Avanti Rescue

[SeventhSon]

A few more pics....

[ErnieR]

As long as the nuts aren't rusted too badly you can access all of them except for the one's on the side right at the bracket ends at the bumper. Even if something breaks the bolts are standard bumper bolts i.e. round head with a square underneath to fit in the square hole in the bumper. I would mask the brackets just in case. You could also remove the bumper brackets and all actually pretty simple and will allow you to clean and paint them while the rest of the car is being finished.

I think you will end up very happy with your paint. Silver/gray is a forgiving color and will not magnify the fiberglass imperfections We are so accustomed to seeing high end paint jobs highlighted at shows and on TV we forget that when the car was new the paint was mediocre, at best, by today's standards even for new cars.

I started out thinking I was going to paint the car myself also. If I had stuck to that plan it would still be in bare fiberglass.

Any pictures of the color on a BMW?

ErnieR

Edited September 2, 2013 by ErnieR (see edit history)

[John Byrd]

Ernie, here is a silver Avanti over here in Kailua-Kona! Sorry about the dark shot, I just can't seem to catch HER in the daytime, she's always going the other way, or I'm on the scooter and can't catch up, ha ! John

[SeventhSon]

Thanks John - she's a beauty! The silver I am looking at is very unusual - it almost seems to change color in the light, going from a light silver to almost bronze. When I saw it on the road a couple of weeks ago on a Z4 I said, "That's the color!" My wife liked it a lot too, so it was chosen. I hope it looks good on the Avanti!

Here is a youTube link to a Z4 with the color, and, if I can, a couple of pictures:

2009 BMW Z4 sDrive30i in Orion Silver - YouTube

Well, I better get to it - the trailer will be here in 24 hours to pick her up!

[ErnieR]

Very good choice. The slight bronze cast will go nicely with the beige in the dash and upper interior panels. There aren't many silver 63's and I'm sure there aren't any with your choice of silver. Can't wait to see the car with color on it.

[SeventhSon]

Thanks Ernie - I think it's a good color, I just hope it looks good on an Avanti. We're about to find out!

Today - The Battle of The Century. I knew it was going to be an all day affair - lots of stuff to remove, most of it has never been removed in 50 years. So, it has kind of become attached to its spot on the car. Hence the battle. I started by taking off the vent screen and door and removing the 2 pal nuts holding the "Surercharged" emblem from the side panel in front of the doors. I moved on to the door panels, removing those along with the door handles, interior light switches, door sills, etc. I headed to the front bumper but could not figure out how to remove the bumper and leave the brackets behind. So I removed the corner bolts and figured that MAACO could mask the bumper and paint around it. Hey, they're MAACO, they're used to doing that! I went to the rear bumper, which I knew I had to remove because I have a re-chromed one soon to be coming my way. I hope. So, the real battle of the day became the rear bumper - just about every bolt on the bumper wrung off. Which, as my wife said, "Good!" Out of the way. It became apparent that I would have to remove the rear wheels to reach the corner bumper bolts. So, after going through the work of removing the wheels I was able to get to the corner bumper bolts and promptly wring them off. Which is good. The last Queen of Spades was one of the vertical bumper piece bolts - I had a time getting a socket on the nut inside the bracket so I could remove the bolt holding everything on. After an hour or more of fighting and sweating she gave up and the bumper pieces were off.

I found out that the carpet adhesive I used in the trunk was something akin to Super Glue, holding the carpet tighter than I had ever expected, which kept me from accessing the tail light assembly screws. I finally had to ruin a section of carpet on each side to get to the screws holding the lights. But they're out - the carpet will be fixed later. I removed the tail light lenses and had to get rough with the license plate holder, basically ripping it from its mooring. Not too much damage done - all in all, everything is fixable. After paint is applied to the car. Oh yeah, I also drilled out the "sail" emblems (after I cut one in half)

Whew, I'm whooped!

[SeventhSon]

More....

[Landman]

Thanks John - she's a beauty! The silver I am looking at is very unusual - it almost seems to change color in the light, going from a light silver to almost bronze. When I saw it on the road a couple of weeks ago on a Z4 I said, "That's the color!" My wife liked it a lot too, so it was chosen. I hope it looks good on the Avanti!

