Ian_Greenlaw Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 interesting difference where mine in the same except with the introduction of "ears" which are mounted to the bell housing and gearshift crossmember but the floating power badge remains. not as much floating in mine as compared to yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Today's Pop Quiz in Dodge Brothers 101. What are these objects? (They are from a DL) The winner gets the satisfaction of being the smartest student on the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Just went through one of the biggest pain in the you know what jobs in the restoration so far - installing the transmission rubber Floating Power mount. Sometimes I wonder how they did some of this stuff at the factory. It looked simple, bolt on the rubber mount, slide the frame member on and bolt that to the mount. Here is where the rubber mount goes on the back of the tranny. Two bolts on each side. Simple - right? Then I go to slide the frame member on and it won't fit! Ahhhh, now I see - I have to bolt the rubber mount to the frame member first, then slide everything over onto the transmission. So i unbolt the mount from the tranny, bolt it to the frame member and...now there is no room to get the four mounting bolts in. Unbolt everything, stare at the parts for a few minutes, bolt the rubber mount back on the transmission and twist, slide, force, beat, swear, turn and finally get the frame member over the bolts on the transmission and down on the rubber mount. Naturally, my freshly painted transmission looks like I dragged it behind a truck with a chain. Here is the transmission, freshly touched up, with the rubber mount and frame member in place. Oh, and getting the two bolts that hold the rubber mount to the frame member is almost impossible as there is absolutely no room to get your hand in there and get the nuts on. They must have had to carry the guy who did this at the factory out on a stretcher at the end of his shift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil 32DL6 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 You know, Dick, everytime I read about your struggles, it reconfirms my opinion that selling Daphne back to you was one of the best decisions of my life. And, I know that you (nor she) would have had it any other way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 It's her sweet revenge. Daphne - "Didn't want to change my transmission oil back in 1965, Dick? Have fun changing all my transmission bearings now." Dick - "Yes, Daphne." Daphne - "Ever going to treat me like that again?" Dick - "No, Daphne." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleach Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 (edited) Today's Pop Quiz in Dodge Brothers 101. What are these objects? (They are from a DL) The winner gets the satisfaction of being the smartest student on the forum. I know that each hole holds a bolt and the tabs fold over them to hold them securely.That's all I saw in the next picture in your album. Edited September 17, 2015 by Bleach (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Correct. Do you know what they are used for? And what is the purpose of the hole in the middle? (By the way, finding the correct sized square head bolts was not easy.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Lawson Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 Do they hold the bolts for the front fender support My 2249 has a similar retainer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 18, 2015 Author Share Posted September 18, 2015 Ron takes the prize - front fender support bolts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 20, 2015 Author Share Posted September 20, 2015 Got the transmission in today. If I had it to do over again I would have put the trans on before I dropped the motor in. Live and learn. This is the oldest trick in the book, but it sure helps getting the tranny in place with less effort than normal. I just cut the ends off two long bolts and replaced the bellhousing studs with them. You just slide the transmission along the bolts/shafts. Since my wife and I put the trans in together, there was no one around to take any photos, but here it is in place. The rubber mount makes it difficult to get the frame member that is attached to the trans by the rubber mount into the space in the X-frame. I had to put the motor back on the lift and pull it up a bit so I could wrestle everything in place. It's a real bear of a job, but it's finally done and I'm hoping I'll never have to take it out again in my lifetime. Famous last words! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 20, 2015 Author Share Posted September 20, 2015 Remember those famous last words? I think I may have the clutch disk in backwards. When I depress the clutch pedal it looks like the clutch plate arms are making contct with the disk. On one side of the disk the center section projected outward about 3/8 of an inch. The other side was flat. I assumed the projecting side would not clear the bolts on the flywheel and that it should face toward the rear. I think I was wrong. Anyone have any ideas on this before I take everything back apart? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
countrytravler Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 I have not worked on anything older that the 50s car. I will be shortly. Almost impossible to put in backwards because the center part of the disk would hit the flywheel to crankshaft bolts and push the disk away from the flywheel. The disk would not sit flush with the flywheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 20, 2015 Author Share Posted September 20, 2015 My thinking exactly. Since the body is off and I have no floorboards for reference, perhaps I'm pushing the pedal too far forward and that is why the arms are going all the way to the disk. I can push the pedal in about two inches and it realeases the disk and I can spin the pinion shaft, so maybe I'm okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 (edited) Remember those famous last words? I think I may have the clutch disk in backwards. When I depress the clutch pedal it looks like the clutch plate arms are making contct with the disk. On one side of the disk the center section projected outward about 3/8 of an inch. The other side was flat. I assumed the projecting side would not clear the bolts on the flywheel and that it should face toward the rear. I think I was wrong. Anyone have any ideas on this before I take everything back apart?Taylormade....I don't know if this will help, but in my 1930 manual and my 1931 manual, it shows the longer part of the center hub (in the center of the disc) to be facing AWAY from the engine. Does that make sense? See #11 in the image.... Edited September 20, 2015 by keiser31 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 20, 2015 Author Share Posted September 20, 2015 Yes, that really helps. My manual is a bit harder to see. This is the way I put mine in, so I guess I'm good to go! Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JACK M Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I have never seen a clutch disc where the high side faces the flywheel. You guys are on the right track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 21, 2015 Author Share Posted September 21, 2015 Well, another fly in the ointment. My front U-joint was a greasy mess, so I decided to take a look inside to make sure everything was in decent shape. Lucky I did as the joint was worn out to the point that the bearings were turning in the housing. I think the shafts of the joint were so worn they became eccentric and started the bearings rotating. Anyway, it was a real mess and destined for an early and probably catastrophic failure in the near future. Luckily, I had a spare U-joint that came with my extra transmission. I took that one apart, too, just to make sure and everything seems to be in good shape. Now, and with no little worry, I have to take the rear joint apart and examine it. I assumed it was fine, but after the experience with the front joint I'm no longer sure of anything. Bottom line, I'm glad I dug into all parts of this car during the restoration as I have found bad seals, bearings, gaskets, gears and assorted other problems lurking under what appeared to be a solid car mechanically. I do have one question - a problem I need to solve. A part of the U-joint that rotates over a metal housing has a cork seal around its outer edge. You can see it in the following photo. It's black with grease, but it is cork and not rubber. As you can see, it's in rough shape, with a piece missing. It fits into a groove on the part. Any ideas how to fix/replace the seal? I might be able to cut a thin strip of cork from a sheet and get it into the grove. Another thought was to use an O-ring of the correct size, but I'm not sure if the rubber would allow smooth rotation on the opposing part. I'm more than open to any ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I would try to cut a circular cork gasket and slip it in the groove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 21, 2015 Author Share Posted September 21, 2015 I just bought some 3/16 inch cork sheet and I'll give it a try as soon as it arrives. I should be able to cut this with my circle cutter - we'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArticiferTom Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 You may find that some of that 3/16 x 3/16 rubberized cork used on headlight gasket would rap around in there . Filling Station Chevy sells it $2.50 for two I think . Tom PS Do you have pic of the cover for clutch hole above . Mine is covered with an oversize piece of pounded out white alum. rain gutter . IT MUST GO > Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayG Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Myers sells felt for that same application in the early DB's. Don't know if they are the same size but worth looking into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 PS Do you have pic of the cover for clutch hole above . Mine is covered with an oversize piece of pounded out white alum. rain gutter . IT MUST GO > Here's what mine looks like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArticiferTom Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Wow , I wasn't expecting that . What way is up ? What's nozzle for ? My alum had bunch hole in it, is this a ventilation something ? Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 The tube faces down into the bellhousing. It must be some sort of ventilation as the top is hollow to allow air to go in and down the tube. Just a guess, but that's the way they built them and it shows up in the Owners Manual looking exactly the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 Checked with Myers and that felt seal is about an inch too big. Looks like I'll be experimenting with cutting cork sheets. If that fails I might give the headlight corks a try. Thanks for the advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
countrytravler Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) I have not worked on anything older that the 50s car. I will be shortly. Almost impossible to put in backwards because the center part of the disk would hit the flywheel to crankshaft bolts and push the disk away from the flywheel. The disk would not sit flush with the flywheel. Pulling a 1934 Plymouth PE engine apart for the crankshaft that a customer needs. Do not know the history of the engine. A lot of crud around the bolts so I would guess it has not been apart for about 50 years. While removing the clutch, I had to loosen the bell housing to clear the pressure plate from the flywheel. YEP!! Disk was installed backwards. The raised part of the disk was towards the flywheel and it cleared. Marks on the flywheel studs and the disk springs hitting the crank studs. Bet the old mechanic couldn't diag the noise with clutch pedal pressed. Plus the disk has flywheel stamped on the spring retainer. SO YES! The disk can be installed backwards and it will turn freely. So be careful. Raised part is to be installed towards the pressure plate. Flat side towards flywheel. Edited September 22, 2015 by countrytravler (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 No stampings on mine, but I did manage to install it correctly. I noticed that the Owners Manual suggests marking the pressure plate so it can be installed back in the same way. Guess who didn't do that when the engine was pulled two years ago. I could find nothing on the pressure plate that indicated a direction or position, but both it and the disk were rebuilt, so I assume whatever position it once held is immaterial at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
