military vehicles

[Guest 1930]

There was a fellow that posts here every now and then I think Bobs1916 or Bobs 1917, I am trying to use his username to perform a search but am coming up with nothing. I would like to review a post he made not long ago about his truck but think he made the post within another users possibly un-related thread. Can anyone point me in the right direction of his posts? Thanks

[Guest 1930]

Never mind, figured how to do the search http://forums.aaca.org/f143/engine-removal-17-a-264015.html

[Guest 1930]

Bobs1916 said this .........Hi

well sort of right Early DB vehicles with mags DID have batteries and starter generator. ONLY, to my knowledge, did the 1918 army repair truck work with a fixed starter crank and no battery or starter generator. Most all US Army vehicles were similarly equipped. Makes sense no need to worry about dead batteries in the field. and all lighting was kerosene or acetylene

......................Hello Bob, going thru some Graham stuff, came across this and I thought you might find this description interesting

I would very much like to see more pictures and better descriptions of your truck when you have the time.

[Guest 1930]

I would also like to hear a better description of how these early mag cars operated and to better understand why we got away from them to go with a dest/coil deal.

[bobs1916]

Hello

Bob here . What is it that you would like to see regarding the 1918 repair truck??

I have pictures of everything

bob

[bobs1916]

To my understanding the early mag cars had BOTH a battery for lights and starter and magneto ignition. Mags were a lot more costly to produce I think that being said economics may have played a role in their disappearance. I was told that DB cars Down Under often used mags into the mid 1920s. Mags when properly adjusted function flawlessly although I am having a problem on my 18 with the points closing up. Certainly the Army trucks which lacked batteries could only operate with the magneto ignition. The DBs used Eisemann G4 2nd edition mags

bob

Edited July 15, 2013 by bobs1916 (see edit history)

[bobs1916]

The "ignition" switch is a simple make/break type. The mag is grounded out in the off position(break). There is no key on my truck

bob

[R.White]

I believe there are a number of reasons why there was a move away from magneto over to coil ignition. First, it was the introduction of the starter motor which made hand cranking with it's attendant risk of personal injury, for the most part obsolete. It also encouraged women to take up driving leading to more car sales. It's convenience also saw off the steam cars which took a long time to start up.

With the starter came the need for a battery (and generator to keep it charged up) and this enabled a move away from the inherently dangerous acetylene lighting sets to incandescent electric light bulbs. To this you could add an electric horn to replace the antediluvian bulb. Brake lights were brought in and interior lighting ceased to smell.

Developments in the manufacture of electrical hardware meant that a more efficient use of electrical current could be had with a coil. I believe a more powerful spark could be obtained and that could be used with increased compression ratios which were now possible due to the addition of leaded petrol (Midgley).

A separate distributor was also convenient in engine design because it could be positioned in different locations.

Another consideration, which is often quoted, was that coil ignition was also cheaper to produce.

I hope this helps explain things but I also welcome any challenge to the above.

Ray.

[Guest 1930]

Hello

Bob here . What is it that you would like to see regarding the 1918 repair truck??

I have pictures of everything

bob

Thanks for the pics Bob, they have already answered a few questions, I have only seen very poor pictures in early D.B manuals with magneto equipped engines.

I would like to see any pictures you have of your truck, if you have them within a single file maybe you would not mind sending them to me e-mail jhason2@yahoo.com and maybe I can post some of the pictures that I might have a question for.

I would like to know what other differences your vehicle might posses over a standard D.B and any history you may have about the truck, how you came to own it ect, where it may have seen service possibly?

[Guest 1930]

I believe there are a number of reasons why there was a move away from magneto over to coil ignition. First, it was the introduction of the starter motor which made hand cranking with it's attendant risk of personal injury, for the most part obsolete. It also encouraged women to take up driving leading to more car sales. It's convenience also saw off the steam cars which took a long time to start up.

With the starter came the need for a battery (and generator to keep it charged up) and this enabled a move away from the inherently dangerous acetylene lighting sets to incandescent electric light bulbs. To this you could add an electric horn to replace the antediluvian bulb. Brake lights were brought in and interior lighting ceased to smell.

Developments in the manufacture of electrical hardware meant that a more efficient use of electrical current could be had with a coil. I believe a more powerful spark could be obtained and that could be used with increased compression ratios which were now possible due to the addition of leaded petrol (Midgley).

A separate distributor was also convenient in engine design because it could be positioned in different locations.

Another consideration, which is often quoted, was that coil ignition was also cheaper to produce.

I hope this helps explain things but I also welcome any challenge to the above.

Ray.

Ray I think you covered most of the possibilities many of which I would not have considered, thanks

[robert b]

Ray one of the main reasons magneto ignition was used much longer here in Australia was the vast remoteness of the country and no regional electricity supply to recharge flat batteries. The outback of Australia didn't see electricity supply until well into 1970s and there still some areas that don't have grid supply to this day.They have to generate their own.

[Guest BretK]

Mags are also pretty darn reliable, they are still used to this day in most light piston engined airplanes.

[Guest 1930]

Ray one of the main reasons magneto ignition was used much longer here in Australia was the vast remoteness of the country and no regional electricity supply to recharge flat batteries. The outback of Australia didn't see electricity supply until well into 1970s and there still some areas that don't have grid supply to this day.They have to generate their own.

Another good point/observation. I would not have guessed

[Guest 1930]

Mags are also pretty darn reliable, they are still used to this day in most light piston engined airplanes.

I need to find a mag car, Ill have to spend some time on the T forum to get a better understanding of how they work.

[robert b]

1930 you need to get a copy of A L Dykes Automotive Encyclopedia, there is a good section magneto section on how they work Bob

[Guest 1930]

Thanks, I will look into that

[JACK M]

1930 you need to get a copy of A L Dykes Automotive Encyclopedia, there is a good section magneto section on how they work Bob

I have one of those that I would sell. It may be newer than you want as it says 1943-1945, although there are many pages about magnetos.

Fair condition for the age, but not perfect.

[Guest 1930]

I have some dated late 20s but I like to read things in layman's terms if possible, thanks though

[Guest Bill Miller]

Those folks who have said that cost was the primary reason to change from magneto to coil/distributor are correct. Also it is my understanding that the magneto produces a longer-lasting and hotter spark than does the coil/distributor arrangement. A magneto simply functions as a coil and distributor combined and is very easy to time, even a simpleton like me can do it in a few minutes since it's a lot less critical and more forgiving than the points breaking in a distributor. The mags work without difficulty for much longer than the coil/distributor and one reader mentioned correctly that they are still used in aircraft for reliability reasons. The weakest component is the condenser which can break down over time but can be rebuilt. However some disassembly of the mag unit is required to get at it. There are good people who can rebuild the Eisemann G-4 and I recommend Mainely Magnetos in Maine for this purpose.

[JACK M]

Some lawn mowers still have em.

[R.White]

Some lawn mowers still have em.

My neighbour has just given me a hardly used lawn mower with magneto. It's hardly ever been used because it won't start. I have tried everything but I can't get a spark out of the flippin' ### thing!!

[JACK M]

Ha, hardly used. Take it apart and put some points in it. Sounds like work?

[R.White]

It is fairly new but I can't be bothered to fiddle about with it. I gave the neighbour a nice boxed set of machine mitre chisels. He's a professional wood worker and all round good egg. I will get back my investment when I want a new toolbox made!! We also have a good laugh from time to time; just hope the joke is not on me!