Here is a youTube link to a Z4 with the color, and, if I can, a couple of pictures:

2009 BMW Z4 sDrive30i in Orion Silver - YouTube

Well, I better get to it - the trailer will be here in 24 hours to pick her up!

Chris, there was a Studebaker color very close to that, it was called Moonlight Silver. My '64 Hawk was that color. It sort of picked the surrounding shade like a chameleon.

[ErnieR]

I have a suggestion. The quarter windows come out easily and the rubber is readily available ( at least it was 15 year ago... might want to check first ) and an easy replacement so think about slicing the existing rubber as close to the glass as possible so they can get some paint in there. I think there's only 6 Philips head screws holding the whole assembly in if you are feeling up to it.

How about the "A" Pillar stainless and the drip rails? The drip pails and weathersrip come off easily also and the screws go into fiberglass so no rust and everytime you get into the car your eyes will see the mask line. You will need to pry them away from the body because there is caulking between the stainless and the body.

Pull the rubber that goes against the body on the front bumper brackets away from the body and mask them. They may just paint over them no sense risking it.

Also if you can get the rubber insulator out from between the front bumper and the body remove it. Someday you will do the front bumper and the new insulators my not be the exact same size. Personally, I would take a shot at the front bumper. If you unbolt it at the frame and remove all the bracket bolts you can pull yhe front bumper out with the remaining brackets still attached to the bumper. All of the attaching hardware is nut and bolt so if they break you just replace them, no drilling and tapping.

[SeventhSon]

Hey Pat - I like that color! Thanks for those pictures - that is the first Hawk GT I have seen in that color.

Ernie - I took it as far as I could, not sure where it will go from here. When the painter came out to look at it he said he would strip it, as there is serious checking in the old paint. Fair enough. After he retreated into the office and the owner returned he described what would be done, how the jambs and edges would be painted and that the painter advised removing the headlight buckets. The butterflies began to flutter in my stomach - whenever I hear "mission creep" I start getting nervous. One thing leads to another and before you know it I have a car stripped down to the frame and a 20 thousand dollar invoice in my hand. As it is, the "estimate" went up by $700 from Saturday to Monday. Which is what scares me more than anything else, when all I really wanted was a car that looked presentable driving down the street or flying by on the interstate. I don't plan on showing it, trophies don't do anything for me, and I doubt that it will be parked in one spot for long enough for regular folks to nitpick the paint job. Even if it is, I couldn't give a rip if they do.

I am not ashamed to say that I spent the remainder of yesterday and last night with my stomach in knots and unable to really sleep. I wavered between going back first thing this morning and retrieving the old car and bringing her back to the safety of the storage unit. I was utterly convinced that I had made a huge mistake and I was headed down a path that would lead to me losing my beloved car that I had worked on so hard and spent way too much money on. I envisioned the folks tearing the doors off, headlight buckets out, removing the glass (ahhhhhhhhggggghhhh!!!) and telling me at each step that it was necessary to "get a good job". I was at the edge of sanity this morning when my wife reeled me back from the edge, telling me to let it go and not ruin my birthday over it all, that it would be all right, just to keep an eye on it and say no to any extra work. I guess that will have to do - I will pull the plug if it starts straying from the original mission of just getting a fair paint job on it. I already told the owner that it can't go over the quote he was showing me on the computer screen. If they can't get it painted for that then it don't get painted.

For the folks who follow John Feser's thread here, I guess you know that the old girl tried to get away from us as it was sitting on the trailer and John was un-tethering it. A bit of mis-communication (isn't that what causes all catastrophes?) and she was headed for the street. My first reaction was to grab the wheel well lip, right where a small crack resided, leading to a much larger crack. I gave up on stopping it that way and took off running in pursuit, considering pulling the door open and going for the brake (not a good idea, as I may have turned into a speed bump). I opted for grabbing the car at the left rear corner by the tail light and sliding my feet across the pavement, the whole time thinking I wasn't going to be able to stop her. Once she got down off the trailer she slowed considerably and came to a stop. I looked back at John and saw that he had hold of one of the tether straps - so we had a two man braking system going. Tragedy averted. But hours of anguish (most likely self inflicted) lay ahead.

