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The Ressurection of Daphne - a 1932 DL


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what difference does it make if the shims are all the way back in the housing, or are just installed at the outer portion of the housing

Purely conjecture on my part, assuming facts not in evidence, I think the factory 'fool proofed' the end play setting by submerging the shims back in the housing so they would not be lost during field repairs and maintenance.

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Purely conjecture on my part, assuming facts not in evidence, I think the factory 'fool proofed' the end play setting by submerging the shims back in the housing so they would not be lost during field repairs and maintenance.

Since the bearings are back to back against a ridge on the axle shaft (like on my 1931 DH6), the shim being inside the bearings WILL definitely make a difference in axle location. If you put the shims on the outsides, the axles will move closer together.

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Since the bearings are back to back against a ridge on the axle shaft (like on my 1931 DH6), the shim being inside the bearings WILL definitely make a difference in axle location. If you put the shims on the outsides, the axles will move closer together.

Who on earth said anything about placing the shim/s inside (between) the bearings??

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Who on earth said anything about placing the shim/s inside (between) the bearings??

I did not say "between the bearings". I said on the "inside" as in on the inboard side of the bearings on the differential side. Sorry if I was not clear.

Maybe I should have posted this quote..."what difference does it make if the shims are all the way back in the housing, or are just installed at the outer portion of the housing?"

If the shims are on the outer portion of the housing, the bearings and axles will be closer together.

Does THAT make more sense?

Edited by keiser31 (see edit history)
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I think there's pretty much of a consensus that the drawback to placing the shims outside is that the axle may move in too much and interference may result. The other question is will it move the axle inward enough to cause problems with the brake drum interfering with the backing plate. Until I figure out just what the thickness of the shims needs to be, I won't know if this is going to be a problem or not. I mean, are we talking a few thousandths of an inch or an eighth of an inch? I'm going to attempt to measure the thickness of the bearings clamped together with the bearing cups and then the distance inside the bearing housing. The difference, minus the required axle play, should give me a ballpark figure where I stand. The whole purpose is to set axle end play in the bearings. As soon as it warms enough that I can feel my fingers out in the garage, I'll give it a go. Until then, we've probably beaten this topic to death.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I checked the rear axle now that things have warmed up a bit. There is no way the axles can touch. The design has a shaft that connects the gears in the differential that is between the two axles. So now I have to see if the axles would be pushed in too much and actually come in contact with the shaft.

I'm taking my springs over to be sandblasted tomorrow along with some other parts - the front engine fixture and the transmission mounting support.

I'm also starting on the wheels and have the job of trying to break the beads loose on tires that have been in place for over forty years. Not looking forward to it.

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Edited by Taylormade (see edit history)
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I'm cleaning up my Delco-Lovejoy shocks and can find no trace of any paint on them - just lots of grease. Does anyone know if these units were painted (black?) or left bare metal? If bare metal I will probably paint them with "cast iron" paint to replicate the unpainted look and still avoid rust.

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Finally, some warm weather! Snow melted, garage and drive clear and I finally found some time to clean and paint parts.

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Yesterday, I took the springs, front floorboards, front motor mount, rear tranny mount and the battery box supports over to the sandblasters. This is why I usually hire this out - not the greatest job in the world.

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They did everything in about an hour and a half and I took it all home hoping the temperature would get above 60 so I could paint everything before rust came back. I got the primer on last night as the temps were margial, but okay. I used the heat from my worklamps to keep everything warm.

Today dawned warm and clear and I put on a thin coat of black on the springs. Probably overkill, as the motion of the springs will probably wear it away, but hopefully it will keep some rust from forming. As this is going to be a driver, I can't expect perfect springs after a season on the road, but maybe this will help some of the expected rust from showing up on the edges of the leafs - or is it leaves? The two primed parts are the battery box supports. The one primed spring leaf - the little one - I had to go back to the sandblaster to get. It got buried in the sand and was temporarily lost!

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32 spring leaves in all!

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Front motor mount.

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Rear Tranny mount.

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Front floorboards. Some pitting from those Syracuse winters, but no holes and they are plenty solid. The rest of the floor is wood.

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The weather forecast is for a cold front moving in tonight, so it's back to the deep freeze. I can't wait for Spring to arrive. Where the heck is Global Warming when you need it?

Edited by Taylormade (see edit history)
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You are making great progress!

. . . Where the heck is Global Warming when you need it?

Global Warming is hiding out in California at the moment. Nearly 80°F and sunny outside right now which is pretty unusual, if not unprecedented, for this area in February. I'll trade you some warm sunny weather for a bit of snow in the Sierra so we have water for the summer. . .

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Dick,

Did you send me this pic ( 2 others as well ). I just had this feeling it was you but not 100% sure.

Cheers

Ian

Ian,

Sorry, I didn't send those - although I sure wish I owned that car!

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OK....you guys got me. I should have said that there is no such noun as the word leafs.

I make the same mistake noun and then,,,,,,,,,,,,,it may be better in some casees to let the pictures tell the story.................hahaha....all in fun....