countrytravler Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 No stampings on mine, but I did manage to install it correctly. I noticed that the Owners Manual suggests marking the pressure plate so it can be installed back in the same way. Guess who didn't do that when the engine was pulled two years ago. I could find nothing on the pressure plate that indicated a direction or position, but both it and the disk were rebuilt, so I assume whatever position it once held is immaterial at this point.I believe that is for balancing purposes only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 So does this mean I have a 1/6 chance that my clutch is balanced, since there are six mounting holes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 27, 2015 Author Share Posted September 27, 2015 The cork liner in my U-joints turned out to be a very easy fix. I dug out the old cork and could see that it was actually a cork strip, not a circular gasket as I had originally thought. All three steel cups that I have had cork with a small piece missing. I had originally thought it was damage to the gasket, but I saw the same thing on all three cups, so it just was a gap in the cork strip. Here is the cup and the old cork I managed to dig out of two of the cups. I bought a 3/16 inch cork sheet, cut a strip of the correct width and it fit right into the cup's groove with no problem. It went in with no problem and appeared exactly as the old cork had looked before I removed it - except it was clean and unworn. The design of the cup naturally slants the cork to fit against the ball it rides on. The completed U-joint ready to install. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 Excellent outcome on that seal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArticiferTom Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 Looks great, glad the sheet cork holds together when cut . Know does that get axle grease, rubbed on it, so it slides and seals or is it to keep water out ? On my clutch cover; pic in owner manual shows flat plate on cross sectional .So I know it not as complicated as your cover . I decided to roll top and bottom edge in 1/8" and put washer under it, at bolts . This will give cross ventilation but keep water, and dirt falling out . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
30dodge35 Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 looks great TMsuggestionconsider cutting gasket a little longerthen cut ends on 45 degree so if would sit on topof itself a little dap of Varnish on cut end would keep it togetherthat way you would not have gap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinneyhill Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 (edited) The gap was probably there because the cork has shrunk with age, during which it dries out. NOS cork gasket sets are not useful without fettling for that reason. Rubber (well, neoprene or similar) impregnated cork might not suffer that to the same extent. Anyway, I agree with 30dodge35. No gap is best, it keeps in what is in and out what is not wanted. Put a good smear of grease on it before assembly. Edited September 27, 2015 by Spinneyhill (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted September 30, 2015 Author Share Posted September 30, 2015 Some progress over the last few days. Relined emergency brake and hardware installed. Top of the transmission (shift gate levers and seals) rebuilt and installed. Resleeved master cylinder hooked up. Rebuilt starter installed. I know the stainless cover isn't stock, but I like it and it's staying. And finally, the lubrication tube for the throwout bearing. My grease fitting had been torn off long ago and part of the braided line went with it. Luckily, fellow DB Club member Larry Yirga had a spare and I traded some of my new braided line for the fitting. Thanks again, Larry, and I'll deliver the line to you at Hershey. (That one bolt is temporary until I find the original DB bolt.) I'm hoping to have the driveshaft painted and in before I leave for PA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ply33 Posted September 30, 2015 Share Posted September 30, 2015 That master cylinder looks more like the later '30s truck one than the one on my '33. Same dimensions from mounting flange to outlet, same mounting holes so it bolts in fine but the reservoir is a slightly different size so the original cover with its different filler/vent won't fit. Or maybe Dodge used the style you have all along and it was just Plymouth that used something different in the early '30s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
30dodge35 Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 Looking great, I like the stainless strap too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted October 1, 2015 Author Share Posted October 1, 2015 That master cylinder looks more like the later '30s truck one than the one on my '33. Same dimensions from mounting flange to outlet, same mounting holes so it bolts in fine but the reservoir is a slightly different size so the original cover with its different filler/vent won't fit. Or maybe Dodge used the style you have all along and it was just Plymouth that used something different in the early '30s.That's the master cylinder that was on the car when I bought it in 1965 - unless Phil changed it after I sold it to him. I've never asked him about that despite our many conversations. My owner's manual does show some sort of weird filler cap thingy, so I guess it must have been changed at some point in the car's history. Although I'm trying my best to keep the car original, things like the vacuum clutch mechanism had been taken off before I bought the car. Same for the huge, box-like air cleaner. Since I want to drive my car before I croak, some things are just going to have to remain as they were when I first owned Daphne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil 32DL6 Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 - unless Phil changed it after I sold it to him.No, I never swapped out Daphne's master cylinder. I was meaning to rebuild it, though. I even still have the kit I ordered from J.C Whitney. Here's a pic of what's in my latest DL...which I know got worked on by the previous owner, so I can't say whether or not it's the original and got rebuilt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ply33 Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 My original looks like this (after I got too aggressive with black paint): The ones you have are, I think, still available: http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx/Brake-Master-Cylinder-Remfd/_/R-NMBP41095_0421574247 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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