[unimogjohn]

Chris, I felt the same way, but you do it over it and move on. You will love the result. I was impressed with the overall cleanliness of the business too. I have been in places that were dumps. I think you will be happy in the end.

[SeventhSon]

Thanks for the encouragement John - I'll keep my fingers crossed!

[ErnieR]

First of All...Happy Birthday!

I wouldn't worry too much about them suggesting pulling the front and rear glass, they don't want the liability and they can mask around it. The headlight buckets are easy and they can be a source of trapped dirt and a pain to mask off.

As far as spending $700 more for stripping it I think it's worth it and this way the entire prep is in their hands. As such there's no way someone can come back to you and say you did something in the process of stripping the paint that ruined the final job.

I spent 25+ years as a sales manager for new car dealers. I had tons of people ask me to find them cheap used cars explaining to me how they "weren't fussy" and "just needed something for commuting". When I was young and foolish I would actually look for cars for these people and then I would suffer for months with their complaints. It seems that no matter how much they said they were willing to put up with before they wrote a check it all went away afterwards. So, I wised up quickly and stayed away from the cheap car end of the business forever. The manager at MAACO knows that they need to present a paint job that is at a level of quality that they don't have a disappointed customer and doesn't require any do-overs no matter what the customer tells them they are willing to accept.

I give them credit for telling you about the extra charge up front. If they were the type of place to "bounce" you at the end they would have taken your car and hit you with the extra charges on pick up.

Relax and have another piece of Birthday Cake!

[SeventhSon]

Thanks Ernie, for the birthday wishes and your thoughts on things. I always enjoy reading your take on things - very informative. And you're right - folks want what they think they want - until they get it. I just fear the mission creep more than anything. We'll see - I'll let everyone know how it's going right here. And in the meantime I'll take your advice, I'll (try to) relax and I will have that piece of cake.

[avantey]

Happy birthday Chris! Enjoy the cake and relax on the paint job. Your wife is smart (aren't they all? mine's a genius!), you can control the creep by paying close attention. However I have also learned it is only money and I can't take it with me. I put in about twice he original goal on the Hupp engine earlier this year. Still recovering money wise and other projects have taken a hit but when I drive that car it is all smiles and fun!! Worth every penny in the end!

Off to TN Saturday for the Glidden. This means no work on the Avanti this week or the next two but we will see a lot of good folks in Chattanooga and a lot of nice cars. It is always fun to tour!!!

Happy birthday,

[SeventhSon]

Thanks Bill! Yes, my wife is smart and keeps me pointed in the right direction (mostly;)). Have fun in Tennessee and I'll have some more cake!

[SeventhSon]

Hmmm...looks like the last 5 days or so worth of posts have gone AWOL. Ah well...I did see a post from Ernie, which I read on my email, but am just now getting to reply to, as the paying job keeps me running. Ernie mentioned that he would rather do business with a shop that has been a going concern and not to worry too much about the time it will take. As usual, good thinking on Ernie's part - I hadn't even thought about the shop having closed for 6 months and then re-opened. Might be having trouble staying afloat.

[unimogjohn]

Chris, the site was hacked by the Free Syrian Army or something like that. Guess we are pretty important. Anyway, Peter restored it to the last backup, but we lost a couple of days of posts. You have to recreate what you previously did.

[SeventhSon]

Ha! We're in the big time! Back here in the little time, I have been holding the fort down at the job, which has been particularly difficult the last couple of days. The heat and humidity have worn out their welcome for this year as far as I am concerned. Yesterday wore me down, then this morning the brutality continued. About 1 PM I finished the first job of the day, then eyed the next folder. I did the math in my head, half hour for lunch, half hour to get to the site, half hour to set up all the equipment, well that would barely leave enough time to get anything done! So I made the command decision, I'm going to MAACO! And with that I was on my way to the paint shop, AC blasting in the truck. One of my better decisions, I believe.