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anyone looking?? for 1 of these, I have all the original to put it back, front end rear end all shocks and mounts steering

ect....http://www.ebay.com/itm/151241449143?forcerRptr=true&item=151241449143&viewitem=#ht_896wt_1200

Not to whine, but....this post is not really associated with this thread....although the "leafs' thing was steering it away.....sort of.

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A three hour drive to Columbia, Missouri<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate><quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate> to pickup my engine. Rebuilt and ready to go - after I wirebrush the surface rust and give it a coat of paint.

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I got lucky. Apparently, the motor had been rebuilt sometime recently before I bought the car in 1965 and Phil and I didn't drive it all that much afterwards.
Work done:
block cleaned and checked
Rebore
New pistons and rings
New bronze valve guides
new valve springs
new camshaft bearings
Crank polished
valve job (the car had hardened inserts installed at some time (maybe at the factory) and they were in great shape. Just needed the valves cleaned up and the seats ground
New timing chain
all new gaskets and seals
new thermostat

The oil pump, babbitt bearings (main and rod) were in excellent shape and didn't need to be replaced. The crank and camshaft were also in excellent shape.

I also had the flywheel resurfaced.

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I spent one of the most physically trying days of my life Wednesday taking the old tires off the rims. Forty-five years of sitting had bonded the rubber to the metal at the molecular level.<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate> Breaking the bead was a new exercise in futility. After spending five hours getting the tires off two wheels and breaking the front bead on a third - the rear bead would not break even after I ran over it with my car! - I took the remaining tires to the shop less than a mile from my house and, with their machine, they had the tires off in ten minutes. Live and learn.

When I had the car, the three yellow wheels were on one side and the three black on the other. This matched the front upholstery, with vinyl on one door and the original cloth on the other. They will all be sandblasted and powdercoated the original yellow - or as close as I can get to it.

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I also have the springs back together and ready for clamp bolts and a last touch-up coat of paint.

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Now if it will just warm up enough so I can paint the engine!<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate><quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate><quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate>

Edited by Taylormade (see edit history)
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What did the engine work cost and what would it have cost had it needed new bearings ect?

Nice to hear of a shop that appears to have treated you honestly, who did the work?

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If you don't mind me asking, who in Columbia, Mo did your machine work. I live just south of there. Sounds like we could be fairly close to each other. Maybe we should plan a get together sometime. Mark

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The work was done by Loop 70 Motor Parts in Columbia on -guess what - the 70 Loop. Ask for Elson, he's a good guy to work with. Every time I'm there the place is filled with car guys, talking old cars and hot rods. Three guys showed up while my wife and I were there this morning and they all helped Elson and I get the motor into my SUV. Boy did I need a pickup! Thanks guys, we couldn't have done it without you! I paid $1600 parts and labor. If the babbitt was bad we would have had to send the bronze-backed bearings out and the cost would have been in the $2500 range for the total rebuild. Elson kept me informed of the prices of the items he was buying. This is a one year engine - the head gasket, for instance, is only used in 1932 - so parts are more expensive than more common engines. The gasket set alone was $250! Parts for a 1935 Dodge engine would have cost half as much.

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I have been enjoying your story as you rebuild a nice car. It is good to see good writing and photographs.

About powder coating wheels. I had my 1930 DC wheels powder coated in the mid-'90s. It has been a disaster. They didn't cover well and I was impatient and ignorant enough to accept them. I touched them up with the appropriate spray cans. But that is only part of the problem.

Wire wheels always "work" or move around on the road. The result is that you will get brown coming around the spoke ends in the hub. Once rust gets under the coat, you can't see it and it just has a party. I have recently stripped two (paint stripper by hand and a light sand blast) and had them powder coated again, with a zinc undercoat this time. But the dumb #$$^%@#$%s didn't paint the rim inside the tire! Grrrr. Surface rust was extensive under the powder, especially on the outside of the rim under the tire. That may be partly due to me: I tried a little detergent and water one time when putting the tires on, and next time I took them off the water was still in there! Another hard-won lesson: do it dry!

So I suggest you think "belt and braces" and get something put on under the powder to catch any chips or movement wear.

I love wire wheels but they are better on other people's cars coz they are a PITA to keep clean. :rolleyes:

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I keep hearing good, then bad things about powder coating wire wheels. I asked about it on another thread and got a bunch of differing opinions. Anybody else have any horror stories? I think some problems are caused by poor prep and application.

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I keep hearing good, then bad things about powder coating wire wheels. I asked about it on another thread and got a bunch of differing opinions. Anybody else have any horror stories? I think some problems are caused by poor prep and application.

