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Guest countrywill

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Guest countrywill

Do you use engine oil when reassembeling the motor or do you use assebely lube. and what do you recommend for trans fluid and brake fluid

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My personal preference is motor oil for the pistons/rings and assembly lube for everything else. I also spin the oil pump to fill the galleys before starting. Everyday ATF for the trans and DOT 5 for the brakes if all brake components are new...........Bob

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Assembly lube is a "sticky, clingy" sort of oily product. GM/ACDelco has some little bottles in their chemical selection. For camshaft lobes, especially NEW ones, there is the moly paste which should be smeared liberally on the lobes themselves. I always put some on the backside of the timing chain's cam sproket, too . . . and other areas which are usually oiled by "splash" on a modern pressurized lube system . . . hence they don't get pressurized oil to these places. Putting some motor oil on the timing chain/gears is a good idea, too.

For the older-style rubberized cork or pure cork gaskets (valve cover, oil pan, etc.), with time, the thinner parts of the motor oil will start to "wick" through the cork. Once that starts, it won't stop unless you change brands of motor oil. One late friend cussed Castrol GTX as it leaked, but using Pennzoil didn't leak. I found that curious and consulted my machine shop operative, you mentioned the wicking action. I guess many of the valve cover gasket leaks we've experienced over the decades was due to that, rather than (thought to be) poorly-stamped valve covers. So . . . what I started to do, earlier on, was to use black high-temp silicone sealer to "glue" the gaskets on rather than the typical "Yellow 3M sealer". From that point, after hearing of the wicking situation, I started to put a thin coat of the black silicone on each surface of the cork-type gaskets when I replaced them. Not a thick coat, just a "skin coat". I'd let it cure for about a day before I assembled everything. No more valve cover leaks, even on 4-bolt valve covers. Quick, simple, easy to do, and somewhat incognito (if you use black, unless you have a red engine where you can use the red version). PLUS, should you ever need to take that gasket off in the future, the silicone will make removal and clean-up much easier and cleaner . . . after having spent MUCH time scraping that "yellow stuff" off of valve covers and cylinder heads, by comparison, in prior times.

Just a few additional items to Bob's great comments.

Happy Holidays!

NTX5467

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Guest countrywill

Well There was fluid it 10 months ago when i parked it and now its enpty with no signs of leaking anywere, I ony had the car for 2 months prior to that and dont know what the previus owner used. What would be better to use for installing the crank, lube or oil. Please keep in mind I have never rebuilt a engine before, so if the question s sound dumb you know why. how about the trans fluid? from my knoledge of this beast its all original minus the fuel/ vacum pump and possibly the water pump. is there any books on rebuilding the straight 8 engine? thanks for the input so far guys.

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Oil will work OK for the crank journals but Assem. fluid is stickier and is purpose made for what you are doing. For the current brakes I would use DOT 3. You can pull a wheel cylinder apart and see what the fluid smells like. Again, modern ATF for the tranny if it's a Dynaflow. Overwhelming chance it's DOT 3. If there was fluid in it and now dry it's leaking somewhere. Most likely wheel cylinders or rotted out line/hose. Now would be a very good time to replace the braking system Lines, hoses, wheel cylinders, rebuild the master and shoes. Then you can choose to use whatever fluid you please. If you don't already have a shop manual for your car it is pretty much a requirement to repair/maintain your car. There are fewer and fewer repair shops that have even a clue how to work on old iron. The shop manual will tell you what fluids it used when new. Some are no longer available but modern replacements work better..............Bob

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Guest countrywill

Ive got the manual but have noticed some of it is kinda veag on some things. Thanks again for the info. somtimes its hard to get advice from people.

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countrywill: Let me be the first to welcome you to our close, nicely knit and harmonious family of advice sayers, poetic pathetics (like myself) , cut throat nay sayers and down n dirty deal dogging daggers. But seriously, all in all, were all really just a bunch of nice, vibrant and overall great set of folks to hang with. So just ask us and you should be able to get some very colorful if not useful advice here from time to time.