About half an hour later I rolled into the MAACO lot and as I cruised by the open bays I spied the old girl. Wearing some new primer! I headed into the front office and the owner took me back into the shop. He proudly showed me the progress they had made. I was happy to see the old Avanti and even happier that they were working on her. Half the left side was primed, a fair amount of stripping had been started and the first layers of a repair had been accomplished on the fender crack. I was happy. I met the lady who runs the shop side ( I've gotta get these folks' names) and talked to her for a while about the car and what I had done to the car so far. It was a good visit with the shop owner and foreman (forelady?) - I didn't get to see the painter, he was at lunch. I did notice that some serious overspray of primer had gotten on the exhaust extensions and I pointed that out to the owner. He said he was glad I showed him that - he would ask the painter to mask those. I had thought about removing them, but since they are tied in with the hangers I left them alone. Figured we could cover them with some paper and tape. Didn't happen, but I'm not complaining. I am just happy to see progress - let's keep it going!

One thing I notice, and the shop lady agreed with, was that at one time the car was red! I hadn't noticed any red peeking through anywhere, but there it is under the stripped maroon. Unless it was red primer, but it didn't look like primer. Maybe you can tell from the pics.

Also, I sent an email to Jerry Forrester about the rear bumper re-chrome. He replied this morning and said he wasn't in the shop but would contact me tomorrow. Hopefully with news that the bumper is almost ready?

[SeventhSon]

A few more pics....

[ErnieR]

Looking better already! You will have some clean up to do but the good news is paint doesn't stick well to stainless and chrome so overspray comes off with a little rubbing.

When I stripped mine it was also like looking at a tree's age by the paint layers. I think it was every Avanti color but white and gray at one time.

Glad it's coming together for you ow just try not to kill yourself at work.

ErnieR

[SeventhSon]

Thanks Ernie - I will try to pace myself, especially in the heat. After all, I want to be here to enjoy the Avanti!

Below is a picture of a local Avanti, the one I tried several times to buy. Still sitting out in the weather, deteriorating (I first saw it 10 years ago in the same spot). Oh well, I got the one that was meant for me - happy for it, too.

[ErnieR]

You have an R2 4 speed. Except for R3's and Very late production R2 four speeds you model is the most sought after and most valuable. If that car was anything other than an R 2 4 speed you definitely bought the right one.

[SeventhSon]

You're right Ernie - the car I tried to buy locally is an R2 automatic. And one of the main reasons I bought mine was because it is an R2 4 speed. That basically swayed the decision for me.

[SeventhSon]

Not much to report on the Avanti front. The paint shop has had it for a good 2 weeks and Mr. MAACO keeps mentioning 3 weeks for the paint job. So, maybe another week? I plan on a visit to the shop, hopefully tomorrow since I will be in the same county working. Maybe I can slip by at lunch.

Good news on the rear bumper that I sent away for re-chroming - it's boxed up and ready to come home! I sent the check this morning, so I will await with anticipation. Maybe the bumper and the car will come home at the same time? I hope so - I miss the old Avanti.

Last weekend there was a All Stock Drag racing event in Michigan which drew a few Studebakers. Nimesh Solanki and his brother Deepish made the trip from Georgia to the track hauling Nimesh's very nice Avanti for its first tryout on the strip. Did pretty well too - turned about 13 seconds flat at about 112 MPH. The car is an R3 clone and has monster horsepower (it dyno'ed at 500 HP), but getting traction is the problem. Tires spinning all the way down the track - if they could get the rear tires to stick Nimesh may have to install a parachute on the back, because he would be flying. I had a chance to go, but I passed up on the chance - I won't let that happen again. I'll make my hotel reservations for next year before the end of this year. My brother Brian sent me the link below, which includes some of the participants discussing the races along with some pictures. Looks like a lot of fun to me!

racingstudebakers.com/foo/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2910

[SeventhSon]

Well, a disappointing visit to the paint shop today. I dropped by at lunch today, hopeful that much progress would have been made in the week since I last stopped in. The car hasn't been touched that I can tell. The picture below is from last week - the only difference today was that the floor jack was gone. I guess they needed it somewhere else. When I saw that nothing had been done I said, "Well, I guess I'll call the tow truck." Mr. MAACO implored me to leave the car where it is and they would get to work on it right away. Back and forth we went, I was an inch from calling the tow truck. The MAACO man convinced me to give him to next Friday to have it done - he said he would work the painter late at night and on Saturday. As I left I told him that I was going to come by every day - I don't care what it takes to get there. And I will. I tried the path of giving them "space", now I will be in there every day to remind them to keep working on it. So, we will see.