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I had a fairly crappy experience with the powder coated wire wheels on my '31 DH. The previous owner had powder coated the wheels. I kept on getting flat tires and could not for the life of me figure out why. No nails in the tires or anything that would puncture the tube. One day, while fixing another flat, I happened to remove the rubber band around the rim. THERE was the culprit!! When the previous owner of the car hung the wheels with a wire hanger (or whatever they use to hang the wheel from) to coat them, the coating bonded the wire hanger to the inside of the rim where the spokes came though. When the wire was removed, it left a very sharp, jagged edge of powder coating in that whole area. I had to remove each tire and rubber band and file those jagged edges down on each rim. Much better now. The main problem I have to cope with is rust seeping out around some of the spokes., but my car is an everyday driver (when roadworthy) and I drive it rain or shine. Water gets in and the spokes rub and you get rust dust. The powder coating on the areas of the wheels that don't touch the spokes is very durable.

Edited by keiser31 (see edit history)
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Tackled the steering arm today. Still snow on the ground, but it was in the forties and felt really pleasant with the sun out.

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The first job was to get rid of the massive accumulation of dried grease and dirt on the arm. A grinder and a wire brush took care of that in quick order. You can see how thick this stuff was...

Before:

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After:

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A shot showing the thickness of this gunk. Sticky, filthy and just all around unpleasant. More than a quarter of an inch. It probably kept rust from forming on the parts, so I'm kind of glad it was there for the forty odd years it sat in Phil's garage.<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate>

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Once I had everything clean, I took a look at how the arm was put together. This may be old hat to a lot of you folks, but for those who have never dealt with this, here is how they come apart.

Once you take out the grease fitting, you'll find a plug that screws into the end of the arm. There was a ton of grease in there, but from the holes around the outside of the arm, I could tell some sort of pin was holding it in. I forgot to take a picture before I removed it. The slot in the plug actually lines up with the holes in the arm. There are multiple holes so you can adjust the tension in the arm.

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It turned out not to be a pin, but this little U-shaped device that spans the slot in the plug.

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It snapped out easily. What holds it in is the grease fitting. When you put the U-clip back in, you rotate it so it lies flat against the inside recess of the plug. When the grease fitting is screwed back in, it centers the clip and prevents it from popping out.<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate>

Now I had to figure out how to unscrew the plug. I don't have a screwdriver that big. Going through a pile of old tools my dad gave me, I discovered this (I think) tire iron. It fit perfectly and it and set set of vice grips made for the ideal tool.

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The plug came out very easily. All that lubrication had kept the threads clean and smooth.<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate>

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With tension off the inner assembly, the pitman arm popped out and a pulled everything out of the arm housing. You have from right to left a spring plug, the spring, a cup, the pitman arm ball, another cup, the plug, the U-clip and the grease fitting. The pitman arm ball rides between the two cups and the spring absorbs bumps and shocks and allows the arm some movement.

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I was hoping the ball end of the pitman arm would be okay, but no such luck It was still fairly round, although not perfect...

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But the bigger problem was the deep slot cut into the arm below the ball end. This was caused by the edge of the opening in the arm rubbing against it.<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate><quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate>

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More on that later.

The front of the arm was disassembled the same way.

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And the same problems surfaced with the ball stud that hooks up to the steering. Note the slot cut in the metal.

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The good news is that I ordered a rebuilding kit for the arm from Tom Hannaford at Then and Now Auto. All new parts - cups, springs, studs and plug . It's due to arrive in a day or so. I also ordered a new ball end for the Pitman arm. I'm not sure what I'm going to get. Tom says it's designed to be brazed on in place of the old ball. I'll post photos when it arrives. It seems to me that some sort of pinion or pin will be needed for extra support. I forgot to ask Tom if the new ball comes with a pin or extension. Since my wife and I are going to risk our lives on this repair, I want to make sure it's done right!

The other problem is the wear to the slot in the arm. As you can see from these shots, the slot and the circular opening in both ends of the arm have been badly worn. They should be symmetrical and the slot should be narrower.

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Tom says a machine shop can weld this up and grind the correct shape back in. Has anybody done this? It's way above my pay grade.

I got very lucky the other day. As you may remember, I huge slab of ice fell on Daphne when Phil owned her. One of the things that was badly broken was the trim piece in the center of the cowl. It is made of pot metal and didn't fare well against mother nature. I had always assumed I'd have to make one from scratch as they are no longer available from NAPA. :)

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I was browsing the site and noticed an ad from Hammer_31_Dodge with some 32 Dodge parts for sale. There it was! A cowl piece for 35 bucks. I couldn't believe it.<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate> I contacted Shawn and we made the deal. It arrived in two days. Thanks Shawn!

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More on the steering arm when my rebuild kit arrives.<quickprintreadystate style="display: none;"></quickprintreadystate>

Edited by Taylormade (see edit history)
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I don't see it listed on their site, but Rare Parts in Stockton, California might have a new drag link for you. And if they don't their policy is to duplicate the original you send them and then add it to their catalog so others can buy it.

The drag link for my '33 Plymouth has ends very similar to yours but the body is different. It suffered from the same wear on the slots as yours. The new manufacture one from Rare Parts looks identical to the original but was made of a little thicker material. Seems to be holding up very well but it only has 10K or 20K miles on it while the original had about 100K.

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