Don't use synthetics in your old engine use Dino oils. Listen to these guys they know from what they speak. Personally, I use assembly lubes on any items that will have impact or friction upon initial startup. Old manuals can be had just about anywhere you care to look. Initially, buy only GM shop manuals as a base reference guide. Then you can move out into Motors Manuals and other shop repair manuals.

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Countrywill

Welcome

I've been building big block Buicks (455s) and 500cu.in. Caddies (here and there) for a few years

to make a bit of spending loot in retirement.

After ensuring your engine oil passages, pump, and machined surfaces are good to go

I always use a Molybdenum Di-sulfate based engine assembly lube when re assembling.

Redline and Federal Mogul I believe market these as well as a few others.

It is meant to be "clingy". They ALL recommend a "pre-lube" by spinning that oil pump up

to pressure BEFORE an initial startup.

For the initial startup get a 12 or 16 once bottle of pure zinc additive and put it in the

crankcase. They aren't kidding when they say that the first 20 minutes of break-in time is critical.

Esp. to the cam lobe/lifter/bearing surfaces.

Try not to "wash down" the cylinders and combustion chambers with fuel on initial startup!

Make sure the timing is correct and have spark at the plugs; and that there is sufficient fuel flow from pump to carb BEFORE

cranking the Heck out of it. Resist the urge to Pour gas down the carb! A bit of coaxing with a "spritz" of

starting fluid or atomized gasoline is fine.

Initial startup is NOT the time for trouble shooting ignition or fuel

problems. Keep in mind that all that unburned gas foes directly to the oil pan and acts

like solvent to strip away any oil or assembly lube.

Be prepared to cool the engine properly with a full cooling system, working radiator,

and a BIG fan in front of the radiator. If all this goes well, let the startup oil with the

zinc in it do it's job for a 100 miles or so; then drain it an put some fresh oil in it (with a little zinc additive).

All this will ensure a strong, long lasting motor.

mike

Roadmaster75

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I have been using Castrol LM (Low Moisture) DOT 3. With DOT 3 the best practice is to flush the system every year. Just use an old turkey baster to remove the old fluid from the reservoir and fill with fresh. Then bleed each wheel cylinder until nice clear fluid comes out. This is brake day. Check all the holes, lines, and clips. Sit in the driver's seat grip the steering wheel firmly and push the brakes as hard as you can, like your son or daughter just ran in front of you. Then you are good for the year and corrosive moisture is gone from the system.

DOT 5 carries too much of the "do it once and forget it" stigma for me.

If you bought a car and don't know what is in it just remove little fluid and put it in a small saucer. Put a few drops of water in it. With DOT 5 the water will bead up and bounce on the surface; DOT3 will allow the water to mix right in.

Bernie

Oh, afraid to push on the brake pedal real hard? Remember that next time you wake up at 3 AM.

Edited by 60FlatTop (see edit history)
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Well There was fluid it 10 months ago when i parked it and now its enpty with no signs of leaking anywere, ...

Please keep in mind I have never rebuilt a engine before, so if the question s sound dumb you know why. ..

I applaude you for tackling your first engine rebuild. And without attempting to discourage you, I would suggest you do a lot of research into this particular engine before taking anything apart.

Two items stick out to me as red flags. First, I believe this engine does not have insert bearings for the crankshaft. I am not certain but I believe it has poured babbit bearings. This is a totally different process in a rebuild than modern cars.

Second is the existance of high nickle content in the Buick engine parts. I think it is understood that things like valve guides & seats should not be replaced

because this material is already hardened and sits very close to the water jacket in the head of the engine. Again, for a 48 I may be wrong about that, but that is why I recommend research before disassembly.

I am certain any question you ask here will be answered based on the experience of the members of this forum. So feel free to ask away. Also I recommend checking around your area for experienced mechanics who may have spent some years with this Buick. They are certain to have many good ideas about what you will need to do to make this rebuild a success.

Good luck and post some pictures. I know I like to see what others are up to.

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Guest Rob McDonald

WILL IN THE COUNTRY, the advice is flowing beautifully here. I've never owned a straight eight Buick (yet), so I'm only kibitzing here.

Post #8 - "pull a wheel cylinder apart and see what the fluid smells like" BOB, what's the difference in smell between Dot 3 and Dot 5? Dot 5 is silicone fluid, right?

