HPOF Question

[Chris Paulsen]

I have a question regarding HPOF certification and I will try to approach it delicately.

There was a car at Hershey that I see just received it's HPOF certification. This very car was in our family from 1986 until 2009. It was restored in the early 1970's and I can say with certainty there was nothing left unrestored on the car. It was painted top to bottom, new upholstery, new top, all done about 40 years ago. It is authentic, but absolutely not original.

Is there any way to find out what part of the car was judged to be original? It was my understanding the HPOF catagory was to authenticate cars or features of cars that are original and can serve as a guide to restorers in the future.

I would appreciate any feedback.

Thank you,

Chris Paulsen

McPherson, KS

[Matt Harwood]

That's a good question, Chris. I saw more than a few cars in the HPOF category that were quite clearly restored, or had major restored parts (like original interior, but completely repainted). There was one late-40s Chrysler of some kind that was completely restored in HPOF--it was WAY too nice to be original in any way, shape or form. I figured he merely signed up for the wrong class, but maybe not...

I read the guidelines, but I have to wonder how thoroughly these things are checked. My '41 Cadillac, which is unquestionably a 98% original car, went through the process and they mostly just asked my opinion, looked it over quickly, and moved on. There was not much close scrutiny, even though a few folks in the Car Corral all week accused me of replacing the interior (it's that nice). I understand that there's time involved with a thorough inspection, but the judging on my car was over in less than 5 minutes and they merely asked me "Is there anything not original?" I told them about battery, tires, hoses, belts, plugs, wires, etc, they nodded, then moved on. I kind of suspect that the left rear fender of my car has been painted, but I can't tell for sure and was counting on the HPOF experts to help me out in that area, but they didn't even look at the paint.

Maybe they just take the owner's word for it?

[Chris Paulsen]

Thanks, Matt. That's sort of what I was thinking. I very much appreciate the judges, but this has me baffled. My father and I are currently preparing our 1911 Paige-Detroit for HPOF. It is absolutely original (paint, upholstery, etc) and we are doing everything we can to preserve every thing we possibly can, but something like this has me wondering why we are taking such great lengths.

[MCHinson]

I know of a car that was not certified at Charlotte due to the HPOF team looking at the car and discovering that it had been repainted. The owner was not aware that it had been repainted, but the HPOF team examination revealed that it had been repainted. I had previously assumed it to be original, due to the current owner being told it was original paint. After he did not received the HPOF certification, I looked at the car closely and decided that the HPOF team was correct.

I suspect that the team faces a real challenge of trying to take adequate time at the Hershey meet, due to the large car count. The number of judges at Hershey this year was also a bit less than normal.

In anything done by humans, we are going to occasionally have errors. I don't know a way to totally avoid mistakes.

Chris, I would suggest you might want to consider sending a letter or email to the VP of class judging explaining your concerns about this having happened. I don't know if it is possible to correct the error at this time, but I know that the VP of class judging is very serious about maintaining the quality of the judging process. I would think that he would want to know about this.

[stock_steve]

We brought back our previously HPOF-certified 20,000-original-miles '73 Ford Pinto for another, what we thought, "low-key participation outing" within the HPOF class, at this year's Hershey Fall Meet.

Not having done so last year, we were fairly surprised to see we had been entered into "HPOF Original," which apparently is a more rigorous examination of the car. And we had to fill out a questionnaire prior to judging as well, listing things we were aware of that were not original.

Maybe this is an attempt by AACA to try to weed out (to some extent anyway) some of the "restored but passed off as original" cars that had previously earned their yellow HPOF grill badge.

The judging team that evaluated our Pinto looked to take a good amount of time scrutinizing the car, and I think were pretty darned serious about satisfying themselves as to the originality of the car. I might add that they were very courteous through the process, and thanked us for bringing our car.

My two cents anyway.

[Chris Paulsen]

I appreciate the comments very much. I think the judges do a great and thank-less job. I understand the human element and know mistakes happen.

This is a car from the early 'teens with shiney paint and upholstery that has been painted. It is a great car that we toured and enjoyed for many years, and it was great to see it out, but I am surprised to see so many people confuse it with an original car. Is there a way I could contact the current owner to let him know what history we know of the car?

I will contact the VP of class judging.

Thanks again,

Chris

[Restorer32]

Bear in mind that a repaint only wouldn't necessarily eliminate a car from HPOF.

[Belvedere]

The list of vehicles awarded AACA Original at Hershey was mighty long. I wonder if anyone was denied the award. Hopefully it wasn't a blanket certification.

Since the addition of vehicles 25 years old to HPOF, it seems to have attracted many late model antiques whose owners in some cases don't want to do anything to the car (like cleaning it) under the guise of keeping it original. Many of those late models could have benefitted from a little wash 'n wax and vacuuming, and still have been original.

On the other hand, I can think of several that I wonder why they are wasting their time in HPOF. As they appeared, could have more than likely received a 1st Junior and Senior. Many original cars have achieved that award. It also begs the question, is that particular vehicle such an outstanding original, or has "too much" restoration been done?

My HOPF vehicle was certified when 35 years was the rule, and I considered it quite an honor. Not sure today.

[MCHinson]

Restorer32,

As I understand it from the HPOF CJE in Charlotte, a total repaint should exclude a car from HPOF.

[Chris Paulsen]

Restorer32, I agree. My 1910 Ford has the original upholstery on the seats and door panels. If it hadn't won it's Senior in 1982, I believe it could be considered for HPOF based solely on those features. I've seen lots of early cars receive HPOF certification because of original seats. No problem there.

The car I was asking about was completely repainted (body, fenders, hood, axles, chassis, engine, wheels), re-upholstered (seats, carpets, door panels) and had a new top put on it.