new find-1929 Dodge 1/2 ton

[wyobob]

In these posts above there are references to 6 areas where the serial #s have been found (I think maybe 2 of them were private emails) The "8" is in a circle about 3/4 in. high, located on the drivers side frame just about centered between the front spring brackets. Locations where others found serial # are left frame behind spring mount, a plate on the cowl, drivers side towards engine, top flange of drivers side frame between spring mounts, tag on passenger toe board, and pass. side front frame.

In reading the parts book, I found that later models had an electric fuel pump ( this one does) made by United Motors Service. I thought someone had removed the vacuum tank! Lots of learning going on in Spotted Horse.

[Guest 1930]

I believe you are mis-reading something, later models would have had a mechanical fuel pump but that would be a later model than yours.

[Guest DodgeKCL]

I just had a thought. A 1929 plymouth is a Model U. I wonder if this truck is a Model U Truck as in 'UT'?

[wyobob]

In the "Dodge Bros.Truck Master Parts list" the first entry on page T-14-7 is for Oil and Gasoline Pump prior to fuel pump #319947, on page T-14-17 bottom left hand column is the part # for the vacuum tank #304682. I will post a photo of the item in question as well as the "8" on the frame.

[wyobob]

Here is the electric fuel pump 1 line in from gas tank, other line to carb. The sediment bulb is gone, the electric wire is visible just above the street ell on the left side of photo. The other photo is the "8" Robert

[Guest 1930]

I just had a thought. A 1929 plymouth is a Model U. I wonder if this truck is a Model U Truck as in 'UT'?

The U indicates a Plymouth engine 4 cyl, all early 4 cyl Plymouth powered trucks are U,s

[Guest 1930]

In the "Dodge Bros.Truck Master Parts list" the first entry on page T-14-7 is for Oil and Gasoline Pump prior to fuel pump #319947, on page T-14-17 bottom left hand column is the part # for the vacuum tank #304682. I will post a photo of the item in question as well as the "8" on the frame.

They are referring to a vacuum tank, after vacuum tank came the mechanical fuel pump. That pump you have will be aftermarket.

I dont believe there was such a thing as an electric fuel pump until sometime in the 50s when fuel injection was made popular but I may be off on that.

[wyobob]

Has anyone ever seen a fuel pump like this truck has ?

[wyobob]

Futher research last night shows that the wooden wheels, bearings, seals and steering wheel are the same part numbers as Plymouth " U " I think the gauges are too. They should of called these Plymouth pickups.

[R.White]

Futher research last night shows that the wooden wheels, bearings, seals and steering wheel are the same part numbers as Plymouth " U " I think the gauges are too. They should of called these Plymouth pickups.

I hope you are not going to abandon us for the Plymouth forum just as we were getting to know you??

Ray

[1936 D2]

I wire brushed that area and used a magnifing glass, still don't see a thing-thanks

I will pass on a bit of my experience with cleaning these numbers.

I would suggest only using the wire brush very judiciously. Be sure to only use a fine wire - not coarse for sure. If you have a fine brass wire wheel that is even better. The wheel is only used to get the bulk of the rough rust off the surface you want to check out. You don't really want to get down into the good metal with a wheel because that will leave scratches (that's why brass is better also) and could disrupt the ability to read or make out any numbers you may find. The scratches could also effectively change a number.

Then, once you are in a possible location, you want to use a 200-300 grit wet/dry paper on your fingers to start to get to the point of seeing numbers. Go over the whole location so as to not miss any numbers spread out at the front or end of the series. There sometimes could be numbers before or after a dash for instance and you may miss them. This process will then look like "ferrellg's" or "Jack M's" photos above.

If you would then like a more complete or photoable version of the number. Use a 600 grit wet/dry paper on a block. You want to almost polish the area of the numbers so that the background is near mirror smooth and the numbers are still indented into the background. With that in mind, you do not want to block sand this area so much that you start to lose numbers that may be on a high spot, usually one end or the other. Just keep checking it out as you go. The main idea is to get the mirrored background. Then the numbers will be in their most readable state.

If you then want to photo the numbers, try to not let the flash of your camera hit directly on the polished area. You want to use a reflected flash, off camera flash, or a side lighting technique. Diffused side lighting is usually the best, especially if the numbers all have lines in the same general direction. Then place the light to shine across these lines to produce the darkest shadow in the bottom of the stamped numbers as possible. Move the light around and up and down until the best contrast is found. Lower is usually better. That will give the best photo and make for the most readable numbers. If you have to, take a couple shots with lighting at different angles so as to make out the other parts of the stamped numbers by getting the shadows down into different parts of the stampings.

