Another electrical issue 1953 Super

[WillBilly53]

Alright, so I've moved on to the brake lights. I hope I explain this well...

I've changed to a mechanical brake switch. The brake lights are on, but the left one only has the bigger filament glowing bright. The right one has both filaments glowing bright. Now when I depress the button on the brake switch, the left one goes out completely and the right stays bright (no change) any ideas?

[old-tank]

What does the 'button on the brake switch' supposed do when depressed?... activate the brake lights or turn them off?

If you used the same 2 wires that went to the hydraulic switch it should work as designed. As a test jumping the 2 wires should have both lights on, bright filaments only.

After all that it is probably a ground problem again...second guess=improper connections.

Willie

[WillBilly53]

it's supposed to turn them off when depressed. I did indeed use the same two wires that would go to the original hydraulic switch. I jump the switch tomorrow. Please don't kill me if it's a grounding issue, I promise I have them grounded I'll double check my connections again as well and report back.

[Pete O]

Even though you mentioned they are grounded, I still vote that it's a bad ground on the taillight housing, and the juice is searching for ground by feeding back through the tail light circuit. To test this theory, try running a jumper wire from a clean spot on the housing to a clean spot on the chassis, which should give a better ground path.

[old-tank]

Do the rear turn signals work properly? What is the condition of the wiring? Fuse block --- original or replacement?

[WillBilly53]

Thanks Pete, I'll triple check the ground. Thanks Oldtank - the turn signals work perfect. The wiring is brand new harness from YnZ's and the fuse block is original with brand new fuses.

[old-tank]

...waiting on the result of disconnecting the wires at the switch and then jumping across...

[WillBilly53]

i disconnected the wires at brake switch and jumped the terminals. still no change. i also ran a long wire from the tail light housing to the chassis where the ground cable connects. still no change.

[Alfre]

Run a wire from the tail light socket to a clean spot on the bumper for a good ground, the socket could be bad.

Al

[old-tank]

If it is not a ground issue, you need to take some aspirin and crawl back under the dash and check all of the connections on the fuse block (be sure the connections are correct and secure) and maybe substitute a known good flasher...maybe even try a different fuse block. On cars with the turn signals integrated with the stop lights all kind of strange things happen with just one wrong part or wrong connection, kinda like what you see with bad grounds.

This is getting to be above my pay grade....

Willie

[WillBilly53]

This is getting to be above my pay grade....

Willie

I know man and I appreciate the help you've given over the years.

Looks like I got my work cut out for me this weekend...

[MrEarl]

speakin of pay, you got any Fat Tire left? I like to work on electrical after dark, you can see short sparks better...and they're purdier

edit) I got a nos flasher but that don't mean it is a known good...

edit2) you checked our windshield install out for water leaks yet? is the rubber in for the rear one yet?

Edited April 7, 2013 by MrEarl (see edit history)

[WillBilly53]

speakin of pay, you got any Fat Tire left? I like to work on electrical after dark, you can see short sparks better...and they're purdier

edit) I got a nos flasher but that don't mean it is a known good...

edit2) you checked our windshield install out for water leaks yet? is the rubber in for the rear one yet?

I've always got some fat tire for you my man.

I haven't checked the windshield install for leaks yet, but the rubber for the rear did come in a few days ago. You got plans next weekend? Wanna come over and help a brother out?

EDIT: You want I should get a keg this time? :cool:

Edited April 7, 2013 by WillBilly53 (see edit history)

[Pete O]

Ok, so it's not the ground. Try taking a look at the wiring in the bulb socket. It might be that the spring loaded contacts are touching each other. This could be caused by the fiber piece that the contacts go though becoming warped so that the contacts are angled and make contact with each other.

[avgwarhawk]

Are you using the original tail light sockets? The reason I asked is my brothers 60 Imp has the hydraulic BL switch. Although it was part of his brake lights not working issue, we found that the sockets were just old. The sockets worked but after fiddling with them they no longer worked. The spring underneath the contacts weak. We changed them out with a GM socket. These are the sockets that handle the bulbs that act as running,turn signal and brake lights. Each socket had it's own independent ground that we secured to the body. The lights worked without issue.

