jbeary Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 Hi All, My 1991 Reatta will not crank when it's hot. After it cools its fine but if I drive across town and turn the car off, when I get back in, the dash lights fine, the fuel pump whines but it will not crank. I've considered the VATS but the security light does go off after a few seconds and it cranks and starts fine after a few hours of sitting. Is this a known issue? I haven't seen any posts about this issue specifically, just thought I'd throw it out there. The car left me stranded the other day and I haven't wanted to drive it because of this. It's the 1991 Polo Green Reatta that came from Dallas, the one with the unhinged defroster flap. I pulled the dash a few weeks ago and managed to fix that but now I have this issue. Drove the car to and from work two weeks before this mishap so I don't think I mucked up any continuity. Have only driven to and from work so its had plenty of time to cool between cranking. Thanks in advance for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mgibson Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 Check the fuel pump pressure. It should be around 40 psi at the rail. There is a Schrader valve there I had the same problem with my 91 on the way to Boston and back in 2011. The solution was a new fuel pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Anderson Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 Sounds like you need to replace your crank sensor. I had the exact same symptoms with my LeSabre a few weeks ago. Also, it wouldn't hurt to check your plug wires, ignition coil, and ICM to see if you get spark on crank, and also to check for green goo around the ICM. Here are some websites that I used to pinpoint my problem.Part 1 -GM 3.8L Ignition Module Test and Crank Sensor Test (3X, 18X)Part 1 -How to Test the 3.8L GM Crank Sensor With a MultimeterGood luck, I hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbeary Posted July 15, 2013 Author Share Posted July 15, 2013 I'll do those tests. Thank you guys! I'm guessing that the fuel pressure needs to be at a certain pressure to actuate some relay? Is that correct? And possibly if the crank sensor is intermittent then there's some other relay that would lock out the starter??? Grasping here because the thing does not turn over at all when its hot and the starter isn't dragging like it going bad. Just never had an intermittent starter. Seems like they either work or they don't so I'm thinking along the lines that a relay isn't engaging. Is that plausible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry yarnell Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 (edited) Wait a minute, guys; he said it wouldn't CRANK. Has nothing to do with the crank sensor or the fuel pump! My money's on a bad starter or battery.What does it do when you attempt to start it? Click? groan? Nothing? Edited July 15, 2013 by harry yarnell add question (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbeary Posted July 15, 2013 Author Share Posted July 15, 2013 Yep. The solenoid isn't trying to engage. I think the battery is good. It's a continuity issue I believe. I was thinking it was the VATS blocking the starter because I can't find anything else between the starter and the switch aside from the ECM. I was just wondering if there was a know "feature" that would lock out the starter when the car is hot. I mean this thing gets really hot. I just bought a larger transmission cooler when I saw how hot it ran and I'm thinking about swapping out the thermostat with a lower temperature one now. Looks like the water pump is pumping and I had the same "runs hot" experience with my Grand National before I swapped out the thermostat. But before I went through changing the thermostat in this Reatta, I was hoping someone out there may have had the same issue or someone knew that the car not cranking at all when hot was indeed a "feature". Can't find anything about this in the FSM. Thanks so much again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 I don't know your mechanical ability but if it were me, when the engine is hot and the starter won't energize I would try jumping the solenoid right at the starter to see if the starter turns. If it does the circuit between the ignition switch and the starter or the ignition switch is at fault. Likely to be the starter interrupt relay. If the starter will not energize by jumping the solenoid at the starter check the battery cables and if good replace the starter and solenoid.The diagrams below might be helpful. The first one shows the normal flow of current to energize the starter. The second one shows how to bypass the starter interrupt relay as a test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2seater Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 Also, disconnect, clean and reconnect the battery terminals. Be certain the connections are clean and tight. Look for corrosion at the positive cable end. I suspect Ronnie's advice is right on, but it's good to start at the very beginning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 Is a classic sign of a weak solenoid though last time I looked a whole rebuilt starter with solenoid was about the same price as a solenoid.ps if it says "no shims", pay attention. Also anytime you do a starter, retorque the two big bolts after about 50 miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ol' yeller Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 X2 on checking the battery connections. Mine was stripped out and although it looked like it was connected, it would vibrate loose. I eventually had to replace the battery to fix the problem. Telltale signs were alternator noise in the radio and headlight dimming when stepping on the brakes. If this isn't the problem, Ronnie has a great suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbeary Posted July 16, 2013 Author Share Posted July 16, 2013 These are all great suggestions and THANK YOU RONNIE! I think I need to start at the ignition switch because I thought it was funny that this car didn't let me turn it back to the "Accessory" position but the '89 I have does. Maybe that's the root of my problem. I priced solenoids and yeah, the delco ones on Amazon are crazy expensive but I really haven't priced starters so it may come back to that Padgett. And I probably should pull the battery and bring it over to AutoZone and let them test that too but the loose connections were what I'd originally thought and that's just not the case...Can you guys point me to the location of the starter interrupt relay? I hate asking you guys to do the FSM research for me, but if anyone just know's where this relay is located I'll go straight to that and just take it out of the circuit first. Then I think I need to look at the ignition switch to see if any of the linkage is binding or if the switch itself is damaged. I need to hit Jim Finn up again for parts so maybe it's that time again...THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH!!!!Man...I'll tell you guys... The 89 I have has almost 200k miles on it compared to the 91 with 79k miles on it. Yet, the build quality between these two cars just blows me away! Everytime I put a wrench on either car, its just so easy to tell how well built the 89 is compared to the 91. Everything I researched told me to find a 91. Since mine is one of the last hundred or so made, I don't know... Maybe they were just throwing these cars together at the end. The defroster flap issue alone told me why the 91 was a low milage car. I know that there were two used car dealers messing with the 91 for at least a year so maybe that's the difference between the two cars, I don't know. But if I had to do this over again, I'd have looked for a rust free 89 and avoided the 91 model.... These other bugs aren't worth the challenges that the 89 presents with brakes and the metal fuel and brake lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 The starter interrupt relay is located up under the dash on the drivers side. Hard to get to. I think I would eliminate some other possibilities that are more accessible first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbeary Posted July 17, 2013 Author Share Posted July 17, 2013 Well, it's a good thing my dash is still mostly apart from having just fixed the defroster flap arm. Your advice is well taken Ronnie. With this car, I can only hope it's a something as acessiable as the solenoid. Thanks a hundred times over for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 Key to me is weak when hot. That points to something under the hood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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