Guest crazytrain2 Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 It's beeen about 6 months or so since I shelled out the money for a new accumulator. Had some line air issues at first but worked them out, however still didn't seem I was getting many "dead Engine" brake pumps, 4 or 5 if I remember correctly. Anyhow, no for no known reason this morning brake pedal is stiff as a board. Can barely get car to even stop. I popped the hood, pumpped brakes 8 or 9 times then turned key and not a sound from pump motor. I checked fluid and it is higher than when it was when working (now almost above the resevoir intake) Haven't had the chance to check much elsse (plus Ronnie's site down for maint) But I did notice on the 1989 Electra 3.8 w/ABS the 3 electrical relays must be under the dash? wiring from teves motor and sensor fed down the steering column with the rest of electrical harness. Any help, suggestions - simple stuff first.When will the hurting end?Thank you all very much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 The link below will help you as well as the photo below. The relays are under the hood, mounted to the top of the firewall. (see photo) Reatta Owners Journal has been down today. It's back online but all the tutorials are not showing. I'm still working on getting it back to normal.Brake Pump & ABS Fuse Location - Reatta Owners Journal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mc_Reatta Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 Could be blown fuse, bad pump relay, bad pressure switch, or bad pump. Don't know where the relay or fuse is in a Park Ave.If you have a DVM you can check the switch, relay, and fuse. You can jump 12 volts to the pump and see if that works or not before you go getting some expensive parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 Sorry, I didn't read close enough. I assumed you were working on a Reatta. It's been a long day for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crazytrain2 Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 No apologies neccesary Ronnie, I can't tell you how much I appreciate being able to slip a few questions in when they are pertinent to the Reatta's. It seems there is a 4 or 5 wire plug attached to the pump motor, and 2 or 3 wire plug on the sensor. Do you know which of these (motor wires) I would use for connecting directly to 12V for short period of time to test the motor?Also I looked for the firewall mounted relays and coudn't find them, not even under a cover or anythind. The wire bundle coming from the ABS Unit as a whole fed down through the stering column shaft into the car. Thats why I'm guessing relays are under the dash? I even saw one site for a Ranger where the relays were under the front drivers seat !Thanks again for any and all help Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mc_Reatta Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I also think they are under the dash or in the console in your PA. You can figure out if the relay and fuse are OK by checking the connectors on the Teves, but if they are bad you will have to track them down to fix.I'll try to find a photo of the connectors on the pressure switch and pump to help you troubleshoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crazytrain2 Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Thanks guys ! Also thought it worth mentioning there is ne reference to which fuse carries the load for the ABS motor / relays. It's not listed on the fuse panel cover nor in the owners manual, so guess I'll be pulling and checking each of them, or at least the 30 & 20 amp ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mc_Reatta Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 In the Reatta it's a stand alone 5 amp in-line fuse that powers the pump relay thru the pressure switch. If you find the relay, the fuse should be nearby.There is a 30 amp in-line fuse that powers the EBCM module in the trunk.The pump is powered by a fuseable link thru the pump relay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jimmyk Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 My Reatta had this same symptom, hard pedal. Took both feet to stop the car. Try unplugging the plug to the pump pressure switch. Jumper these two pins. If the pump runs, then you will know that the problem is the switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Eaton Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 The GM Teves manual is not real specific on the relay location for your PA, but it suggest they are on the drivers side firewall near the fender.The pump motor only has two contacts and as suggested above, by running 12v directly to the pump motor you can test the motor.You can test the relay and motor by unplugging the pressure switch and grounding the (on a Reatta the wire is grey with red stripe) wire in the plug. This picks the relay coil and sends 12v to the motor. If this works, then the pressure switch is a strong suspect.Jim Finn suggest you unplug the pressure switch connector and look for moisture. If moisture is present, it is most likely brake fluid that is leaking past the internal seals of the pressure switch and that will cause problems with pressure settings and eventually fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crazytrain2 Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) Again, thanks for the help! If I understand correctly I can:1) Disconnect the pressure switch (see attached pic) and jump the two lead . This should tell me: a) If motor runs it's likely a bad switch or relay, but motor is ok.2) If motor runs try jumping one of the two wires from the switch and relay or should I just test the relay if its good then likely bad pressure switch? NOTE: Forgot to mention I'll be looking for and checking the in line fuses first.Sanity check?update:Just tried to jump the two (2) pin outs from what I thought was pressure sensor. Turns out Pressure sensor plug has five (5) leads.? Edited November 7, 2012 by crazytrain2 add picture - update pin outs on pressure sensor (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mc_Reatta Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) Yes, assuming your PA has the same wire colors as an 89 Reatta, if you remove the connector from the pressure switch and jump the gray/red wire at pin A to the black wire at pin D with the ignition key on, you will engage the relay which should cause the pump to run. The red/black wire at pin B signals the BCM that the pressure is low and turns the red warning light on. The purple wire at pin C and the blue/orange wire at pin E tell the EBCM in the trunk that there is low pressure, and or the fluid level is low.If the pump runs by jumping pins A and D then the switch is bad. If the pump doesn't run, then it would be good if you can use a DVM or test light on the two wires in the pump connector to see if there is voltage there while jumping the pressure switch. If yes then pump is bad, if not then either fuse or relay is bad. Edited November 7, 2012 by Mc_Reatta (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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