Also, is the bulb in correctly? I have seen many people jam in a bulb only to find it is backwards. The brake light is lite when the running lights are on. Hit the brakes and the running light illuminates and the brake light filiment turns off.

Edited April 8, 2013 by avgwarhawk (see edit history)

[WillBilly53]

the sockets are good. the right one (the one that both filaments stay on) is original. The driver's side (the one that only the smaller filament is on and turns off when the brake light switch is depressed) is a brand new replacement.

I'll double check the bulbs are in correctly. I still need to get under the dash to check my connections there as well. Had to do yard work this weekend, but tonight I'll be able to start really troubleshooting. thanks for the input guys!

[avgwarhawk]

Ok, sockets are good. If you look at the bulb there are two contacts points. One for the brake filament/turn signal and the other for running light. The body of the bulb is the ground to the socket. So, I'm thinking the bulb is in backwards.

[WillBilly53]

alright - good news. I got both tail lights to glow bright and go off when I depress the brake light switch. Turns out I had the wires to the aftermarket socket flip flopped AND the bulb was not seated all the way . But I do have another question. When the headlights are on, should the brake lights be on slightly and then glow really bright when the brakes are hit? Or do the parking/back up lights on the bumper provide the lighting for night time driving? (I hope my question makes sense)

[Alfre]

The brake lights are only brake lights the tail lights should lite with the head lights, in another way the brake lights do not light with the head lights.

I believe you still have a light socket problem in the tail lights.

Al

[old-tank]

Still a grounding issue. Try this: run a wire from the neg (-) battery terminal to the body...there may be a ground strap that is missing has oxidized connections. Also when we restore these cars we put paint where it never was and much more of it (powder coat is even worse)

Willie

[WillBilly53]

I think you're right Willie. I've blown 2 fuses, the dash turn indicators now aren't working and the left brake light now only burns one filament. I've order a replacement pigtail to work with the original socket from Eckler's. I think that aftermarket socket is part of the problem. Until it arrives I'm gonna move to installing the exhaust system

[WillBilly53]

so the replacement pigtail for the taillight came in today. hooked it up to an extra bezel with the original socket. I get the same result. However, now I've noticed that when the headlights are off, both taillights glow bright and go dim, responding to the brake light switch correctly. When the headlights are on or park lights are on (middle position on the switch) the left tail light glows one filament and the right tail light still glows bright. I'm guessing something at the light switch now? I'm going out with my girl for some tacos and gonna pull the headlight switch and give it a once over tonight when we get back. Everything at the fuse panel is correct. I guess I didn't install the wiring harness as "perfectly" as I thought.

[JohnD1956]

I wonder if you need to look at the headlights and front parking lights for bad grounds?

It is probably me but I am having trouble following the sequence of the how the lights are working. May I just try to re state what I thinkI read for confirmation of the operation description?

It appears to me that:

If the headlight switch is in the off position the brake lites operate correctly?

Then if the parking lights are turned on, one brake light is correct ( dim), but the other is bright (as if the brake is applied)?

And, if the headlights are on the tail lights respond the same as if the parking lights are on?

[JohnD1956]

Any chance you can post a picture of the wiring diagram from your manual?

[WillBilly53]

Thanks for the reply. Yes, the description you repeated is what is going on. I've attached an image of the wiring diagram from my manual.

[WillBilly53]

so here's the latest. a real head scratcher:

Headlights off: Tail lights work perfectly

Parking Lights on: Right tail light works perfectly (dim and then bright) Left tail light stay bright, no change.

Head Lights on: Exact same as if Parking Lights are on.

I'm thinking the switch is somehow faulty?

EDIT: Got them working! Man, that was a real hair puller. The bulb in the left tail light, although new, seems to be a little faulty. I replaced the 1034 with an 1157 and everything works perfect now.

Thanks for everyone's help. A mixture of bad socket, grounding issue, switched wires and faulty bulbs. all in a week's work!

Edited April 16, 2013 by WillBilly53 (see edit history)