Hemmings Classic Car magazine and on page 34 a article of a Prewar 90 series Buick it says;

" At HCC we generally subscribe to the AACA's rolling 25 year definition of what makes a classic car. The Classic Car Club of America, however has other ideas. Their strict list of Full Classics reads like a who's who of prewar car builders.

American entries include the usual suspects: Lincoln ( and Continental) , Cadillac, Chrysler Imperial, Packard, Perless, Pierce-Arrow...and Buick. "

Someone from AACA better set them straight!

[39BuickEight]

I just use "antique" and "classic."

To me, "antique" is pre WWII or any other car that used the same pre WWII models for a few years after, and "classic" is anything after that until 1980 or so. Pretty solid definitions, I know.

[smithbrother]

I have a STREET TOURING car, it's BIG.

Dale in Indy

[jeff_a]

Lunchbox868,

The question you asked is what you could call debatable. It depends on your perspective. To a 17-year-old who's parents are picking out their first car it's one thing, to his 45-year-old Dad, it's another. You're on the AACA Forums, and they define antique as 25 years old.

I accept the 25 year rule and I get the reasoning, but to me, antique cars are prewar (WWII), vintage means pre-1932 and Classic Car means something like a 1929 Franklin, Lincoln or Peerless. The reality, of course, is that the 1989 Jeep Comanche I used to drive is a legit antique vehicle in an AACA-judged car show and a classic car museum might have a '64 GTO in it as well as a '24 Cadillac.

To me, hot rods are homemade race cars(drag racing won't hurt them a bit) and street rods are slick-looking homemade race cars(too nice to drag-race).

[JACK M]

So I picked up one of my running buddies last night on my way to our usual Wednesday night cruise. (his car is down at the moment)

I told him the comment about what is in the trunk and he couldn't stop laughing.

I am glad that I had my tools however as my car was doing something funny in the brakes. They were not releasing. I pulled over and cracked one front and one rear bleeder and the problem went away...????? Stupid home made cars (damned hot rods to most of you guys here). About 20 miles left to the destination and 40 miles home and no problems.

I am wondering if my M/C is not vented properly.

[GLong]

The 'C' Classic car is from 1924-1941, with a few exceptions. But the most important thing to mention is that the car has to be custom bodied, or hand made/assembled, NOT a assembly line mass-produced car.

An example is the Big Packards in the mid to late '30's are all Classics. But the Packard 120 of the same year is not, it was mass produced on an assembly line.

I have a hard time calling any car that I used to drive, work on, or see new as an 'antique' regardless of the AACA definition. Mainly because to accept a 1961 car as antique, make ME AN ANTIQUE !! I guess I'm not ready to accept that. !!

I have a really hard time when the talking heads on TV babble on and on about the 'classic cars' during the Woodward Cruise in Michigan. There RARELY is a real 'Classic' car traveling Woodward Avenue. Any '50's or '60's car is NOT a 'classic' car.. is it classy, and when the term is used correctly a '50's car can be 'classically' styled, but it is NOT a 'Classic' car.

Antique to me means teens and earlier, Classic is as described above: hand made/custom bodied, high end car from '24 through '41. Vintage? just means old to me.

I love the definition of the 'hot-rod' vs 'street-rod mentioned above in #21.

GLong

[Paul Dobbin]

The Natonal "Street Rod" Association (NSRA) defines a "street rod" as a 1948 & older vehicle with an up dated running gear. They even have a 23 point safty inspection that's open to all members. I've taken several stock antique (1934 & 1935 cars) thru it. (With turn signals and 3rd stop light added)

I even saw a stock 29 Model A go through (But, he had A/C) To me not all modifications a real sin (Like a right side taillight)

Here's a new catagory "RATIQUE". My 35 Ford pickup is a running stock example of a totally stock "barn find" that failed to be certified HPOF because the judge though it was "not preserved", (That's he P in HPOF), but at 75 years old it drove to the show with everything working. Maybe they should have a "Survivor" Class.

Edited June 17, 2014 by Paul Dobbin (see edit history)

[smithbrother]

I think the NSRA National Street Rod Asso. now says a street rod is anything older than 30 years. I believe that is the rule.

Dale in Indy

[A. Ballard 35R]

0please clarify why your truck was not "preserved", it looks well preserved to me. It is such a delight to see what appears to be the correct original wheels instead of some modern ones.

The Natonal "Street Rod" Association (NSRA) defines a "street rod" as a 1948 & older vehicle with an up dated running gear. They even have a 23 point safty inspection that's open to all members. I've taken several stock antique (1934 & 1935 cars) thru it. (With turn signals and 3rd stop light added)

I even saw a stock 29 Model A go through (But, he had A/C) To me not all modifications a re a sin (Like a right side taillight)

Here's a new catagory "RATIQUE". My 35 Ford pickup is a running stock example of a totally stock "barn find" that failed to be certified HPOF because the judge though it was "not preserved", (That's he P in HPOF), but at 75 years old it drove to the show with everything working. Maybe they should have a "Survivor" Class.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]253828[/ATTACH]

[Paul Dobbin]

0please clarify why your truck was not "preserved", it looks well preserved to me. It is such a delight to see what appears to be the correct original wheels instead of some modern ones.