Good luck!

Edited October 13, 2012 by 1936 D2 (see edit history)

[1936 D2]

Two other things:

- "wyobob", is it at all possible for you to make higher resolution photos than 320x240's above? Those are not much bigger than the thumbnails shown in your #45 post above. Hard to see details at all.

- Is it possible this vehicle is of Canadian manufacture? Weren't Canadian Dodges built on Plymouth bases?

[wyobob]

Well, I will have to admit that I sneak over to that forum late at night when no one is looking. Thanks for the serial # info, I think I have not been agressive enough-there is a lot of old paint & rust I will post bigger photos when I find that serial #, unless you want to see the fuel pump better? As to Canadian manufacture, I have no idea.

Edited October 13, 2012 by wyobob (see edit history)

[R.White]

Well, I will have to admit that I sneak over to that forum late at night when no one is looking. QUOTE]

I expect you go in disguise ?:cool:

Edited October 13, 2012 by R.White (see edit history)

[29dodgetruck]

yes i agree with george. on the 30 u133 i have is in the same place. here is a reference you might want to save to your favorites. type in dodge truck vin decoder. click on the first link you see. you should see 1936to1980 dodge trucks. look down til you see some squares and look for the one that says serial#'s 1914 to 1946. click on that one. then look for image 12 and 13. that will confirm your serial # will begin with a p and will be within the range of 1001 to 8183. and agian like george said be carefull cleaning around the number. it is stamped but it is really faint. you might have to play with a light to get the right visual on it. hope this helps.

[29dodgetruck]

do you have a steering column at all or do you just need parts?

[wyobob]

Thanks for the info, tomorrow I'm going to work on that area behind the front spring hanger, I really want to find that number! Will look at the vin decoder also.

[29dodgetruck]

sorry, i did not read whole post before comenting but if i am not mistakeing if you have a vacume tank, doesn't the oil pump some how work the vacume tank. because on the side of the block on my 4 cylinder plymouth engine it says oil-vac where the oil pump is. and also i was told that the plymouth silver dome engine in the trucks are different than in the plymouth cars. if found this out looking for a water pump. they are in different locations for the dodge and plymouth engines even tho they are all called plymouth silver dome.

[wyobob]

The steering wheel and spokes are shot so I thought it would be easiest to replace the whole column. If any of you guys want to see lots of high resolution photos just email me and I will send you the link to my Picasa site. rsorenson@hotmail.com

[Guest 1930]

sorry, i did not read whole post before comenting but if i am not mistakeing if you have a vacume tank, doesn't the oil pump some how work the vacume tank. because on the side of the block on my 4 cylinder plymouth engine it says oil-vac where the oil pump is. and also i was told that the plymouth silver dome engine in the trucks are different than in the plymouth cars. if found this out looking for a water pump. they are in different locations for the dodge and plymouth engines even tho they are all called plymouth silver dome.

Can you refresh my memory a bit more on this oil-vac system, I just recently read a well written article ( it was written and published in 1929 if I remember correctly ) concerning this ( how it worked ) but I did not pay enough attention and have lost the details. I think I can find it again, the book I mean but it will take some time.

It just came back to me, yes the oil-vac ( or vacuum fuel canister as we like to call it ) was operated in unison with the oil pump, I remember reading that this was to refute the tendency of losing vacuum when climbing a hill or what have you.

Now that I think about it was not the oil-vac a Kingston tank? I believe George has this set-up on his truck. I will need to look into this further, try and gather some more info.

Do you have this set-up on your truck 29Dodgetruck?

I know you say .............because on the side of the block on my 4 cylinder plymouth engine it says oil-vac where the oil pump is............but is your set-up in one piece all together.

Can you post some pictures of this?

I am thinking this is what Bob had originally on his truck.

I would guess that it was tossed out and replaced with that electric pump for the same reason the Kingston conventional vacuum tanks were, lack of service and parts. Inconvenient to service.

Edited October 14, 2012 by 1930 (see edit history)

[Guest 1930]

Here is that link by the way Serial Number Guide

These books pop up on e-bay every now and again cheap

[Guest 1930]

sorry, i did not read whole post before comenting but if i am not mistakeing if you have a vacume tank, doesn't the oil pump some how work the vacume tank. because on the side of the block on my 4 cylinder plymouth engine it says oil-vac where the oil pump is. and also i was told that the plymouth silver dome engine in the trucks are different than in the plymouth cars. if found this out looking for a water pump. they are in different locations for the dodge and plymouth engines even tho they are all called plymouth silver dome.