Halfway home I pulled off the road and called him and said I was coming to pick it up - I was serious. He talked me out of it again, saying that when the painter came back from lunch he told him to get on it and to give him a couple of days to show progress and if there was none then I could tow her out. We'll see....

[unimogjohn]

Chris, count to ten and breathe deep. This too shall pass. At least you know that they want to keep your business and will do a good job. I would not jump the gun here, you may have trouble finding someone who will do the job right at your price. Be patient.

[Bill Stoneberg]

Chris, You have to understnd that there is a difference in painters and bodymen. They go at their own speed for the most part.

I know you are p'od about it but as John said count to 10.

[John Byrd]

And Chris, to add my 2 cents wort, there are VERY few painters (or other craftsmen) that would be glad to take on a job that was taken to someone else first. Your price may escalate quite a bit if you do that. John's and Bill's advice above is good. I bet it will turn out fine.

[SeventhSon]

Thanks for your input, folks. All valid and well taken. I feel it boils down to expectations - Mr. MAACO told me 3 weeks at the beginning, which means I expect him to hit that mark, give or take a couple of days. Same with quoted price, although I would hold back on the plus or minus (it will always be plus). I was just very disappointed to see nothing had been done in a week and I let him know that. He has thus far responded with work being done. I feel like I reached him (knock on wood) and we can move forward. It will probably still run a week past what he promised.

And John mentioned price - it's MAACO for crying out loud! I think they are charging enough.

Edited September 21, 2013 by SeventhSon (see edit history)

[SeventhSon]

So, today I began my daily visits to the paint shop. It is a P.I.T.A. to drive there every day, but at the same time I find it comforting to see the old car and "visit" her. Sounds weird, I know, but I spent a lot of time with that old car. I'm sort of attached to it.

I was gratified to see more progress has been made - looks like the body man is working on the difficult side first. The area that was basically exposed fiberglass on the driver's door has been fixed. So has the big fender well crack. So, one side has been primed - we're getting there. The right side of the car doesn't seem to have the damage that the left side of the car had. I like seeing the progress. I talked with the owner a bit and I feel like he has taken my concerns to heart, so I have calmed down a bit. Still nervous, but maybe I can allay some of that by visiting every day. I like that about the owner, too - he says to drop by anytime. Open door policy. So I will take him up on that.

[SeventhSon]

Another day - another visit to the paint shop. More progress, I am happy to see. When I entered the shop I immediately saw where the trunk lid had been primed. I'm very happy to see they are working on it and getting it stripped, sanded and covered in primer. I had another nice chat with the owner - seems to be a very amiable fellow and wants to do a good job. I asked him to tell the painter that I appreciated the work he was doing and I was happy with the progress. He said he would and thanked me for the comment. They've come a long way in the last few days - I hope they can keep at it.

[Roger Zimmermann]

Does the front bumper not prevent to have a nice job in that location? I would remove it.

[Yellowriv]

Chris, I've been enjoying this thread and your great enthusiasm since you started it.

I've restored/refurbished a number of cars and I'm with Roger, I suggest you remove the front bumper, you'll regret it if you don't.

Regards

John

[SeventhSon]

Thanks Roger and John. We had some discussion about that at the shop and I am just concerned about getting the bumper brackets off without having to take the radiator out (which means having to take the hood off, the fan off, the fan shroud off. and the radiator and hoses off. All of which could lead to something breaking.) There are two bolts on each side holding the bumper brackets on. One bolt on each side has the radiator behind it, but maybe I could remove the nuts from the bolts and bend the bracket out away from the bolts.

When I first got the car one bolt on each side had been sheared off - very strange actually, but I figured someone in the past had started to remove the bumper and had wrung off one bolt on each side and then abandoned the plan. So I put new bolts in those spots when I had the radiator out.

If anybody out there has experience removing the front bumper and thinks I can get away with bending the brackets away from the bolts then I will call the paint shop and tell them to remove it. I know the painter wants it out of the way.