That's what I asked. The truck has theoriginal engine transmission, wheels with original paint, theoriginal headliner, one door panel, front and rear glass (with bulletholes in the back glass), mechanical brakes, 6 volt electrical, alloriginal sheet metal and running boards. It's as I found it inWisconsin in 1989 and as found by the previous owner in 1970 (when itwas only 35 years old) Even the original wooden floor boards andgauges (All working except the gas gauge).

What not original is: The front bumper(I put a 35 car bumper on it because somebody had welded a crank holebracket to the original straight bumper). The paint (Which was donein the 1960's with a brush, which I think that kept the body frombio-degrading away) It has a second tail light (That I added forsafety). The wiring (replaced by me to avoid fires) The seat cover (Rayco special from the 60's) and the floor mat an tires because norubber floor or mat or tire lasts 79 years.

The fun part of putting it in aNational Show was that it drew the biggest crowd in the HPOF becausethat's what old trucks looked like after some hard use in the greatdepression. However it didn't look like it was showroom fresheither. I don't plan on changing it an may never show it again at ajudged show, but we'll continue to enjoy it in it's used condition.

I know cars that have been repainted,re-chromed, engines rebuilt, re-wired and have smelly old upholsterythat are HPOF certified. I guess beauty and shiny paint still countto many people, but they are only original once and un-restoredoriginal is still attractive to me.

When I inquired and wrote letters tofind out why it couldn't be certified, I was told “it's notpreserved”.

I guess, if I restore most of it andkeep a single nice feature it might make it. However every singlepiece needs restoration and leaving part of it undone wouldn’t lookgood either.

[MCHinson]

Paul,

I think your problem is the exterior repaint. I agree that it perfectly represents the way a lot of trucks were maintained back in the day. From everything I have heard in different HPOF CJEs over the past few years, a total repaint pretty much eliminates HPOF certification. It seems that they have changed the process a bit over the years but for now, as I understand it, certifying a repainted vehicle is almost impossible or impossible now, even though it was done in the past.

I have a similar situation with my 1954 Buick Special. It was original even down to having all of the original heater hoses and the original factory bottom radiator hose, but it was repainted years ago. I tour with it, but I will not waste my time entering it in HPOF. I may put it in DPC sometime, but it is just a good old car for touring. I really wish it had original paint, but it doe not.

[Guest Ronald F Webb]

Vintage usually refers to a specific year, such as in vintage wine. In cars it is often used to describe parts for a certain vehicle as being "vintage", or New Old Stock. meaning that they are from the same year as the car they fit and made by the same manufacturer, rather than reproduction. Saying a car is a "vintage 1934 Hudson" just means that the Hudson is a 1934 vehicle, sort of a "double positive" or redundant statement. I suppose if a lot of reproduction vehicles were being made, then the tern "Vintage Vehicle" would have more significance.

[Guest ol-nobull]

Hi. My personal thoughts for what they are worth - -

Here in Texas the State defines both Classic & Antique as being at least 25 years old with no other real specs. I choose to lisense my 46 Chevy as a Classic as Antique has restricted driving & Classic has unlimited driving. I want to be able to drive it anywhere at any time I choose.

Beyond that to me it is simply both classifications are old cars.

For finer definations it strictly depends on what organazation or group you are trying to satisfy or agree with as each org has its own independent rules & definations to contend with.

Jimmie

[39BuickEight]

sort of a "double positive" or redundant statement. I suppose if a lot of reproduction vehicles were being made, then the tern "Vintage Vehicle" would have more significance.

Don't you love it when the weather man says "we could have the chance for potentially strong winds" That's a triple right there!

[CarlLaFong]

Every so often, someone spins the "Wheel of Threads" and it lands on the terminology square. Then we go through a, seemingly endless, litany of opinions that lead nowhere. Antique, ©classic, vintage, old timer, horseless carriage, milestone car, special interest automobile, new, old or inbetweener, it doesn't matter. My state says this, my insurance company says that. I think it should be this way because I say so.

The FDA has rules as to what constitutes mayonnaise. Deviate from the prescribed ingredients and you cannot call it mayonnaise. Unfortunately (actually, fortunately), there are no Federal laws regarding the classifications of old cars. For me, I have to deign to the nationwide clubs and their definitions. I do happen to disagree with the AACA. 25 year old cars are, to me and for the most part, used cars and about as interesting as cold oatmeal. That being said, those are their rules and they are entitled to them. Same for the CCCA. Apart from the series 62 Cadillac deal, I agree with their terms as well.

Asking for clarification for terms that are nebulous, at best, is like asking, "How far is up?" or "How long is a rope?"

[alsancle]

John, that was well put. I did a search and this subject comes up about every 6 months like clock work. The original poster usually disappears quickly which makes me think it is just a trolling exercise.