I am under the assumption that the truck engines were identical with the car except some of the bolt on items so it is of interest that you say Oil vac was placed on the side of the block, was it stamped in or was it part of the casting? Any pictures would help.

[Guest 1930]

I dont think George would mind me posting pictures here of his tank out of the truck but I would have to downsize them all first and that means a bit of work so I wont bother unless someone here would be interested in seeing them. Let me know

Boy this is frustrating because for some reason now I think I have a brochure on this oil-vac. I will see if that is true, I remember disregarding it at the time because I thought it would never pertain to anything I would ever need.

[Guest 1930]

Looked and cannot find it, maybe if it does exist it will pop up evenatually

[Guest 1930]

There is an interesting discussion here.... http://forums.aaca.org/f120/oil-vac-vacuum-tanks-181981.html

[Guest 1930]

Hello Bob, if you are interested I would sell you a re-print Plymouth master parts book, I bought it, found it too be poor quality ( binding stinks ) and so bought an original.

Still in like new condition, Id have to find out what the new cost and would sell if for 1/2 that. Let me know

[farrellg]

Here are a couple pictures of the oil vac I have on the 1931 U124. Although I thought the 1930 U133 was the same, it. Is not. The 1930 has something different. Last photo. May be a Stewart. The 1931 gets its vacuum from the oil pump.

[wyobob]

Hello Bob, if you are interested I would sell you a re-print Plymouth master parts book, I bought it, found it too be poor quality ( binding stinks ) and so bought an original.

Still in like new condition, Id have to find out what the new cost and would sell if for 1/2 that. Let me know

Thanks.but I was too impatient and ordered one last week, Bob

[wyobob]

Here are a couple pictures of the oil vac I have on the 1931 U124. Although I thought the 1930 U133 was the same, it. Is not. The 1930 has something different. Last photo. May be a Stewart. The 1931 gets its vacuum from the oil pump.

Thanks for the photos, I had never heard of the oil vac before, I'm betting mine was removed & replaced with that weird electric pump I have ,

[29dodgetruck]

sorry for not answering sooner. i will get a pic or two and post it. i pulled the motor out so i should be able to get a good shot.

[Guest DodgeKCL]

Just a word about the car and truck engines being the same. I don't know about the early engines such as used in this UT but later on when you see the 'T' designation on an engine such as 'T-12' or 'T-5' in 1933/34/35, the engines are built tougher for the trucks than the cars they came from. The accesories will exchange but the parts inside of a truck engine may,or may not, be the same as a car. However with that said if any part physically interchanges and you only have a car part, I would use the car part as the truck part was there for hard use. Something the truck will never see again.

[Guest 1930]

Internally as far as from what I have read there were no differences, exterior items such as manifolds, carbs, added pulleys ect but nothing internally that I am aware of at least up until 32 or so.

Maybe someone here knows something different

[Guest ev57]

Hello Bob

Attached are photos of number found on the Passenger side frame rail of a 28 Senior.

Erik

[wyobob]

Thanks, no wonder I can't find it !

[Guest 1930]

The truck and autos are not in the same place

[Ron Lawson]

ev57 Would you be able to post some pictures of the Senior 6 that you photo graphed the frame of thankyou Ron

[Guest 1930]

Hello Bob, I cant tell from the pictures you sent me if you are missing this or maybe its still there but plugged off. 29 dodgetruck sent me these pics and I am still working on trying to confirm things but I believe at this point that this is what you should be looking for along with the correct canister.

Let me know if this is still attached to your engine and any more clearer pictures would be appreciated.

[farrellg]

Here is the oil vac oil pump on my 1931 u124. I believe the Zerk does not belong. I believe this is where the vacuum line for the fuel pump would have gone. But I would love to see an original picture of how the line was run.

[Ron Lawson]

That copper oil line looks to be a bit squashed Ron

[wyobob]

Hello Bob, I cant tell from the pictures you sent me if you are missing this or maybe its still there but plugged off. 29 dodgetruck sent me these pics and I am still working on trying to confirm things but I believe at this point that this is what you should be looking for along with the correct canister.

Let me know if this is still attached to your engine and any more clearer pictures would be appreciated.

Mine looks exactly like this , the rear line is capped off. No photos as I would have to remove the carb to get a good shot. I can see where my vacuum tank was mounted, someone threw it away & put that strange electric pump on. I also have found where a 3" square plate? was mounted on the passenger side of the dash, which I believe was where '29 Plymouth serial number plates were fastened. Don't worry, I' m still looking for that frame number.