[unimogjohn]

Chris, it is not difficult. You have to take off the two short arms that go to the fenders, and then you take out the four bolts, two each side, on the frame. Then the two side arms come off and you then pull the bumper straight out with the long arms still attached. If they have it up in the air it should only take fifteen to thirty minutes to do.

[SeventhSon]

All right John - I'll talk to them about it today and see what can be done. Thanks

[avantey]

Chris- Your car is coming along fine by the look in the pictures, just never fast enough for an owner! Well, we got home Saturday about 5 after two weeks on the road. Came by your area Saturday about noon and was going to stop and check out your car but didn't know where MAACO was . Only kidding, we had to get home and unpack, etc. Didn't get to do that until Sunday as it was raining here but got all the unpacking done and even mowed the lawn in the afternoon! Went back to work today.....

The Glidden was great, Chickamauga Region did a very good job. It was very hot, very hilly at times and a lot of fun touring. The Model A ran great after the work I did but did not like the heat. I learned you could vapor lock an A- had never done it before, never heard of it and did not really think it was possible on a gravity feed fuel system. But grinding up a couple of hills or in traffic in that heat (93/90+humid) it did it a few times. I found by richening the mixture I could pretty well overcome it but it was a lesson learned. Only used less than a gallon of water all week though and no oil all over after the new front seal, yeah!!

Now it is back to work, reading the threads and doing Fall things around here. Oh, and Hershey in a couple of weeks! I have decided I will get new sneakers for the Avanti at Hershey and will powder coat the rims in the process as they are pretty shabby. I will repeat myself here and say that the ride north up the Shenandoah Valley is one of the prettiest in the country. Form the more narrow valley in Roanoke thru New Market and spreading out by Winchester it very pretty country you guys get to play in!

Keep after the paint job and it will be done soon!

[SeventhSon]

Hey Bill, welcome home! Sounds like you had a great time, except for the heat and humidity (bleah). And you are right , the Shenandoah Valley is one pretty place! I lived there for many years until I moved closer in to the job center area. We still ride out to enjoy the beauty as often as we can.

I tried to go see the old Avanti today but started out late afternoon, which is a mistake around here. I ended up in a big traffic backup, so I turned around and headed to the office. I did call the MAACO man and he said the painter had worked on the car all day. He said he thought it looked very good and that I should come by tomorrow for a look. I will most definitely. I told him that some folks were advising me to get the front bumper off and he said they were going to look at it and see if they could get it off. We'll know more tomorrow.

[SeventhSon]

Today was the first day I haven't been in the field lugging around surveying equipment and pounding stakes in the ground in quite a while. Felt kind of strange being inside again, but two jobs came in so I will be back outside and at it again before I know it. I took the chance to head out a lunchtime to make a run to the paint shop. Things are coming along - I actually got to see the guy who is working on my Avanti, who I seemed to miss the last half dozen times I've been there. Turns out he is just the "body man" and not the painter. His name is Juan. I was curious about the "graffiti" on the car and asked about it. Juan and A.J. (the owner, see, I'm getting to know these folks, we will probably be exchanging Christmas cards by the time it's over) began to explain, and I think I understand, but I cannot relay it here because I don't know the terminology to use, it won't come to me. Basically to check the smoothness of the primed surface, I believe. Maybe not. Maybe someone just got giddy with a spray can and sprayed my car.

Juan went on to tell me that he wants to take the doors off, the hood off, the trunk lid off. I said the same thing a person who is on horseback might say when the horse is bolting toward the top of a cliff. "Whoa!" I told Juan that it wasn't going to be a show car, but a driver. I think I got through to him, despite the language difference. We discussed the front bumper and I told him to be careful with the bolts that line up on the side of the radiator - don't take a hammer and try to drive the bolts out and into the radiator. Again, I think I reached him. I turned to A.J. and made sure that the doors, etc. will stay on the car. He assured me that they would. I hope so. I can't wait to get my car back so I can sleep again.

Juan also told me he needs more time. How much? The rest of the week. Fine. A.J. said he'll know more on Thursday and let me know. I can't wait.