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Fleetwood Body Number Help


Pat_n_Pat
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Need some clarification on Fleetwood body numbers.

We have a 1935 Cadillac 370-D V-12 Fleetwood Town Cabriolet. We know the Fleetwood body style is a 5725, of which only 9 were built. The Body Number is 29.

What does the Body Number mean? Is it the 29th Fleetwood body built in 1935? It can’t be the 29th 5725 as only 9 were built.

Any help from a Fleetwood expert would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks,

Pat Brothers

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I'm not a Fleetwood expert, but I own 5725 Body # 15, which is a 34, of which 4 V16s were built. I think that 9 town cars were put on Sixteen chassis from 34 - 37, which are pretty much the same body as your V-12. I know that there were town cars built on all 3 chassis, but I was a bit surprised that they would have built 15 by the time mine was built in the spring of 34, and it seems equally surprising that by 35 there were almost twice as many. Perhaps they were more popular than I think, or perhaps they started with the number 10. There certainly aren't many left - only 4 V16s from 34 - 37. Is yours the ex Jack Frank car? My email is packard12s@hotmail.com - we can trade photos. Dave Mitchell

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According to the Cadillac directory, that also sports a very accurate nrs section, the nrs are as follows;

V-12 5725 '34 12 cars '35 37 cars with leather back no quarter windows the nrs being 1 and 17 for cars with a metal back

V-16 5725 '34 4 cars '35 1 car with leather back no quarter windows no metal backs produced

Your 5275 V-12 nr 29 should be as intended .

the V-12 are on the 148 made in 34 and 35 only and the 5725 V-16 sits on the 149 chassis. 10 V-16 bodies being made between 34 and 37 one with a collapsible rear

Some data that might help a bit, Johan

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Hi Dave:

Yes, it is Jack's car. Jack and I are very close friends. I have been associated with the car since it rolled out of the Hill & Vaughn shop in 1977. My late wife and I rode across the awards stand at Pebble Beach in 1977 where it won first in class and most elegant. Jack called me in 2004, saying he was going to sell the car.....the rest is history. Jack came up to Oregon last July to celebrate his 92nd birthday with the car, picture below. BTW, the car still wears its 1977 Nitrocellulose paint job from Hill & Vaughn. I will e-mail some pictures.

Pat

post-48984-143142355469_thumb.jpg

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Hi Johan:

Could you please confirm your source for the data. The 2013 Cadillac & LaSalle Club directory shows that only 8 cars were built with Leather Back, and 1 car with metal back. Both the number "8" and the number "1" are followed by a question mark. Could you have read the "?" as the number "7"?

These same production numbers are verified in the book: Fleetwood, The Company and the Coachcraft" by James J. Schild, 2001.

This, again, brings me back to the same question about the body number; especially since the car was ordered on January 21, 1935. There were only 28 5725's built on either V-12 or V-16 chassis for 1934 and 35 combined.

Thanks for your help in guiding me to the membership directory!

Pat

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Hi Pat

Sorry, I.m obviously in need of more light, better glasses or both , your right I saw the ? for a 7 the 8 was seen as a 3. The nrs came from the 2014 directory, so proven by you to be accurate when reading them properly that is .

What I've found on body nrs they do not Always follow our way of sequnec thinking, some times you come upon an early body nr on a much later car ( engine nr wise) and some times the other way around.

Could also be the V-8 that were build with the 5725 body used the body numbering together with the other engined cars. good luck with your search. Johan

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Hi Pat, That is a nice car that you have. I met Jack a couple of times and he seems like a very, very nice man. I'm guessing, since I didn't look up my "Book of Fleetwood" for 1934, that the 5725 was available on all 3 chassis in 34/35, which would account for the higher number of bodies. I'll dig it out and see. Also there is a page showing the driver how to fold back the top - I'll copy it for you. Looking forward to seeing more photos of yours.

Don't short me Johan, the 60 series is 154 1/8 inch wheelbase, not a mere 149!

Take care,

Dave

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Dave:

Jack is a truly classy man. The 5725 was available on all 3 chassis. There were 11 5725 bodies on V-8 chassis in 1935. There were none in 1934, according to the Fleetwood book. talked today with Bob Porter, who owns the Elizabeth Arden car. It is a 5725 on a V-8 chassis.

I'd love a copy of how to fold that nightmare top! The manual says the top frames should fit in the same compartment (may be the sales manual).......I don't think so!!!!!

Pat

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There is no way the side irons will fit in the compartment. I keep mine in the trunk. I'm not sure they will even fit under the seat. I've seen the Arden car - we both had our town cars at the Cad club nationals a couple years ago. I know that there are 4 V16s left, only two in the US, mine and the 36, which I have seen. There is a 37 V12 that I have seen, but that is all that I have seen in person other than yours and Bobs. Years ago I saw a photo of a 34 8 or 12 advertised as Mae West's car, and heard rumors that the Jean Harlow car still exists, but I have no idea where either car is.

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Thanks Bubba, glad to know it is around. Is it a V8 or a 12? Interesting that this, like most convertibles has a chromed bead on the windshield, and my car never had it. The bead is part of the casting and like other parts Cad chromed the entire piece and painted what they didn't want to show as chromed - such as the hood sides and grill shell.

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Here is a pic of the Mae West car when it was for sale in NY. I looked at it but something about the body # didn't seem to be correct with me. I do not know where it went.

Bubba:

When did you take the picture? I know the Mae West car was in Santa Rosa, CA in 2004.

Pat

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Carl Steig in California is a Caddy expert. He has extensive files and research on all 12 & 16 cars, and is a Caddy town car guy who owns one or two. He use to have all the build sheets on the town cars of all years, so he would be a good person to ask the question of production numbers. I doubt that Cadillac built mid 30's town cars in any numbers as high as 29 units in any one year. Is the car cut down from a sedan at the factory and share sedan body numbers? Earlier Caddy town cars were not modified bodies but later on they may have changed.

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Hi Edinmass:

There were exactly 9 5725 Fleetwood 7-Passenger Town Cabriolets built in 1935. 8 were 5725LB (Leather Back) and 1 5725MB (Metal Back). The LB and MB refer to the covering over the rear compartment. These are Carl Steig's numbers from the Cad-LaSalle club roster. These numbers are confirmed by James Schild in his book. These were definitely not cut down from sedans, although they probably shared some components such as dash, hood, and possibly rear doors.

Since this car was a January 1935 Build, my guess is that it was the 29th Fleetwood body, all types included, to be built in 1935. Can anyone confirm that?

Thanks, Pat

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