Post #9 - Yeah, Buick shop manuals were not well written. In the 50s, Chrysler was way better at explaining things for their mechanics (and for do-it-your-selfers, half a century later). Just keep reading the same loopy paragraph over and over, while looking at the actual part of the car that's being described. Eventually, it'll make sense.

Post #11 - Keep reading these Forums and, at some point, David will treat you to some classic beat poetry.

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I knew when I offered the smell test it was dependant on familiarity with DOT 3 which has a pretty distinctive smell. Dot 5 has little odor. I figured if the car was old and already had a compromised brake system whatever fluid in it would be grungy and hard to tell what it might be visually. Hence the smell test. Of course if the OP has no idea what dot 3 smells like it would have little relevance unless he bought a small can to compare against. Which is what I might have done. And that's my story and I'm sticking to it.....................Bob

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Guest chevy_dude97
Countrywill

Welcome

I've been building big block Buicks (455s) and 500cu.in. Caddies (here and there) for a few years

to make a bit of spending loot in retirement.

After ensuring your engine oil passages, pump, and machined surfaces are good to go

I always use a Molybdenum Di-sulfate based engine assembly lube when re assembling.

Redline and Federal Mogul I believe market these as well as a few others.

It is meant to be "clingy". They ALL recommend a "pre-lube" by spinning that oil pump up

to pressure BEFORE an initial startup.

For the initial startup get a 12 or 16 once bottle of pure zinc additive and put it in the

crankcase. They aren't kidding when they say that the first 20 minutes of break-in time is critical.

Esp. to the cam lobe/lifter/bearing surfaces.

Try not to "wash down" the cylinders and combustion chambers with fuel on initial startup!

Make sure the timing is correct and have spark at the plugs; and that there is sufficient fuel flow from pump to carb BEFORE

cranking the Heck out of it. Resist the urge to Pour gas down the carb! A bit of coaxing with a "spritz" of

starting fluid or atomized gasoline is fine.

Initial startup is NOT the time for trouble shooting ignition or fuel

problems. Keep in mind that all that unburned gas foes directly to the oil pan and acts

like solvent to strip away any oil or assembly lube.

Be prepared to cool the engine properly with a full cooling system, working radiator,

and a BIG fan in front of the radiator. If all this goes well, let the startup oil with the

zinc in it do it's job for a 100 miles or so; then drain it an put some fresh oil in it (with a little zinc additive).

All this will ensure a strong, long lasting motor.

mike

Roadmaster75

I agree completely here, as I have rebuilt alot of motors and the only thing I can add to this is use non-detergent oil for break in.

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WILL IN THE COUNTRY, the advice is flowing beautifully here. I've never owned a straight eight Buick (yet), so I'm only kibitzing here.

Post #8 - "pull a wheel cylinder apart and see what the fluid smells like" BOB, what's the difference in smell between Dot 3 and Dot 5? Dot 5 is silicone fluid, right?

Post #9 - Yeah, Buick shop manuals were not well written. In the 50s, Chrysler was way better at explaining things for their mechanics (and for do-it-your-selfers, half a century later). Just keep reading the same loopy paragraph over and over, while looking at the actual part of the car that's being described. Eventually, it'll make sense.

Post #11 - Keep reading these Forums and, at some point, David will treat you to some classic beat poetry.

Yeah Rob. Forgot about that post or posts with all the ramble-on poetry. It was funny. Did you ever save it or know what happened to them?

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Guest countrywill

Thanks for the help and advise. This definatly has been inresting. Thanks to 1 bad Babbit connecting rod I had to have the cranck rewelded and ground, which produced another problem. The shop didnt have long enough equpment to clean it up so it got sent out and forgotten for a month. almost everything ive pulled in the motor needed to be replaced. It was to much cash to have the babbit repoured, so i got a new set of connecting rods. Im just rebuilding the lower end of it right now the head seems to be in good working order but could use a good cleaning. thanks again. heres acouple of pics of the beast.

post-85525-143139295926_thumb.jpg

post-85525-143139295895_thumb.jpg

post-85525-143139295912_thumb.jpg

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